Welcome login | signup
Language en es fr
OccupyForum

Forum Post: Tiny House Living, Off the Grid? Here's How to Do it in Style

Posted 3 months ago on April 12, 2014, 4:42 p.m. EST by LeoYo (5854)
This content is user submitted and not an official statement

Tiny House Living, Off the Grid? Here's How to Do it in Style

Saturday, 12 April 2014 00:00
By Cat Johnson, Yes! Magazine | Op-Ed

http://www.truth-out.org/opinion/item/23057-tiny-house-living-off-the-grid-heres-how-to-do-it-in-style

LaMar Alexander grew up in a homesteading family. For him, self-sufficiency, including gardening, raising animals and "doing for ourselves" was normal and necessary. He tried city life after college, but says he felt like a slave to a house, bills and employers. At 35, he made a change.

"I had a wake up call," he explains, "that made me realize that what I really wanted was a simple homestead cabin and to eliminate my dependence on the system, so I could live sustainably while I pursued my dreams."

So Alexander built a house. A very small, 14 ft. x 14 ft. house. A solar and wind powered off-the-grid cabin with a kitchen, bathroom and living room downstairs and a bedroom and office upstairs. It cost him $2,000 to build not including the recycled doors and windows, the front porch, and the solar system.

Being an avid outdoorsman, Alexander didn't need a lot of indoor space, but as an author, videographer, and off-the-grid builder, he did need modern amenities including a cell phone, Internet access, electric lights, indoor toilet, and shower etc., and he has them. Alexander says his tiny house is easy to clean, cheap to heat and cool, and he has no house payments or monthly utility bills.

"I now have the freedom to pursue my dreams," he says, "and the money I make stays in my pocket and can be used for vacations or to help my family and for a secure retirement. That is the freedom that an off-grid lifestyle makes possible."

Alexander is part of a growing movement of tiny housers. The options for going tiny are growing. In fact, tiny house villages are even being tested as solutions to homelessness. Within the tiny house movement, there's a contingent who are taking the simplicity, sustainability and freedom of tiny houses to the next level by building their tiny homes off the power grid.

Shareable connected with four experienced, off-the-grid tiny housers to find out how they made the move to living off-the-grid in a tiny house; what challenges they face; how they handle practical matters like electrical, sewage and water; what someone considering off-the-grid living should know; and the benefits of living tiny and off-the-grid.

Contributing to the conversation are Laura LaVoie, who, along with her partner Matt, built an off-the-grid tiny house in the mountains of North Carolina. She also authored the book 120 Ideas for Tiny Living and blogs about tiny house living at Life in 120 Square Feet; Merete Mueller who, along with her partner Christopher, built a 130 square foot, off-the-grid tiny house and documented the experience in the film Tiny: a Story About Living Small; and Alexander, who has produced several books and videos about going off-the-grid, and writes about off-the-grid living at Simple Solar Homesteading.

Benefits, challenges, and legalities

Tiny house, off-the-grid living is a good way to reduce your ecological footprint, save money—"Our bills for energy and water are zero dollars," explains LaVoie—and simplify life down to the things that truly matter.

"One benefit to tiny house living," says Mueller, "is that it frees up the money, time and energy that would otherwise be spent on maintaining a house and rent or a mortgage, to be used on other things, like working on creative projects, starting a business, spending time with friends and family, or on other hobbies that bring a lot of satisfaction to one's life."

She points out that with tiny house, off-the-grid living, the drawbacks can be the same as the benefits.

"One obvious challenge is a minimal amount of space inside," she says, "But one benefit related to that is being forced to spend more time outside, and being forced to simplify possessions and think about which things matter most."

Emptying the composting toilet, hauling water and the other "challenges" that come with tiny, off-the-grid living were, for Mueller, part of the allure. "We wanted to know and understand," she says, "exactly how much water we were consuming."

Alexander says that the biggest challenges involve government regulations and "burdensome codes." He also mentions outside interference from neighbors and businesses in the area, securing an adequate water supply, and, if you live in a rural area, isolation and making money in a rural economy.

Regarding zoning issues, all three recommend talking with local authorities as regulations are different in different counties, towns, and even neighborhoods. Mueller suggests calling your local town office to ask questions before making any long-term plans. She also advises getting to know your neighbors.

"In many places with restrictions, those rules will only apply if the neighbors choose to report you or are somehow offended by your situation," she explains. "So getting to know your neighbors early on, explaining to them your motivations for choosing this lifestyle, and how all of your utilities work, can help to avoid that from happening." She adds, "It's good to develop allies early on."

Generally, the closer you are to a city the more rules there are to follow. Because of this, off-the-gridders often choose to live in rural areas in counties that want to increase their tax base and may be more open to alternative structures. Alexander lists Colorado, Oklahoma, Alaska, Wyoming, Arkansas, and Missouri as some of the states that promote off-the-grid living.

126 Comments

126 Comments


Read the Rules
[-] 3 points by Shule (1696) 3 months ago

Ever read Hanry David Thoreau's "Walden" ?

[-] 2 points by LeoYo (5854) 3 months ago

No, I haven't.

[-] 4 points by Shule (1696) 3 months ago

Good read. I highly recommend it. Thoreau writes about living off grid in a little cabin in the woods. He wrote a good essay on civil disobedience too.

[-] 1 points by LeoYo (5854) 3 months ago

Taking a tiny house off-the-grid

There's a direct relationship between tiny houses and off-the-grid living. Having a life with less stuff and more experiences is a big driver of the tiny house movement. Going off-the-grid allows tiny house dwellers to take that simplicity even further.

For LaVoie, the connection between tiny houses and off-the-grid living is one of personal preference.

"The beauty of the tiny house movement is that there isn't a one-size-fits-all solution for everyone who wants to go tiny," she says. "With the right resources someone can be connected to the grid if they want to. Otherwise, the smaller the house the less energy it needs to run efficiently, so off-grid systems are an easy match."

Mueller points out that there's a DIY element that connects the tiny house and off-the-grid movements.

"Not everyone builds their own tiny house, but certainly a very high percentage of people do," she says. "This means that people living in tiny houses have a greater understanding of how their homes and their utilities work, which is conducive to off-grid living. Tiny housers often like the idea of being self-sufficient and environmentally sustainable, and it's certainly much easier to heat and power a tiny house through off-grid methods than a larger, more traditional house."

She adds that because many tiny houses are built on wheels—a necessity to bypass building codes—they can't use traditional utilities (a septic system for example), so off-grid methods are often used even if the house is parked in a location with access to the grid.

How much does it cost?

The consensus on how much a tiny, off-the-grid house costs is: it depends. Variables include whether you build the house yourself; how you choose to heat it; how much you spend on off-the-grid energy sources; whether you want to go super-simple or have a luxurious, off-the-grid tiny house. Here's what LaVoie, Mueller and Alexander had to say about building their tiny houses:

LaVoie: We worked with an online company called the Alt-E store and put together a solar power package that was exactly what we wanted. It included two 245 watt panels, a 45 amp charge controller, and three 110 amp hour AGM batteries. We also use an 1800 watt inverter that we already owned. We were able to purchase all of this for around $2,000. The only other investment we made for our off-the-grid lifestyle was our Berkey water filter which cost around $300.

It costs us $0 a month for electricity, heat, and water in our tiny house. There are, of course some other minor costs but paying nothing for energy helps to offset those. For instance, since I work for myself I pay for my own health insurance. We, of course, have phone and internet bills. There is some small cost for fuel like propane and butane but it is really less than about $20 a month.

Mueller: [The cost] completely depends, but in our case when our tiny house was parked in an off-grid location, we only had to purchase a small propane tank once every few months for heating and we purchased water, which we hauled up in large jugs. Our solar system is a pre-made unit called a Sol Man (manufactured by a company called Sol-Solutions) and cost about $5,000. It cost us about $26,000 to build our tiny house, but people have built similar tiny houses for much more and much less, depending on how they were sourcing their materials and the amount of building experience they have.

Alexander: That all depends on what lifestyle the person wants. You can be a minimalist and go without any electricity using wood stoves or propane for heat and candles and lanterns for light, and a basic yurt, cabin or other house style. Or, you can build a very high-tech green home with the latest Leed's sustainability guidelines, which can be very expensive.

Older homes can be remodeled for off-the-grid efficiency or there are many small off-grid cabin designs like mine that people can use and modify to fit their needs. The style of the house may be modest or expensive depending on what you want.

My cabin cost under $2,000 to build and about $5,000 for the off-grid system and I believe a smaller off-grid home under 400 square feet that is very efficient and also nice and comfortable to live in can be built for under $20,000, and much less if people are using recycled materials and doing the work themselves. Land, water and a power system are not included in that figure because they vary greatly depending on your needs, the area, and where you want to live.

Options for generating electricity

One option for electricity is to go without. Alexander explains that one quarter of the world's homes do not have a grid electricity connection.

"People survived and thrived just fine before electricity came along," he says, "and still can if you are willing to do things by hand and go without much of the entertainment that people think they need to survive."

If going without is not an option, there are several options for generating electricity for an off-the-grid house, but solar is the most affordable. At approximately $1 per watt you can have an inexpensive system for basic power needs for under $5,000. Solar also works in cloudy conditions and snowy areas.

Wind is another option, but wind turbines are expensive and only work when the wind blows. If you have access to a river or stream, you could look into hydro power for generating some of your electricity.

Both Alexander and LaVoie advise doing a lot of research before you invest in anything. LaVoie recommends getting an energy meter before making any decisions to figure out what your electrical needs are. Alexander says the best tip he can give is to first study how you can greatly reduce your power consumption using more efficient appliances and non-power using appliances.

"Heat, cooling and refrigeration are the main power consumers in any house," he explains, "so off-grid houses use wood stoves, propane heat, fans, passive cooling and alternative power fridges to take those appliances out of the system. Once you eliminate those appliances from your power needs," he continues, "you can use a very small solar system for everything else."

Alexander's current system is 580 watts solar, a 400 watt wind turbine, and propane for heating and cooking with a wood stove back-up. He does passive cooling with fans, porches, overhangs and trees, and refrigeration is done using a converted freezer run off solar.

[Removed]

[-] 1 points by LeoYo (5854) 3 months ago

It's amusingly obvious to everyone viewing these posts you don't care who LaMar is.

[-] 3 points by gnomunny (6641) from St Louis, MO 3 months ago

There's a whole lot of things Zen doesn't care about outside his extremely narrow worldview. Reality, for one.

[Removed]

[Removed]

[-] 1 points by LeoYo (5854) 3 months ago

I find it rather curious that you only care to make false accusations that make you look only as intelligent as a republican.

[Removed]

[-] 1 points by LeoYo (5854) 3 months ago

How to get water

Finding a water source is one of those things that you're going to want to research before you buy land. Most counties require an approved source such as a city water connection, a professionally drilled well, or a cistern tank with a delivery system. Drilling a well can be expensive, so find out what your options are. Hand-drilled, shallow wells and rainwater catchment can be used for agricultural purposes, but these generally don't meet county codes.

Alexander, who has a hand-drilled well and a 300 foot deep Artesian well, warns that if you're using rainwater to supplement household usage, it must be filtered and treated to make it safe for consumption. He explains that giardia is a "real problem" with rain water but it is safe for washing clothes and flushing toilets.

LaVoie counts herself lucky that the land they bought has a running spring. She adds that you can also purchase water, but cautions that the costs begins to add up. She says that the thing that she is the most proud of is their conservation of water.

"The average American household can use over 200 gallons of water a day depending on the number of people in the home," she says. "In our tiny house, Matt and I use a total of five gallons a day, not including drinking water. We have an air pressurized shower sprayer that holds two gallons of hot water and is plenty to ensure that we are clean." She adds that one of the biggest culprits for water use in a traditional household is flushing the toilet.

The lowdown on the toilet

Outhouses are a proven solution for dealing with human excrement, but composting toilets offer a solution that can be brought indoors, have all the comforts of the modern toilet, and are allowed in many rural areas. Another solution is a conventional septic tank or, where allowed, a leach pond.

Alexander and LaVoie both recommend the book The Humanure Handbook: a Guide to Composting Human Manure by Joseph C. Jenkins for getting the facts about all things poop. LaVoie uses a dry composting, sawdust toilet that she describes as "easy to manage." She adds that there are commercially available composting systems, but they can get pricey. Alexander designed and built a solar enhanced composting toilet that keeps the microbes at a higher temperature so they work faster to compost the waste.

"If you eliminate gray water from your tank," he says, "you do not need a leach field and there is nothing left over but some dry composted material when the process is complete." The plans for his toilet are in his book Off the Grid.

How to handle garbage, recycling, mail, internet

Another question that arises is, if you're off-the-grid, how do you deal with details such as garbage, recycling, mail and internet. The consensus here is to use the local dump for garbage and recycling and set up a P.O. box or a mailbox at a UPS store if there's one nearby, or just use a mailbox on the road.

There are other options as well. Most household waste can be composted or incinerated in rural areas. Alexander explains that most rural people have an incinerator barrel and what is left over is hauled off occasionally. He adds that the key is reusing or repurposing everything possible.

"Everything gets recycled at my place," he says, "and all wood and metal is held on to for other projects or sent to the scrap yard for someone else to use."

Internet access is available through a cell phone hotspot or a satellite system. If T.V. is a must-have, satellite T.V. works everywhere and with Internet access, you can get Netflix, Hulu etc.

The big picture on tiny, off-the-grid living

The big picture takeaway on becoming an off-the-grid tiny houser is that there are countless possibilities when it comes to building a home that's right for you. Making the move requires a big, hands-on commitment, but it's a lifestyle change that, according to LaVoie, can be personally fulfilling.

"I think it is especially important for everyone to recognize that there isn't one right way to live simply or off-grid," she says. "Tiny house living shouldn't be viewed as a competition or that someone is doing it better than anyone else. The most important thing is to live in a way that is comfortable for you." She adds, "Always make sure you enjoy the adventure."

This piece was reprinted by Truthout with permission or license.

[-] 0 points by flip (6379) 3 months ago

did you see the film "the garbage warrior" - here is a bit of an interview - you can get the whole thing at democracynow.org - AMY GOODMAN: We’re broadcasting from Los Alamos, New Mexico, the birthplace of the Nuclear Age. I’m Amy Goodman. The atomic bombs used in World War II were designed and developed here. Well, today, some residents of New Mexico are trying to atone for the history of war. We turn right now to Mike Reynolds. At the forefront of those who are creating more sustainable ways of living is the visionary once-architect, Michael Reynolds. He’s creating radically sustainable living options through a process called "Earthship Biotecture." The solar homes are created from natural and recycled materials, including aluminum cans, plastic bottles and used tires. These off-the-grid homes minimize their reliance on public utilities and fossil fuels by harnessing their energy from the sun, also from wind turbines. We were driving along—from Durango, Colorado, to Taos, New Mexico, when we saw this remarkable collection, a fascinating collection, of structures scattered through the sage brush along the road. We pulled over and found Mike Reynolds consulting with a carpenter. He brought us into one of the first houses he built. He’s been documented in a documentary called Garbage Warrior. And he gave us a tour of one of the sustainable-living homes he created. MICHAEL REYNOLDS: Greenhouse, which is a buffer zone for the house, to make the house stay warmer, hold its heat longer. The plants eat the sewage and provide food. And so, it just creates a whole different environment, a tropical environment, out of the super-cold desert, high desert environment. AMY GOODMAN: So the house is a jungle? MICHAEL REYNOLDS: Yeah, it’s pretty much, mostly, 50 percent, a jungle. We usually have bananas. We just harvested bananas here. This is tilapia. You can fish here. My eight-year-old grandson just did it on camera; he caught a fish here in like 30 seconds. And we grow them for protein. We have chickens out there. And so, the idea with this is to show that you can produce food, as enough to stay alive, in your own home. AMY GOODMAN: And what is in—what is in these pillars of the house? MICHAEL REYNOLDS: This is just holding up this little chamber up here that’s going to be a hot tub. AMY GOODMAN: And what are these materials, though? MICHAEL REYNOLDS: Those are just beer cans laid in cement, like bricks. AMY GOODMAN: And bottles. MICHAEL REYNOLDS: Beer cans and bottles laid in cement. AMY GOODMAN: And why beer cans and bottles? MICHAEL REYNOLDS: Because they’re natural bricks that every—they’re indigenous to the entire planet, and they’re all over the world. But this is the—see this? This stays this temperature year-round, no matter what. AMY GOODMAN: This is a sort of a moist, warm, cool. MICHAEL REYNOLDS: Yeah. AMY GOODMAN: All at once. MICHAEL REYNOLDS: In the wintertime, this feels warm; in the summertime, it feels cool. AMY GOODMAN: And this is made with the back— MICHAEL REYNOLDS: All the walls are made with—all these interior walls, except for—some of them are cans, but most of the walls are the tires pounded with earth. AMY GOODMAN: And why tires? MICHAEL REYNOLDS: Because tires are indigenous to the entire planet. When you beat dirt into them, they hold temperature and stabilize—stabilize the temperature, basically. AMY GOODMAN: And so, all the back walls are made of these tires. And where do you get tires? MICHAEL REYNOLDS: From the tire stores. They have to pay to take them to the dumps. AMY GOODMAN: How many tires are there? Where do you—I mean— MICHAEL REYNOLDS: Oh, there’s—we have a deal with the county. We have thousands of tires. Hello? AMY GOODMAN: My goodness. We’re going into the bathroom right now. MICHAEL REYNOLDS: Hello? OK, we’re going to go in and out of the [inaudible]. AMY GOODMAN: OK, we’re going into the bathroom. Can you describe this bathroom to us? MICHAEL REYNOLDS: Well, the bathroom is just—it’s sort of in the jungle. It’s a sculpted bathtub. The toilet flushes into the septic system, which runs back into the planters. And the planters use it all. The sewage system is totally contained. AMY GOODMAN: So why doesn’t it stink? MICHAEL REYNOLDS: Well, it’s biology. Sewage doesn’t have to stink if you understand biology. Like, there’s a lot of things in nature that are really rancid, but nature takes care of it. And we’re just taking nature’s advice on how to deal with sewage rather than dumping raw sewage into a bay or an ocean. AMY GOODMAN: Does this break rules? MICHAEL REYNOLDS: Oh, yeah. AMY GOODMAN: What are the rules it breaks? MICHAEL REYNOLDS: Every one of them. It’s just—there are codes and rules. Now, we got variances, and we’ve got things in place. But the codes and rules are so stringent and so rigid that they are—they make it so we have to evolve very slowly as we try to break these—try to evolve these rules. And this—we’re on a planet now that is changing rapidly. And humans have to evolve rapidly to be able to stay alive on this planet. And the rules and the codes keep us from evolving rapidly. And I was pushing it too hard; that’s why they took my license. I’m trying to get us evolving faster. Yeah, I might make a mistake, and there might be a smell or something, but look at the mistakes they made with atomic energy. You know, that’s killing people and destroying continents. So—

[Removed]

[-] 0 points by shoozTroll (17632) 3 months ago

Hmmmm, even smaller than a mobile home, but less comfortable.

How do you work out whether to anchor them firmly against tornados, or having good floating balance in a flood?

[Removed]

[-] 2 points by LeoYo (5854) 3 months ago

Wow, we certainly can't slip one past you.


"Lamar Alexander is a long time Homesteader and author that lives off-grid in the 14x14 solar cabin he built for under $2000. His cabin power comes from a small 570 watt solar and wind system which runs his lights, water pump, TV, laptop, and other gadgets. The cabin includes a rain water and gray water harvesting system and he hand drilled his own water well. He uses a solar composting toilet of his own design for handling waste. Propane is used for a small 20,000 BTU heater, fridge and on-demand water heater."

"LaMar also uses many passive solar features in his cabin including solar air heaters, a solar water heater, solarium porch, and passive cooling. With no house payments and no monthly utility bills LaMar has been able to leave the 9-5 rat race and now runs a small part time business and spends most of his time pursuing his hobbies of fishing, gardening and writing books."

"If you are interested in a simple solar homesteading life LaMar has a new book titled 'Off the Grid' that is 355 pages full of his designs and detailed step-by-step plans for building a solar cabin, solar composting toilet, solar air and water heaters and teaches you how to hand drill a water well and make your life and homestead sustainable."

website for more information: http://www.simplesolarhomesteading.com/

contact LaMar at: lamar5292 @ yahoo.com


Who knew that a guy living in a cabin in Utah

http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=lamar+alexander+off+the+grid&qpvt=lamar+alexander+off+the+grid&FORM=VDRE

is actually the senior senator of Tennessee whose $174,000 a year job requires him to reside in Washington DC while having his home residence in Tennessee.

http://www.bing.com/images/search?q=LaMar+Alexander&qpvt=LaMar+Alexander&FORM=IGRE

You should share with Truthout on how you've really dug deep on the matter of just who the person they interviewed really is. Just imagine how stupid they'll feel upon finding out they had actually interviewed a US senator and didn't even know it.

[Removed]

[-] -2 points by LeoYo (5854) 3 months ago

Wow, all of that from his little cabin in Utah.


Have you always lived so frugally/minimally? What was your life before living in a 14×14 cabin?

I had two very different lifestyles before building the cabin. My folks were born in the Great Depression 20s and raised 9 kids through 3 wars. I was the youngest. My folks never had much money but they learned to homestead from their folks and we gardened, raised animals, fished and hunted for most of our food. People probably thought we was poor but we never went without anything and our clothes and house was always clean. That is how I learned to build and do for myself because it was expected. Money was for saving for an emergency and you made do and kept things running until they couldn’t be fixed anymore. Then I went away to college and earned a Masters degree in Health Ed. and an assoc. in architectural drafting. I was not interested in making money and hated working for other people and had been working full time since I was 15 so I wanted to start a small business. I ended up marrying a woman with two kids and that changed the plans with all the bills and she was used to a different lifestyle so we had to have a new car and a big house and all the stuff that goes with it. That always ate at me and I felt like I was a slave to the system and started resenting my job and all the stuff that kept me tied down and broke. Eventually that cost me my marriage.

It was after that I took a long hard look at myself and what I wanted in life and all I wanted was a simple homestead and a small business and a sustainable lifestyle with minimal stress. That is how I come to build the cabin, simplify my life and start writing and pursuing my business ideas.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?list=PL34F7ECFEEB05659B&v=FacIm3bHbYc&feature=player_embedded

Many people have spouses and/or kids. How do you think people with large households could manage such a small space?

I have a girlfriend and she has her own place in town. We get together on weekends and travel a lot. She has stayed with me many times and likes the cabin but she is tied to her place and bills. My son used to stay with me each summer and helped me in my business and he still loves to come visit and stay at the cabin because it is peaceful here. I think families actual do better in smaller houses because it makes them more considerate and young children like to be close to their family and they are more involved with each other. My folks raised 9 kids and never had more than a 3 bedroom house. They just spread us out so when the older kids were moving out the younger kids were being born.

Not everyone will be able to sustain themselves through writing books or via a website (as you have done so well at). Do you have ideas for how others might be able to “live off the grid” and still meet their financial obligations?

I talk a lot in my book and videos about having multiple streams of income and that way if one stream dries up you still have money coming in while you get something else going. I always suggest people start with their talents as a way to start a business. For me I had the teaching experience and had managed a business for other people so my books and videos are just an extension of that talent. I teach people as I am learning.

I also had a local pest control business until I hurt my back and I have a music CD published and I am just getting into game design. If you are creative or artistic there is lots of room on the web for new businesses but the real work is in developing a following of people that not only want your product but actually care about you because you care about them.

The internet has really opened up opportunities for people to be independent and run a business and there are also lots of opportunities for selling stuff you make or grow from your homestead or there are always people needing handymen, painters, landscapers. One of the fastest areas is in home care for the elderly so a nursing certificate would get you started and rural areas really need caring people to help the elderly stay in their homes.

Are their any states and areas that are particularly friendly to “off-griders” such as yourself and are more loose on building codes?

It has changed recently and CA used to be very friendly to off-gridders but now it wants that tax revenue from bigger houses. I would say Colorado, Arkansas, Wyoming, Alaska, Washington and Oklahoma are probably more tolerant and it really depends on the county. Counties want people to move there to increase their tax base so rural counties without many people are more likely to allow off-grid homes and have fewer building codes and enforcement.

If I may – how much are your utility bills per month? (summer/winter)

I am not hooked to the grid for power and produce my own electricity but for a small furnace and stove I use propane and that price all depends on what is going on in the country. I average about $60 a month in coldest part of winter but that drops to less than $10 a month for about 9 months out of the year. I can reduce that by using my wood stove but if I am away from the cabin I use the furnace so the stuff in the cabin doesn’t freeze.

The cabin is really well insulated and in the day time the furnace never kicks on. We may get -20 here in winter. The heat rises so my bedroom is upstairs where it is warmer and the dogs sleep downstairs where it stays cooler.

What’s your biggest challenge to living in a smaller space and being “off the grid”?

The biggest challenge was water at first. I hand drilled a well but it was not enough for everything so I made a deal with a brother to tap into his well. Without water you can’t raise a garden or animals and won’t make it. You can harvest rain water if it rains and I am very conservative with water and I recycle gray water for my garden and fruit trees.

The only other challenge has been from outsiders and Government getting in my business and the oil companies trying to take over the whole area. I have been fighting them all along. I like the smallness of the cabin and it is easier to clean, cheap to heat and cool and hardly costs anything for taxes so no complaints about that.

Do you have any advice for folks wanting to live a similar lifestyle as you but are afraid to make the leap?

I think it is easier for a single person or young couple with maybe young kids to get started although retired people also love homesteading and off-grid living. If the kids are raised in a small house they are very comfortable but transitioning to a small house from a big house is more stressful as some of your stuff is going to have to go away.

You do not have to live like a pauper in a small house. I have internet, cellphone, TV, electricity, heat just like everyone else, I just don’t have a house payment and monthly utility bills and that allows me to keep more of the money I make and not need as much money and I can afford to take vacations, buy better stuff, help my family and I have a secure retirement with a sustainable lifestyle and I have freedom. Freedom from stress over losing a job. Freedom to choose what I want to do and when I want to do it and freedom to pursue my dreams!

[Removed]

[-] -1 points by LeoYo (5854) 3 months ago

Oh please do contact them immediately and post their reply at the forum for all of our amusement.

[Removed]

[-] -1 points by LeoYo (5854) 3 months ago

It's bad enough being a liar, but a cowardly liar...that's just pathetic! Are you really trying to pretend you don't know the difference between two people of the same name leading two completely different lives or is everyone really supposed to believe that you're really as stupid as you're appearing to be?

[Removed]

[-] 1 points by LeoYo (5854) 3 months ago

I don't need to post a pic of anyone. I posted an article that featured an interview with 3 people, none of them referred to as "Senator" or dealing with a subject one would expect a senator to engage in. YOU are the ONLY supposedly confused person who couldn't realize that. NO ONE ELSE on this forum has been confused about it. Now you wanna claim that it's somehow a Republican plant??? A conspiracy with Truthout???

If I didn't know any better, I'd have to conclude that YOU are a Republican plant sent here to make Democrats look stupid but I already know that just like Democrats, a Republican would never be able to pretend to oppose their own perspectives for very long. So that means that you actually are as you appear to be which is far more worse no matter what you actually represent.

[Removed]

[-] 0 points by LeoYo (5854) 3 months ago

I never knew or cared and still don't care who the senior senator of Tennessee is. YOU'RE the one who went out of your way to bring him to mine and other people's attention. You found time to do that but somehow you want everyone to believe that you didn't have the time to click on a couple of links that clearly showed two different men.

[Removed]

[-] 1 points by LeoYo (5854) 3 months ago

I'm sure it was and remains quite clear to EVERYONE that no explicit statement indicating the prepper isn't the Senator was ever needed. Your supposed delusion on the matter hasn't applied to anyone else. So if you feel you must engage in any further delusions on some supposed competition between us in this matter, I leave you to it.

[Removed]

[Removed]

[Removed]

[Removed]

[-] 2 points by LeoYo (5854) 3 months ago

The only conditions involved in this situation is being able to know who you're actually talking about.

[Removed]

[-] 4 points by LeoYo (5854) 3 months ago

There you go lying again and with another convenient lie to explain why you can't substantiate your first lie.

As for posting about a senator, YOU'RE the only one repeatedly posting his voting record as if campaigning for him. I've only posted about a guy living in a cabin in Utah with links actually showing who he is and even who he certainly isn't. Are we supposed to believe that you're really not aware of this despite more than enough proof having already been provided?

[-] 3 points by cicero33 (12) from Sands Point, NY 3 months ago

My advice Leo, continue to do what you do best, continue putting up great articles and links for like-minded people to read, or for people who want to have a better understanding of what this World-wide movement is about.

For those agenda driven people who are unwilling to join our struggle...all they have left is deceit in trying to squash Occupy, or have it merge into the Democratic Party.

Some of us are doing our best to ignore 'them.' And with each nasty, unfounded accusation, or profanity...they become a bit more exposed for their, lack of character which is most antithetical to Occupy, and of course just being a decent human being.

[-] 0 points by flip (6379) 3 months ago

did I say this already - you the man!

[Removed]

[Removed]

[Removed]

[Removed]

[Removed]

[Removed]

[Removed]

[-] 0 points by flip (6379) 3 months ago

isn't this a free speech site - not for racist, sexist or abusive speech of course but what the hell did you say??

[Removed]

[-] 1 points by flip (6379) 3 months ago

wow - what a cynical system if you are right. how shocking - i feel i should bring this matter up to the radicals who designed and run this site. lots of stuff removed below - what could it be - maybe obscenities from a dog or off topic remarks by democrats using childish user names. i hope they read the rules! that should prevent them from being removed. what else could it be?? this was sent to me by the radical founder Justine. Justine Tunney [mailto:justine@occupywallst.org] Sent: Tuesday, January 28, 2014 10:01 PM

What on earth are you talking about with the democratic party? We don't have anything to do with them. Not in the slightest. Don't believe the lies. I mean... we've got all this stuff about revolution on the website. :rolls eyes: You should know better if you've been on the site for the past few years :P - she seems like a very sincere nonpartisan - no democratic party hack is she. well i am sure it will get sorted out - i wonder what happened to the cicero fellow - i have tried to respond to him and he refuses to answer me. strange behavior for occupy wall street - the 2nd best movement to come along in my lifetime. i am old enough to have lived through the demos of the 60's - levitating of the pentagon, sitting in at lunch counters and the like. getting beaten and killed for standing up for what is right. what a time - we changed the world - well not me really. not too much anyway. but i was there 18 in 1968 - marched and chanted to the liberal democrat at that time - hey hey lbj how many kids did you kill today. he did some really good things that guy - war on poverty and civil rights - changed the country but Vietnam put an end to the great society. i know what those 20 yr old kids would be chanting today - something along the lines of fuck Obama and his goldman cronies. where are they now - too many old and dried up - they forgot what made them great. the system co-opted them. made them worry about money and healthcare. Obama care - giving money to the insurance companies - did you see how their stock prices went up after our community organizer president pushed millions into their rolls. oh well - i hope you get 10 points soon - and are you a type of wine - i like shiraz

[Removed]

[-] 1 points by flip (6379) 3 months ago

not surprised we sound the same but I have a western ny accent

[-] 1 points by flip (6379) 3 months ago

it is not me - must be my grifter twin

[Removed]

[Removed]

[Removed]

[Removed]

[Removed]

[Removed]

[Removed]

[Removed]

[Removed]

[Removed]

[Removed]

[-] 3 points by cordoba (21) from West Point, NY 3 months ago

Let me get this straight...err.. you believe that hc.. convinced the Burlington GA to change their location without telling you....and that is why you went home sulking and transformed yourself into a partisan Democrat .... laughing. From having witnessed your ugly demeanor on here, I think it is far more likely that it was a concerted effort to move the GA without telling you. lol

There is no excuse...NONE!..for the way that you conduct yourself on here. The vulgarities &, the mean-spiritedness that you direct at other peoples of the World and to posters on here proves to most of us what a low-life you are.

Your willingness, even your glee at prostituting yourself by saying some really mean, vulgar shit to people (knowing you have impunity) simply because they are not partisan Democrats is extremely telling of the type of person you are.

And your belief that intermittently that you are a word artist makes me laugh too....because what I see is someone who is just a verbose bag of wind who uses far too many words to say far too little.

Finally in your obvious quest ....with your juvenile self-aggrandizing (amusing) tactics.... to be an important cog in this rev, you have achieved just the opposite with that behavior & your baseness. You have become irrelevant...and there is not much worse than that...

I will do my best to ignore you, and I would suggest other posters do the same.

In closing, although i am far from perfect, I would not want your legacy for all the Tea in China...

[-] 2 points by flip (6379) 3 months ago

you hit the nail on the head here. I am not sure why he is allowed to continue in this manner. someone at the top of the food chain must like what he does. things are removed that are not at all insulting or against the rules but he keeps on! ignoring him is the right tactic.

[Removed]

[Removed]

[Removed]

[Removed]

[Removed]

[Removed]

[Removed]

[Removed]

[-] 3 points by LeoYo (5854) 3 months ago

Really??? Am I somehow supposed to know when someone posts to you? Am I now somehow the only person on this forum who sees a stack of boxes of replies to respond to in the lower right corner when I login? And are you now going to lie further by pretending I hadn't already provided clarity for you with the links showing who Mr. Alexander and Senator Alexander are over 18 hours ago?

http://occupywallst.org/forum/tiny-house-living-off-the-grid-heres-how-to-do-it-/#comment-1028065

[Removed]

[Removed]

[-] 0 points by Rebis (0) from Hyde Park, NY 3 months ago

How about that James Dean guy? Not only a great actor, he also made one hell of a sausage! Am I right?

[-] -1 points by LeoYo (5854) 3 months ago

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (20542) from South Burlington, VT 1 minute ago

Am I somehow supposed to know when someone posts to you?

You could know easily enough, it is information you will find on the right hand column of the forum page - traffic here is light enough that I'll bet it is still there now. But in any case . . .


There is no right hand column when one first logs on. Only a stack of boxes of replies made. No one sees a right hand column until they go to the "Open Forum" page as you well know.

You're the one who decided to initiate a "a vast sum of cynicism and nonsense" in your initial reply.


[-] -3 points by ZenDog (20542) from South Burlington, VT 23 hours ago

Since we seem to be holding up a goddamned repelican as some paragon of environmental virtue perhaps a look at his voting record is in order . . . but do we require a small snap shot? Or should we really dig deep . . . .

Some paragon of environmental virtue

someone should ask Truthout about this instance of blatant repelican shillery

http://occupywallst.org/forum/tiny-house-living-off-the-grid-heres-how-to-do-it-/#comment-1027996


So who knew? EVERYONE knew except apparently for some reason YOU.

[Removed]

[-] 1 points by gnomunny (6641) from St Louis, MO 3 months ago

Apparently that last reply from Leo was too complicated for you, so let me break it down into slightly simpler terms:

Lamar Alexander, the politician: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lamar_Alexander#After_governorship

LaMar Alexander, the off grid guy: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=td7R_yOIWJU&list=PLkMD_AP2K4vRFInmLZA5V5XsKbL1Gd5Aa

Does that make it any clearer?

[Removed]

[-] 2 points by shadz66 (20614) 3 months ago

You'll ''never ever again vote repelican'', huh ?!!! When did you last vote for them then ?!! Have you now switched allegiances in this pre-scripted, illusory binary to the Democraps ?! Re. any real progress for The 99%, what's wrong with that picture and what's OWS all about, d'you think ? Also fyi, do consider :

''Obama’s Presidency is continuing the reversal of the New Deal. Unfortunately, that’s the role Obama has played and the legacy he’ll leave.''

e tenebris, lux ...

[Removed]

[-] 2 points by shadz66 (20614) 3 months ago

If you're missing your fellow unquestioningly Dem-Deluded companions, implore and exhort them to return to your aid here but in the meantime, from a more OWS pov - please perhaps try to consider :

fiat lux ...

[Removed]

[-] 4 points by shadz66 (20614) 3 months ago

I am really trying to decipher that !!! But getting nowhere fast - nor am I any the wiser for having read it twice !! So, d'you think Bernie Sanders should run for POTUS ?! As you touch on healthcare above, I'll also take the opportunity lay this down here too :

''Vermont has already taken a number of important steps toward replacing the ACA with a single-payer system. Such a system would allow them to expand coverage to everybody, reduce total spending, and restrain the growth of future health-care costs to a sustainable level through budgeting.'' Perhaps Bernie could run with some of that by way of educating the US populace re. wtf they deserve but aren't getting.

dum spiro, spero ...

[Removed]

[-] 4 points by shadz66 (20614) 3 months ago

I'll put it to you that : a) Bernie Sanders is one of The Best people in Washington ; b) That Americans hardly hear some of the things that he would say ; c) That to think that as POTUS he'd be ''reduced'' in his ability to affect the real change that Americans need, want and deserve, is so counter-intuitive as to be off the scale & d) That your reply is one of your most conservative ever !!! Fuck me !! I do believe it's time to start swearing again, especially as you are now implicitly (imo) saying that Hitlary C - would be preferable to Bernie as POTUS from your p-o-v ! How about u go 'work the phones' for Bernie Sanders ?

too fkn stunned for latin ...

[Removed]

[-] 6 points by shadz66 (20614) 3 months ago

''Nightmare and insanity are akin .. mysterious and involuntary states .. that skew and distort objective reality !!! One wakens from nightmare but from insanity there is no awakening !! Whether Americans live in the one state or the other is the paramount question of this era !

''For two hundred years Americans have been indoctrinated with a mythology created, imposed and sustained by a manipulating cabal - 'The Financial Elite', that built its absolute control on the muscle and blood, good will, ignorance and credulity, of its citizenry.'' from :

You once voted RepubliCon in Vt. ; You 'worked the phones' for The DemoCraps ; You'll intricately advocate voting for Hitlary Clinton - a Neoliberal / Neocon stooge of The Highest Order ; You profess affection for Bernie Sanders but think he'd be better staying isolated in his Vt. backwater ; So, wtf are you doing here other than getting very annoyed that no one is buying your shit ?!!! If there was EVER a person that needed to watch the video above, it's YOU, dude !! That screed above is simply incredible in its inappropriateness on this forum - especially given that HC will more likely than not be the next Pres !

still too fkn stunned for latin ...

[Removed]

[-] 2 points by tomhobbes (0) from Shenandoah, PA 3 months ago

This gobbledygook TRANSLATES into - Hitlary is Occupy's girl in 2016.

[Removed]

[-] 1 points by JGriff99mph (507) 3 months ago

"A victory by Hillary Clinton, with proper preparation before hand, could indeed facilitate a purge of some significance and thus lay the groundwork 8 to 12 years out for some real progressive leadership - assuming of course that Global Warming hasn't placed constraints that hinder such a projected social trajectory."

Thats hysterical.

[-] 1 points by stevebol (1269) from Milwaukee, WI 3 months ago

Lol. I was thinking more of a 16 year projection.

[Removed]

[Removed]

[-] -2 points by shoozTroll (17632) 3 months ago

you say that like you really know anything at all about Sen. Sanders.

You don't, but you might know a little about these guys, however, you never say a word.

http://www.vice.com/read/meeting-the-future-faces-of-the-tory-party

Unless of course, you are one. That would make a lot sense, as you also ignore this guy, who writes of the UK.

http://libcom.org/blog/angryworkersworld-springsummer-wanderings-2014-07042014

[-] 3 points by shadz66 (20614) 3 months ago

Re. Bernie Sanders, where am I wrong about him or where have I misrepresented him ?!!! How about - https://occupywallst.org/forum/social-security-is-strong-by-sen-bernie-sanders/ perhaps ?!! Interesting links, especially the second one but wtf do you imagine the first one has to do with me - or anything else here ?! Unless of course it emanates from your resentment at any non USers commenting here, hmmm. The UKG - like the USG is in the pocket of The Corporate Banksters and so ... how about a OWS related link ? Ergo ...

In the probability of your not engaging with the link (as is your wont) - what did I claim to ''really know anything about Sen. Sanders'' ? What pisses you off here ? Is it the fact that Sanders has been known to profess 'Socialism' ? Or is it that he may just run for POTUS .. and show up Hitlary C. for the Neocon Rightwinger, with some quasi-liberal, pseudo-progressive social views - that she is ? So, go on snooz .. interested readers may want to know what you really think ;-)

nosce te ipsum ...

[-] 1 points by JGriff99mph (507) 3 months ago

I love Bernie. I don't see him running, especially after watching what they did to Kucinich, but who knows, maybe he'll say screw it why not.

Of course, then we can listen to everyone call him a spoiler for the rest of eternity as well.

Democracy for the big two, buckets of shit for everyone else. What a system.

[-] 5 points by lamont (5) from Bronx, NY 3 months ago

Just some reassurance...In the two plus years that I have been attending Occupy events in NYC, I have NEVER met anyone like shooz. He is a complete aberration to Occupy, and to the human decency that most of us possess as well..

Anyone here who thinks that he and his underling, prostituting accomplice Ziondog are not neocon Democrats trying to co-opt this movement must not be paying attention.

Their goal is clear...either ..co-opt or destroy Occupy and the many grass-roots organizations that have coalesced with them.

[-] 4 points by shadz66 (20614) 3 months ago

“A Threat to American Democracy” by Sen. Bernie Sanders (I-Vt.) :

Excerpt, ''Here is the irony of all ironies. It is one thing to understand that the very wealthy are becoming wealthier while everybody else is becoming poorer, but it is another thing to understand that the people who have the money, the billionaire class, are going to war against working Americans. If one has $80 billion, do they really need to invest in the political process so they can elect candidates who will give even more tax breaks? Do they really need to invest in rightwing candidates who are out there trying to cut Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid, the Environmental Protection Agency, nutrition, food stamps, and education? Why, if somebody has $80 billion, are they working so hard for more tax breaks for themselves and for more cuts to the middle class and working class in terms of programs people desperately need?

''Frankly, I think this is not an economic issue. I think it is a psychiatric issue. I think it is an issue which suggests people are simply power hungry. They need more and more. I think this is a very sad state of affairs.''

There ain't no ''Democracy'' btw [ https://www.commondreams.org/view/2014/04/14 ] & it's more a case of 'Socialism' for The 0.01% Oligarchs and Parasites and their 1% lackeys -&- Extreme Crapitalism for The 99% Masses.

ad iudicium ...

[-] 2 points by JGriff99mph (507) 3 months ago

"''Frankly, I think this is not an economic issue. I think it is a psychiatric issue. I think it is an issue which suggests people are simply power hungry. They need more and more. I think this is a very sad state of affairs.''"

Very interesting comment there...

[-] 4 points by shadz66 (20614) 3 months ago

''The Contradictions of the American Electorate'', by Eric Zuess :

''Why Do Most US Voters Prefer Politicians Who Disagree with Their Values and Policies ?''

There are some seriously interesting comments in that very intriguing piece, I can assure you.

fallaces sunt rerum species ...

[-] 1 points by JGriff99mph (507) 3 months ago

I know theres a few people on here that want to sing kumbayah and hold hands and shit, but the reality is that we are extremely fucked up as a nation right now, and like Carlin said, where are all the honest and decent people to replace these scumbags?

Garbage in, garbage out.

[-] -1 points by shoozTroll (17632) 3 months ago

Wait? What?

You hate everything Bernie has to say.

The list is from his webblog.

https://occupywallst.org/forum/how-many-of-these-do-you-support/

You've done nothing but off topic attacks, without saying anything specific about the list nor who wrote it.

His hate of (R)epelican't is legend and he often addresses it.

You?

Not at all.

He also has much vehemence for the Koch's and ALEC.

You, on the other hand would prefer to pretend they are not what they are.

Attacking me profusely for posting on that subject.

So make up your mind.

[-] -1 points by shoozTroll (17632) 3 months ago

So then you actually are a Tory??

Good to know.

You probably really liked Barclay's deal with the libe(R)tarian take over in Detroit.

What is it you have against talking about England, if that's not so?

[-] 2 points by shadz66 (20614) 3 months ago

Fool ! One reasonably aware reply re Pastor Hagee [ https://occupywallst.org/forum/how-many-of-these-do-you-support/#comment-1028259 ] doesn't mean your head is outta your ass yet, clearly !! I've nothing ''against talking about England'' and how about you do a forum post on it and I'll see if it's worth replying to BUT what I won't do - is pander to your diversionary non sequiturs and screwed logic. Now consider :

ad iudicium ...

[-] -3 points by shoozTroll (17632) 3 months ago

The Hagee thing is in a whole other convo........................:)

I get it, your embarrassed to talk about the UK.

So c'mon. You can do it. You talk about stuff that's going on in the UK

How about those girls eating on the tube?

That was pretty funny.

[-] 6 points by shadz66 (20614) 3 months ago

Never mind ''girls eating on the tube'' - whyTF was my most recent forum-post 'shadow banned' ?!!!

fiat lux ...

EDIT: Thanx Leo & bw for replies, comments and links below & here is the video for real 99% and OWS

supporters : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QzQYA9Qjsi0 [24m30s & truly a 'must watch' video] and

Accompanying Article 1 : http://www.truth-out.org/news/item/23178-an-indictment-of-the-invisible-hand +

Accompanying Article 2 : http://truth-out.org/opinion/item/23205-economic-policy-in-a-post-piketty-world

[-] 6 points by LeoYo (5854) 3 months ago

Paul Krugman: What the 1% Don't Want You to Know

Sunday, 20 April 2014 09:22
By Bill Moyers, Moyers & Company | Video Report

The median pay for the top 100 highest-paid CEOs at America’s publicly traded companies was a handsome $13.9 million in 2013. That’s a 9 percent increase from the previous year, according to a new Equilar pay study for The New York Times.

These types of jumps in executive compensation may have more of an effect on our widening income inequality than previously thought. A new book that’s the talk of academia and the media, Capital in the Twenty-First Century by Thomas Piketty, a 42-year-old who teaches at the Paris School of Economics, shows that two-thirds of America’s increase in income inequality over the past four decades is the result of steep raises given to the country’s highest earners.

This week, Bill talks with Nobel Prize-winning economist and New York Times columnist Paul Krugman, about Piketty’s “magnificent” new book.

“What Piketty’s really done now is he said, ‘Even those of you who talk about the 1 percent, you don’t really get what’s going on.’ He’s telling us that we are on the road not just to a highly unequal society, but to a society of an oligarchy. A society of inherited wealth.”

Krugman adds: “We’re seeing inequalities that will be transferred across generations. We are becoming very much the kind of society we imagined we’re nothing like.”

TRANSCRIPT:

http://www.truth-out.org/news/item/23189-paul-krugman-what-the-1-dont-want-you-to-know

[-] 3 points by beautifulworld (20240) 3 months ago

"PAUL KRUGMAN: If you look at, oh, look at European countries, just about all of them. They don't actually necessarily have higher taxes on very high incomes. That's not so much the factor. And they have higher taxes overall, which are used to pay for a lot of programs of aid.

So you have universal healthcare, and we have-- sort of are stumbling our way towards something like that now but they have a lot of income support for people with low incomes. They have lots of support for young parents, they have lots of basically, a lot of redistribution. Which is a dirty word in US politics, but in fact is essential for having a decent society. So that to be the average American is richer than the average person in France.

Although that's mostly because we work longer hours. But to be in the bottom fifth of France is a far, far better thing than to be in the bottom fifth in the United States because of these government policies.

What Krugman is saying there is hugely important. He also goes on to try to understand why it is that redistribution is a dirty word in this country. He says that "there's a very effective apparatus of TV and print media and think tanks and so on who hammer against any suggestion of redistribution." And, also, that race is an issue. He says "I think also the United States, look, we have to admit, race is always lurking under almost everything in American life. And redistribution in the minds of a lot of people means taking money from people like me and giving it to people who don't look like me. And I think that is a big difference between us and Europe."

These are hard truths that we must focus on. Learning about why our nation has allowed huge inequities in wealth and income is the first step to correcting it.

[+] -4 points by shoozTroll (17632) 3 months ago

OK, you didn't care for the girls eating on the tube protest.

You should, on the other hand, be concerned about this.

http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2014/apr/20/choice-cumbria-nuclear-dump-mistake-environment-agency

[Removed]

[-] 3 points by shadz66 (20614) 3 months ago

A good point and question. Furthermore, please see my links above for the salient information.

multum in parvo ...

[Removed]

[Removed]

[Removed]

[Removed]

[-] 1 points by shoozTroll (17632) 3 months ago

GATT too baby. The Koch's pushed the hell out of it.

So WTF does that have to do with Barclay's?

WTF does it have to do with the libe(R)tarian takeover of Detroit?

I've already shown you how it was softened in the 90s, by Koch/ALEC alumni John Engler. A true closet libe(R)tarian.

Did you really forget it all, already?

Are you that lost?

[-] 3 points by JGriff99mph (507) 3 months ago

GATT Vote?

Did you know more Dems voted for GATT than Reps?

http://tech.mit.edu/V114/N60/gatt.60w.html

[-] 2 points by JGriff99mph (507) 3 months ago

You asked me to prove that Democrats and Republicans are the same.

Thats what Im doing. Not 100% the same, but enough so that we should not be looking to them for savior.

At least it gives you ammo so you can keep getting a paycheck, posting those keywords.

[-] 1 points by shoozTroll (17632) 3 months ago

That doesn't prove that. And it was at the start of the libe(R)tarian infestation I've told you about so many times.

I asked you to prove it with examples in your own State.

As I proved my case with what's happened in mine.

So hey?

Are you gonna start building a bunch of those tiny houses on Orlando?

[-] 0 points by gnomunny (6641) from St Louis, MO 3 months ago

Personally, I have no intention of voting for Lamar Alexander, but if LaMar Alexander were to run for office I may consider it.

Just out of curiosity, I pulled up White Pages dot com and typed in the name Lamar Alexander and it returned 51 results. Catch my drift?

Fact-checking isn't one of the Peacock's strong suits, I see.

Edit: I, too, am curious as to which Republican you last voted for. Reagan, perhaps?

[Removed]

[-] 0 points by gnomunny (6641) from St Louis, MO 3 months ago

Jeffords. I did read that. I assumed we were talking about a presidential candidate. My mistake.

And correct me if I'm wrong, but are you still asserting that "Little House" Lamar is the same guy as "Senator" Lamar?

[Removed]

[-] 2 points by gnomunny (6641) from St Louis, MO 3 months ago

Actually, I don't care. And it seems you're the only one that's suffering from some sort of confusion simply because two men share the same name.

You seem to have garnered some minor fixation over this whole affair, thinking, for instance, that Leo posting this article has somehow "outed" him as another Repelican infiltrator. I find the whole thing bizarre, and it's seems to point to my comment recently that once you see the name of some Republican politician, the thinking half of your brain shuts down.

[Removed]

[-] 2 points by gnomunny (6641) from St Louis, MO 3 months ago

Your credibility is no longer in doubt, Zen, rest assured.

[Removed]

[-] 3 points by gnomunny (6641) from St Louis, MO 3 months ago

Well, that's where you're wrong, Zen. Anyone that can read my comments, flip's comments, and hc's and assume we're all the same person has a complete inability to discern one user from another. "Friedmanmises" is a perfect example. He (or she) comes on here talking about the so-called benefits of capitalism and by some lunatic deconstruct of his username (fried man mises) you come to the bizarre conclusion it was Trashy posing as Jart (neither of which gives a fuck about capitalism) under the username 'friedmanmises.' Now that, my friend, is delusion.

[Removed]

[Removed]

[Removed]

[-] 2 points by JGriff99mph (507) 3 months ago

Meanwhile some are actively campaigning for a guy who is accepting money from BP while the oil was continually gushing into the bay, and then claiming to care about the environment as well.

Politics to the loyalists is about winning, and thats it. No matter how horrific the tragedies they do, winning is all the matters.

God I hate political hacks.

[Removed]

[-] 1 points by JGriff99mph (507) 3 months ago

No I wouldnt have, but how predictable that you would use that as a defense of your own blatant corruption abiding ways.

Win at all costs, right? Fuck everyone, fuck everything, who gives a fuck if you are literally selling your soul wathcing the bombs drop and the oil gush,

JUST FUCKIN WIN.

[Removed]

[-] 0 points by JGriff99mph (507) 3 months ago

Nice, politihack. Total peacock nonsense, using quotes from another idiot, Palin, to make a story. Nice job as usual.

Does your timeline make you feel better?

PS- its still fuckin leaking.

[Removed]

[-] 1 points by JGriff99mph (507) 3 months ago

Of course not, why bother.

HEre's your phone banking paying off with a bill to streamline fracking permits, signed by your lovely politicians while the people are preparing for Christmas.

http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?d113:HR00767:@@@X

But who cares right? Its all about winning in 2014.

The logic of the loyalists in this country is so backwards, so timid and so totally lacking any real compass or morals its appalling.

You claim to care about the environment and then will openly endorse these fuckin people?

Care about alternative energy and then openly try to convince others that these fraudulent hacks care? Convince people that the very people that sign things like this are the ones who care?

Really?

[Removed]

[Removed]

[-] 1 points by JGriff99mph (507) 3 months ago

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/05/05/us/new-fracking-rule-is-issued-by-obama-administration.html?_r=0

More of the same. Make the rules easier, but AFTER they are done, they have to disclose what they used.

Great job on the last election. More criminals pillaging the planet.

[-] 3 points by shoozTroll (17632) 3 months ago

Ultimately, the safety of fracking is decided at the State level.

Easy and cheaply bribed, at that level.

ALEC gets to have a field day.

The 700 foot deep sinkhole in Bayou Corne is still growing.

[Removed]

[-] 1 points by JGriff99mph (507) 3 months ago

Yes, its about the other great part of your leader's energy policy, fracking.

You don't even know the people whom you are endorsing are signing things that making fracking easier?

Are you living in a cave?

[Removed]

[Removed]

[Removed]

[-] -1 points by shoozTroll (17632) 3 months ago

Flip pulled that on me.

When I refused to walk in lock step, he became petulant.

[Removed]

[-] -1 points by shoozTroll (17632) 3 months ago

Whatever, they do walk in lockstep.

Then in true Orwellianism, they accuse others of group think.

[Removed]

[-] -3 points by shoozTroll (17632) 3 months ago

Here ya go dumber.

Just think, he's almost gone and you never had a word to say about the damage he's done to your community.

You pretty much cheered him on.

http://www.rickscottwatch.blogspot.com/

[Removed]