Forum Post: Occupy Needs to Get Political
Posted 12 years ago on Oct. 25, 2011, 12:47 p.m. EST by HitGirl
(2263)
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You may not like the present power structure but you do exist within it. The Tea Party, which has largely been abandoned, were effective. They got their people elected. If you're going to survive as a movement, you have to have allies. And if your intention is to affect political change you have to endorse candidates and expose the puppets. So, I am saying get POLITICAL. Educate yourselves if you need to. Educate others. Phone bank. Vote.
The Tea Party didn't get their people elected. They got duped into supporting corporate stooges. Semantics?
All political candidates are puppets because they are political candidates. The system is corrupting. Operating within the system will corrupt you.
Definitely semantics. Tea Party and the 1% are the same. Also, when you generalize: All blacks are the same, all pols are the same, you are always wrong. Don't be lazy. Check out Bernie Sanders site. Look up all of the above politicians.
Sorry, I believe the system is utterly broken. Electing single candidates who we merely suspect are not bought is not good enough. I agree that some are not, but my response is basically "so what?"
So sad. Good luck with your windmills.
Thanks! Good luck with your rotting corpse.
the allies of this movement are the 99% around the country. thats the biggest ally we need. you ask joe schmoe on the street what his thoughts are of the movement and he will tell you. its about time. the rest of the world is watching and to be honest. our democracy is on shaky legs thanks to greed. if this movement doesnt bring change soon im scared to let my children be raised in this country. i would rather move somewere that i have to gather water from a well everyday instead of have corporate hoses to drown me.
Your movement has just over 30% support from those who know about you. A hefty amount of people are not even informed enough to realize you're there. And those that know aren't really clear enough on your message to support you. I have nothing against the movement. In fact, I defend it all the time, but you can't just belt out a slogan like, "We are the 99%" without being realistic about your actual level of support. Great slogan by the way.
"You may not like the present power structure but you do exist within it."
The present power structure is so rotten to the core that it is beyond repair. No amount of tinkering can ever make it functional. It needs a COMPLETE OVERHAUL.
And in order to obtain such an overhaul, "WE THE PEOPLE" must DEMAND it through a NATIONAL, LEGALLY-BINDING REFERENDUM that will dissolve Congress, the Senate, the Supreme Court, the FED, the Pentagon, etc.
A. But what would be there in its place? B. Good luck.
Sorry, that is not gonna happen. Did Egypt achieve that? And they were much worse off than you with a real multitude. If I thought that was the expectation of this movement, I'd write you all off as dreamers jousting with windmills. Don't be lazy. Do your homework. Plenty of descent progressives in congress.
"Plenty of descent (decent?) progressives in congress", you write.
NAMES, please? (I mean, besides Kucinich and Sanders)
I have to do your homework? Here are the ones I know of...Kirsten Gillibrand, Raúl Grijalva (AZ-7, Tucson), Jan Schakowsky (IL-9, Chicago), Marcy Kaptur (OH-9, Toledo), Peter DeFazio (OR-4, Eugene),
"Don't be lazy. Do your homework."
"I have to do your homework?"
SUCH INTOLERABLE ARROGANCE!!!
So I give you the names like you asked for and your response is to insult me. That is pretty shabby behavior. You're not here for anything constructive. Good day.
WHO is insulting WHOM?
Barney Frank is when you let him be, and Al Franken would definitely fall under that banner (and that's just in the Senate). They'd be harder to find in the House because of the 2010 elections, but they exist. Even if there aren't that many right now 2012 is the perfect opportunity to put them there. There are a number of seats in both the Senate and the House occupied by fairly crusty incumbents that we might have a good shot at beating in the primaries if we as an organization make an effort to do so. Honestly speaking, we need to do something in the political arena, and we pretty much have our work cut out for us. Take the case of Charlie Rangel:
Despite voicing public support for OWS, Charlie Rangel turned around and voted for a free trade agreement which is most likely going to ship even more jobs overseas and runs contrary to the founding principles of the movement. This is despicable, and a fair number of people on here ought to be pretty pissed. Here's my question to those of you who don't want to see this sort of behavior continue: When's the next round of Democratic primaries, then? And which OWS organizers are in Harlem and willing to locate and get behind a challenger for Rangel's seat? This is why we need our own slate of people running for office. If we want to get real change then we're going to need to offer real people willing to run for office and able to win; we can't trust people like Rangel to vote with their constituents and the general election offers us a choice between lip service and outright hostility. If, however, we unseat Rangel in the primaries, then we can probably put our man through the general election with little opposition and we'll have our very first OWS'er in DC.
The thing is, if we try this for Rangel and succeed (which we should) then it sends a message to the rest of DC that they have to start taking us into account if they want to keep their jobs. The Tea Party did it, the Populists did it, the Green Party does it on occasion, and generally speaking it works. Citizens United allows us to build and fund an OWS superPAC, essentially a war chest that we can spend on our candidates across the country. Now, we'd obviously not start soliciting corporate funding for it because that goes against everything we stand for, but imagine the power that an independently aligned national coalition of small donors would have to influence this country during elections season. We could throw our people (actual OWS'ers with community organization/activism/legal backgrounds or OWS sympathizers in that category) into Democratic and Republican primaries across the country, and even if we only take one or two seats most legislators will think of the Tea Party and be less willing to ignore our interests.
I forgot about AL Franken. Thanks. He deserved to be mentioned. As for Barney Frank, I've heard good and bad so I don't know. I'd love to add Alan Grayson to that list, but corporate cash unseated him. I think he will be back. Thanks for being an informed voter and expanding on my message of constructive political activism.
No problem; I pretty much agree with your message, and I feel like it's chronically underrated by people who love ideological purity but aren't willing to understand the complexities of implementation. It's quite easy to declare that a system is severely damaged and/or corrupt; what I want to know is what people would propose to do about it and how they would go about implementing it. Simply refusing to participate and/or backing Ron Paul is out of the question; all that does is fully cede power to people who disagree with us. Violent revolution and complete disposal of the existing infrastructure is likewise a fool's remedy; even if you succeed (which is doubtful) what will you put in place as the new system and what kind of infrastructure do you plan to put in place to make sure that it too doesn't come apart?
Well, you just put into words my doubts and questions about the movement with incredible clarity. I hope people read your post. America is going to change and OWS will play a part.
Corporate cash did not unseat him, his loud, arrogant, insulting mouth did him in. He was a representative/carpetbagger in Florida who thought he was in San Fransisco.
http://www.politifact.com/florida/statements/2011/oct/24/alan-grayson/alan-graysons-defense-occupy-wall-street-impassion/
Barney Frank's pockets are full of corporate money.
Fanny and Freddie contributed more to his retirement than the tax payers ever could.
The last defense of the elite political class is a wall of self-interested pols and lawyers ( same thing actually) and they will absorb and dissipate this movement faster then a blink of an eye. Stay clear of the political trap they're laying for you!