Forum Post: You are miserable. And you want everyone miserable with you.
Posted 12 years ago on Dec. 28, 2011, 10:07 a.m. EST by DunkiDonut2
(-108)
This content is user submitted and not an official statement
That seems to be the POINT of this site.
You can read how miserable the posters are on here (the 21 regulars, and that is really sad). But rather than make things better they seem to enjoy being miserable and they want to drag everyone else down with them. Misery loves company. Chant to yourselves, nobody cares about you. We see brighter days ahead, after the elections.
"Misery" The Beatles I'm the kind of guy, Who never used to cry, The WORLD is treating me BAD ,misery!
BooooHoooo
A weak man cuts other people down to lift himself up. A strong man lifts all people.
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You are correct. I wonder why this OWS movement began to cut down hard working MAN. You brought up a great comment, "lifting" and not whining. THANK YOU!
Let's examine. OWS wants to lift 99% of the people. DunkiDonut2 wants to lift 1% of the people. Your comments prove you are not only weak, but an imbecile to boot.
If there was 99% this site would have nearly 300 million people on it. Just for kicks I have counted about 23 different people in here. Your comment is sadly sad. You may be part of 99% but this movement only represents .0000000001% of the population. Dont pat yourself on the back. Your not that impressive.
Because you are a douche you merely count who posts here. Nice job, asshole.
Now there are 24
DunkiDonut2 at the 'puter
Brush your teeth and get back under the desk dickheadgates. Why did you post a photo where you are between my legs?
Hey dickheadgates,,,,,, come up for air. Your draining me dry.
And you are below the desk. "Faster,,, faster". Save some for GirFriday she likes it.
If an ugly ugly man spooges on you in the throat tomorrow, I bet it won't be the first time.
Stop talking with your mouth full
Go ride yourself, you douche-drinking, sloppy, throbbing, throbbing, overfucked co-worker-loving game show host-humping retard.
Good one!! ; )
this comment is currently second on the list for best, contained in a collapsed thread.
Not sure what that says - about the comment, the thread, the forum, or anything else.
But I do find it . . .. interesting . . . and tinged with a bit of humor at that
When I see a person that looks like they are below sub-human, lowest on all levels, I read your comments and think,, he isnt that bad.
Copy and paste what you wrote. Print it out computer paper. Put the paper by the phone. In your own handwriting put this just below the print, "This is why I'm miserable and people dont call me."
It's a shame you will never get past your crushing depression. Maybe you shouldn't have been such a twat.
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you used a pronoun when you should have used the contraction (you're) for you are.
Sometimes, your point can be lost when you mis-type it.
Actually,,,,, I pay far less attention to those that have perfect grammer than those that can crew the fat. Like the guy that posted the photo above, whom'st is below the table.
Your comment is sadly, sorrowfully, dismally reflective of your weak position.
You claim this site and this movement are so insignificant that nobody would bother with it, and yet here you are.
You're transparent hypocrisy is laughable. I do applaud your imbecilic attempt to appear strong and tough, but the dismal truth of your weak mind is as obvious as the writing on the wall.
Here's the deal. There are only about 24 people on here that agree with YOU. Go figure.
By the time you hear how not to be a twatwaffle, it will be roughly a week too late.
The real deal. You're actions don't match your words. If this is so insignificant, then put your money where your mouth is and leave, and don't let the door hit your donuts on the way out.
I dont watch cock fighting because I feel sad for the birds but reading these sad stories about people waking up and thinking about some old rich fart all stinking day long is kind of funny to read. (Alarm goes off,,,, "Crap,,, the pills wore off,,, I hate rich people."
?? wtf !! -- You truly are an imbecile. You've captured yourself in a contradictory trap which you cannot escape, so now you start raving about birds. By all means, continue you imbecilic efforts, I thoroughly enjoy watching imbeciles eat crow.
Parables can touch a nerve. You have tender ones and you didnt even know it until you started to read mine and began replying. Take your pills,,,, lots of them,,, tomorrow will be the same miserable one for you to enjoy.
But as JC'll be "Enjoying it", it won't be a "miserable" day at all ; will it, DumbyDodo ?!!
You are The Only One using the word "miserable" here !
Hmmm ... ; ever hear of the Psychological Precepts of "Transference and Projection" ?
ad iudicium ...
You're right. I do have nerves, I do have feelings, and I have known sorrow and misery- nor am I ashamed of it. It makes me a stronger & better & happier person than your miserly, punch downward, empty hearted ass will ever be....tomorrow and everyday.
Now attack me again and show everybody how tough you are. Show everybody how you like to whip up on the little guy to lift up yourself. Prove to everybody you're the douchebag imbecile I said you were from the start.
I posted. You posted a reply to ME. You said I was an imbecile. Where I live,,, one would say,,, YOU ATTACKED ME.
Everyone has known sorrow and misery as you claim only YOU have felt. The difference, I pick myself up and figure out what "I" could do to resolve the problem. You are the type that wants me and my MONEY to solve YOUR problems. I want the likes of you and your friends to keep your hands out of my pockets. You will take,, and it wont be enough for you,, and you will want to take more. Aint going to happen. By the way, I dont make HUGE donations but I give a very appropriate amount of my money and my time to a vast number of support programs. I just renewed my monthly donation to United Way and several other projects in our community. The difference between you and I,,, I believe in giving from the heart the amount I want to give and YOU want to decide how much I give. YOU have ZERO,,, yes ZERO,,, knowledge of how much money a VERY RICH person may give of his wealth to social programs or buidling projects for the poor. YOU HAVE NO IDEA. I really is none of your business. But YOU want to imagine in your pea brain that the rich just sit on their money. You have no access to the amounts given. You have decided they give NOTHING and that burns your ASS because you have no control over it. Its not your money. YOU are the problem.
You truly are an imbecile. You posted an attack calling everyone on this site and in this movement miserable people and then say I attacked you. Let's be honest. YOU ATTACKED ME & EVERYONE ELSE.
Look at all the effort you put into cutting me down. You are a weak person who gets ahead at the misery of others. You say this site & movement is insignificant. If it is, why bother with it. It must be damn important; otherwise, you wouldn't need to keep coming here and attacking us. I'm still waiting for you to put your money where your attack is and prove it. If I'm unimportant. If this site is unimportant. If this movement is unimportant. LEAVE.
I know you would love everyone to believe they are the problem and that you have nothing to do with creating the misery. You attack me for wanting to take, but give no credit for me wanting to fix a system that no longer rewards hard work. You attack me for wanting to take from your pockets, but make no mention of you & your ilk getting richer & richer by stepping on the throats of those that do your labor. Three decades of stagnant wages for laborers, three decades of unbelievable wealth accumulation for you. You are an imbecile if you don't see something wrong with that picture.
The real difference between you and I; you want prosperity for yourself, you want tax breaks for yourself, and you don't care who is miserable, as long as you are happy, all is good. The real difference between you and I is I do care about people other than myself. You do not.
You are the problem. There is still time for you to change. There is still time for you to understand the difference between being a weak, miserly person and a strong person who cares about raising all individuals through his hard work and effort. There is still time for you to be a good person at heart. Your choice.
Punch down at miserable little me. Or realize that you are the problem. Punch down at miserable homeless kids. Or realize that you are the problem. Punch down at the oppressed working class falling into poverty. Or realize that you are the problem.
Punch down. Attack me again. Show people what you really are. A cruel, selfish, snobbish, hypocritical, miserly, weak, IMBECILE who doesn't give a rat's ass about anybody but himself.
My statement that YOU have zero facts to confirm exactly how much a rich person pays on their tax return is,,,, in your mind,,,,,, slander? Wow. Slander? So if my comment is slander then you DO have copies of tax returns and how much they paid? You really,,,, really have that? Slander,,,,,, really?
The truth hurts doesn't it. Pisses you off real bad and makes you punch down. Makes you and all your friends come here to post a bunch of bullshit slander tactics. You and your friends will do anything and stoop to any level to obscure the truth that you're a crook ripping off the American People.
YOU have ZERO facts on exactly how much any person, rich or poor, pays in taxes,, ZERO. Some liberal democrat makes a statement, "The rich pay less in taxes than a secretary,,,blah, blah." and since it was a democrat that says it is in some report,,, YOU are REQUIRED to believe it. Unless you work for the IRS, you have no access to tax returns on any citizen. If a rich person released their tax returns some democrat would twist the facts. YOU have NO IDEA what is on a personal income tax return and what any 1% pays. I have no idea how much you paid. I bet you dont even know off the top of your head how much you paid,,, but YOU and other OWS people know as FACT what rich DONT pay. How can you possibly make the statements you do knowing you have nothing to backup your statements. YOU dont, you just keep making the statements until it sticks.
The truth hurts doesn't it. Pisses you off real bad and makes you punch down. Makes you and all your friends come here to post a bunch of bullshit slander tactics. You and your friends will do anything and stoop to any level to obscure the truth that you're a crook ripping off the American People.
You are the name caller. You called me an imbecile. Saying you are miserable, "not feeling good", "unhappy", "sad", is not name calling. Had I called you an IDIOT, then that would be an insult. Apparently you then must be an idiot.
You are the problem. If everyone agreed with you the street would be full of people. DONT SEE THEM!!!!! I want YOU out of my pocket. I pay my taxes. I give to charities, I contribute to society. OWS does not.
Let's be honest. You came here first to a site you say is worthless. You attacked us. Saying we 'enjoy' being miserable - wretched, pitiable, anguished, unhappy, depressed - is worse than an insult, it's an attempt to humiliate and scorn. For your information, I do not enjoy being miserable any more than you do. For you to think this way...well...In my book, only a miserly (tightfisted) imbecilic (asinine) person thinks in this manner.
You are the problem. You justify your actions, but are those actions really honorable. Do you really contribute to the betterment of society? Do you really pay enough taxes, or do you simply pay less than your secretary. Does giving to charity justify that fact.
Only a weak, miserly man would justify paying less taxes than the people who worked for him, not a strong, honorable man.
There is still time to change. You know the right thing to do. The only thing stopping you is you.
It is the insulated politicians that work for the corporations that cut down the hard working man.
That post that explained psychopathic and antisocial behavior describes this poster DunkiDonut2. Cannot acknowledge there's injustice in this world, can't empathize, makes everything about HIM, and his insults.
There is little injustice. What injustice happened to YOU this week. Give some injustice examples to you this week,, share. You just miserable,, nothing happened.
LoL ~{:-p) & re. "nothing happened." ; Only because your memory does NOT go as far back as 2008 and due to your all round autistic self-absorption and wilful ignorance !
To make an attempt at changing, start with : http://documentarystorm.com/inside-job/ or at least watch it out of curiosity man, in order to see what the rest of us are about !!
Being obtuse is Not anything to be proud of, nurture or persist in !!!
Unless of course, your being here is a 'paid gig' ;-)
ab absurdumb ... veritas ?
I'm just interested in your hate. You woke up in the morning and you are miserable at THE MAN, a CORPORATION, A BANKER, etc and etc. I was just wanting to know what,,,, during the entire day,,,, did THE MAN,,, a CORPORATION or A BANKER,,, harm you directly? Is there someone knocking on your door? Why the huge amounts of anger that would prompt you or your friends to protest, live in tents, crap on a police car? WHAT HAPPENED TO YOU TODAY?
You are a F*ckin' Idiot and probably without the ability to even understand the first thing about http://documentarystorm.com/inside-job/ but try to challenge yourself a little and give it a go ; you never know, you just might learn something about your own 'interest in hate and misery' !!
dum(b) spiro, spero ...
Did you listen to Rush Limbaugh this morning?
Then why are you here?
[-] JadedCitizen 1 points 30 minutes ago
A weak man cuts other people down to lift himself up. A strong man lifts all people.
[-] DunkiDonut2 1 points 25 minutes ago
You are correct. I wonder why this OWS movement began to cut down hard working MAN. You brought up a great comment, "lifting" and not whining. THANK YOU!
[-] JadedCitizen 1 points 0 minutes ago
Let's examine. OWS wants to lift 99% of the people. DunkiDonut2 wants to lift 1% of the people. His comments prove he is not only weak, but an imbecile to boot.
Ergo, tho' I generally wouldn't consider "booting an imbecile"; in "Dunki's" case I'd make an exception ;-)
Yes, Dunki is an exceptional case, of the 'basket' kind.
Have you heard of Occupy Wall Street? Do you know their issue is about the gross inequity of the 1% of the very wealthiest individuals continuing to rake in billions of dollars off the rest of us, gleefully so, and creating unsustainable conditions for the rest of us? Have you heard anything at all about that?
This is why people are posting on this blog. I know you read, so please improve your comprehension skills.
So, you are also Dunkidonut2? Good to know.
I have a bit of time during the holidays, so I am writing on this blog. I don't know who anyone here is. I don't know who you are. You appear very sarcastic, angry, determinedly so, and are to be pitied.
This is a forum for people who want to be part of the solution, not the problem. Have you heard about the problems millions of people in our country are having lately? Have you heard about world hunger, political dictatorships, or any of these sorts of problems? Do you have any solutions for us?
Dunkidonut2 is here to start shit. You are either a part of the problem or a part of the solution. Choose your path.
I disagree with Dunkidonut2. Now I agree with you wholeheartedly. I am here to be part of the solution.
You are part of the problem. You have no solutions but to complain and whine about yourselves. I dont know of ANYONE that is whining about but you people. Everything seems to be going just fine. Why would I care about 1% of the population? I woke up this morning as I have all my life and never thought once about some rich guy. I want to be just like them,,, why not you? You are miserable wanting them to be just like you. I dont get your point.
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We must identify those specifically trying to divert attention from OWS. I believe they are comprised of a very small percentage of the already small wealthiest 1%. I think they are actually pathological in their greed. I think many very wealthy people have some ethics, but a few have run off the rails in their propensity to take over the world.
The only way to do this it to selectively examine and observe individual actions on their parts over time. It sounds really strange to follow someone else's actions like that, but that's what we have to do. This is the only way to hold these bad actors accountable.
Good God,,,, you must be in torment every moment of your day. I feel sorry for your misery.
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Thank you. Thank you for taking the time to tell the truth about where we are today. I will support small business more and big business less as much as possible.
Politics are center-seeking and as such third party candidates won't solve anything. We have no choice but to work within existing political systems and effect change that way.
DD: Go On Admit it! You neither read MD's posts nor could you understand them even IF you did!! Tch!!!
Go away.
What do you mean, GO AWAY? I posted a comment and YOU came to me to comment. YOU GO AWAY. What part of that is not easy for you to understand.
Sorry to offend you. You have offended so many. Neither of us will go away. The issue of extreme and increasing wealth disparity between the upper 1% versus the lower 99% won't go away no matter how much you wish it would. It really is a valid issue that people aren't going to give up addressing just because you want them to. No matter what you say or how hostile you become, it isn't about to disappear unless changes are made.
It really is about offending. Generations before use created opportunities. They sacrificed, created, built , anchored, innovated by their hands. We are their rewards. Part of the vision was to have something MUCH BIGGER and BETTER than before. Wealth, the ability to create wealth or to waste wealth is in your own hands. I and millions enjoy what was given to us. OWS presents a vision of destruction. I dont want to give up what was given. You want to take from me and give to you. That is your decision, not mine. I dont care if you are as pleased as you demand. I have the right to fight against that. I use part of my VALUABLE time to defend what we want to keep. The movement is similar to a war. You can attempt to TAKE from me but I will do everything to KEEP what is mine. Extreme wealth throughout the entire history of life has not stopped anyones ability to do better on their own. I want to see MORE wealth in life than less. I'm hostile to protect my property. Laying down and letting people take would be the wrong thing for me to do. Stop hating wealth, in what ever level it is for your needs, and go after it. Hating 1% of people I have never met, or few have met in all of history, seems so childish. Try as you want, you wont change thousands of years of wealth. Even if you took it, you would want to take more that is not available.
No. Please do not misunderstand me. The world is always changing, including the lives of the very wealthy. All enterprises have a life cycle in which some necessary transformation must occur. I respect the opportunities created by generations gone by. I respect their sacrifice and regard a failure to appreciate our lives as a kind of sin against the sacred trust they placed in us, their inheritors. I myself have created wealth through dogged determination and sacrifice in my own life and I know how it feels to have so-called "friends" turn away from me in jealousy or some other resentment related to our new-found wealth, especially during these hard times. I celebrate those who worked hard, played by the rules, contributed to society, and still managed to become wealthy. The majority of the wealthiest 1% did just that, and I do not begrudge them their wealth. Some of these ethical, wealthy people recommend higher tax rates for those in their wealth bracket, and it is surprising how vilified they are when speaking their mind. But the truth is, you only need so much wealth to be happy, and it is unfair to monopolize industries, rake in billions every year, achieve so much wealth and power, greater than many countries, and then promote things like "pension reform" or "deregulation" or "shrinking of government" or other political movement whose purpose is really all about maximizing one's profits rather than benefitting society.
No one needs to make $395 million dollars a year and pay lower tax rates than those making say, only a million dollars a year. There just isn't any psychological or socially redeeming benefit to this, unless we are supposed to honor one who is pathologically greedy. I don't think all people in any given group are pathological, since people are all individuals. But at this time I think there are a few individuals within the 1% wealthiest Americans who own way more than most countries combined, and this is power at its most corrupted.
Why should anyone be engaged in "hating wealth?" Luckily I am content in life, though pretty exasperated at the public sometimes. I don't hate anyone. I think a few of the wealthiest 1% shouldn't be raking in so much wealth each year and accruing such massive levels of wealth. This tremendous wealth just gives too few people way too much power over the rest of us and it's unhealthy. It's unsustainable for us to continue in this way.
My goal would never be to take wealth away from the wealthy. My goal would be to enhance the productivity and character of a society and civilization by maintaining its infrastructure, enforcing its fair and just laws, raising its children right, and keeping the environment healthy. That's not a "taking." That's a giving.
Go back to high school prom dunkin nuts
You wake up and spend the entire day miserable over 1%. I would hate being as miserable as you. I dont want to be like you or give you anything. That is why I'm here. To let you know you are alone in your misery.
@ DD : Oi ! It's U who is the Miserable One here !! Hanging out with people who you do NOT like or respect, who ... well .. see IF you can guess !!!
F*ckin' Idiot ...
Hanging out? Are you in high school? This is a website not a center court at the mall. Geezzzzz.
If we throw a stick, will you leave?
"Everything seems to be going just fine."
Where have you been in the last few days, weeks, months, years? Did you work at the South Pole for many years and became very out of touch? It's true. You aren't a part of any solution we can detect. Why are you on this blog?
this clown is probably a rogue wall street element inserted here. Don't pay him any mind.
If he's not a rogue element, then he is eating the gruel and that is very addictive, (painful) problem to be rehabilitated from.
Exactly. Compassionate rehabilitation is all anyone deserves. Thank you. The gruel is a very painful, addictive problem.
I think many of the wealthiest 1% are well-meaning. I think a few of the 1% are pathologically greedy to the point where they just can't allow anyone else's point of view into their consciousness. This has to change.
Everything is fine! I have been right here for days, weeks, months and years. If it was bad,,, dont you think EVERYONE would have joined this silly little movement? They havent. Tells you something. If everyone agreed with you there would be no need for you to be here posting your gripes. Get in your car. Drive around and see how many people are out protesting for YOUR cause,,, NOBODY IS. Nobody wants to be as miserable as YOU are. Sane people dont wake up and spend the day hating a handful (1%) of rich people. They have other things to think about. But you do. Dont you think that is strange that you are so upset and miserable that this takes up your entire life worrying about some rich old fart that has no idea you even live? Get over it. Get cat to kick around. Get a LIFE! (geeeeezzz 1%)
I do not begrudge your happy life. I celebrate your happiness, and wish others were in similarly good circumstances.
A "silly little movement" is based on numbers put out by the C.I.A. detailing extreme wealth disparities, in which 1% can control the lives of the rest of us, through politics, the media, even the courts. Corporations are now considered to enjoy the same free speech rights as individuals, when everyone knows corporations can function in perpetuity and without the limits possessed by mere mortals like ourselves. This is not right.
Where have you been?
And yet,,, people from other countries,,, very poor countries,,, with little or no access to the BIG MEDIA bad people you claim, come to America and start a company within one year of arriving. Dont be miserable. Be like people that dont listen to your hype.
Successful foreign start-ups are wonderful, worth celebrating, to be encouraged, and supported.
Circumstances under third world dictatorships and impoverished conditions are often so dire in their countries of origin that immigrants are happy to work long, hard hours for the time it takes to get a company up and running in a year, as you say.
Try thinking a bit more long-term, however, and look toward allowing these fabulously enterprising individuals to sustain their wealth and gains. Imagine them enjoying long, productive, satisfying work throughout their careers, and then retiring at some point to enjoy the fruits of their labor, their families, and other interests they may have placed on hold during their busy careers. As well, they deserve a safe neighborhood, health care, and functioning infrastructure.
Why is it OK to "privatize the profit and socialize the loss?" These wonderfully enterprising people may rejoice in the success of their start-up, but will distain the loss of their savings and investments through profligate gambling by the very wealthy 1% and banks and financial services industry participants who do their bidding.
Allow a sustainable, transparent economic system that's worth investing in to be re-created out of the rubble of the dot-com and housing debacles. Look at the extreme and ever widening wealth inequalities in the world today. Make a connection between this phenomenon and reluctance of corporations to invest in our country and people. "No demand" means people haven't money with which to buy goods and services. The connection must be made between unfair tax rates on the upper- upper levels of the wealthiest 1% and the lack of demand at the lower end.
pointing the finger and telling people (that you don't agree with) that they are wrong because you are fortunate enough to be doing well (for now) doesn't make you "right".
and elections are based on "selection" by the people in positions to do so, not voters (like me or yourself). No one voted Obama in, he was selected and the only reason he was, is the same reason Bush was in office for 8 years.
it "works" on the people period. if it "works" it appears to be the "right decision". and this is on of the many reasons why the OWS exists today.
peace.
I am right. You say,,, "Dont point fingers" is that what you posted. Here is the front page to ows,, read the headline and ask if that is point a finger or not? I think YOU people are pointing fingers at people
On December 22nd, the 99% Choir walked into Bank of America's Seattle headquarters, sang appropriately updated carols, and posted foreclosure notices citing bribery, fraud, and extortion. Thanks goes to The Other 98% , The Backbone Campaign, Washington Community Action Center, and the Seattle Labor Chorus for this action and video.
sounds like caroling on behalf of the OWS. and I think the OWS is directing attention towards the real cause of the country's problems in general. and maybe you don't like that, because one day it could effect your comfortable little lifestyle.
I thought the purpose of this website was to bring attention. I dont have a problem with my bank. I get a loan,,, sign the papers,,, pay on time,,, burn the mortgage. It appears like fingerpointing at the bank,,,, doesnt it?
LOL, look who's talking - a rancid, reactionary scum-bag who can't see past his own rectum because his head is jammed so far up his own jacksey !
Put both those "Donuts" down ; step back from your "Dunkin' " and look what's going on in "The Land of The (un)Free & The Home of The Slave" !!
While you're at it, see if you can possibly drag your fuzzy little head outta your (x) for long enough to watch the film "INSIDE JOB", The Latest Working Link : http://documentarystorm.com/inside-job/ !!!
ad iudicium ...
If I felt like a slave I would fight. I'm not a slave and 98% dont think they join you. You are miserable,, nobody wants to join you. I'm not watching some porn flick to please YOU. If everything was broken you would see it in the streets. I see traffic going to malls and buying things.
Sorry to disappoint you that it's NOT a porn-flick but is an Excellent Documentary film about what happened before and after 2008. BTW, does your memory extend that far ?
If not, you should stick to giving "blow jobs" as "Inside Job" [ http://documentarystorm.com/inside-job/ ] will be too confusing for your cognitively challenged self !
Keep "Dunkin' your Donuts, 2" at a time !!
Dork !!!
If you think this is miserable, give it another five years.
Inside Job The Corporation Sicko The Arrivals Series The Secret of OZ Captialism: A Love Story Farenheit 9/11 Invisible Empire Loose Change: Final Cut New World Order The Fall of the Republic The Obama Deception Wall Street & Wall Street: Money Never Sleeps Margin Call Food Inc.
MINISTRY OF FOREIGN AFFAIRS RUSSIAN FEDERATION INFORMATION AND PRESS DEPARTMENT
119200, Moscow G-200-Hay Smolensk Square., 32/34 tel. (499) 244 4119, Fax: (499) 244 4112 e-mail: dip@mid.ru, web-address: www.mid.ru
my friend! I understand poho in English, here's a link to official sources in Russia. ate will be able to - read it! That's interesting! http://www.mid.ru/brp_4.nsf/newsline/2B4694CD44B6411E44257974003E49C4 http://aftershock-1.livejournal.com/
MINISTRY OF FOREIGN AFFAIRS RUSSIAN FEDERATION INFORMATION AND PRESS DEPARTMENT
119200, Moscow G-200-Hay Smolensk Square., 32/34 tel. (499) 244 4119, Fax: (499) 244 4112 e-mail: dip@mid.ru, web-address: www.mid.ru
Report of the Russian Foreign Ministry "On the human rights situation in several of the world"
2076-28-12-2011 USA The situation in the U.S. is far from the ideals proclaimed by Washington. Home unsolved problem - an odious prison at Guantanamo Bay, where still contains 171 prisoner, suspected of having links with terrorists. President Obama legalized indefinite and extrajudicial imprisonment, as well as authorized the resumption of military tribunals. The current administration continues to use most of the methods of social control and the privacy of Americans, to adopt special services under the pretext of Bush's "war on terror." At the same time the White House and U.S. Justice Department harbor from liability CIA operatives and senior officials responsible for the massive and flagrant violations of human rights standards. There are continued violations of international humanitarian law in armed conflict and during anti-terrorist operations, indiscriminate and disproportionate use of force. Exacerbated long-standing systemic problems in American society, including racial discrimination, xenophobia, overcrowding, unreasonable use of the death penalty, including innocent, minors and the mentally ill, the imperfections of the electoral system and corruption. Deteriorated sharply implementation of basic socio-economic rights, including the collective rights of workers. In the chronic deficit of the federal and local budget crises appeared in the court system, including inadequate access to justice. The extraterritorial application of American law does the greatest harm in terms of US-Russian relations. It leads to a violation of fundamental rights and freedoms of Russian citizens, including arbitrary arrests and abductions from third countries, child abuse, criminal prosecution on the evidence "fake agents" and dubious evidence (the most obvious examples - the case of Viktor Bout, and KV Yaroshenko). During the presidency of Barack Obama's U.S. expanded its international legal obligations in the humanitarian field and continue to participate in only three of the nine core human rights treaties. The Americans have not yet ratified the Convention on the Elimination of All Forms of Discrimination against Women and the UN Convention on the Rights of the Child (it is also not only joined the Somalis). Washington refuses to cooperate with the Convention's mechanisms dealing with individual and collective complaints about violations of human rights by States, insisting that the American legal system copes with this problem without outside help. In January 2012 special prison at the naval base at Guantanamo Bay will turn 10 years old. In prison, the prisoner is 171 (at time of entry of Barack Obama in office - 242). Among them, a Russian citizen - who was arrested in 2002 in Pakistan, RK Mingazov. In July 2010, the first U.S. prisoner repatriated against his will: 35-year-old Algerian, A. Naji was sent home, despite fears that they are waiting for his new torture by the government or the Islamists. Obama has revised his earlier criticism of the military commissions. It authorized the resumption of their activities subject to the provision of additional guarantees defendants, inter alia, restrictions on the use of hearsay evidence and extracted under torture. As for the 48 high-risk guantanamovtsev, against which it is difficult to organize the criminal proceedings due to lack of sufficient evidence of their guilt or lapse of time, the administration decided to continue the practice of indefinite detention without charge. The same fate seemed to threaten 30 Yemenis, whose administration is ready to be repatriated only when their homeland "security conditions improve." In September 2006, Bush actually admitted the existence of secret CIA prisons, proclaiming the transfer of 14 prisoners detained in them to Guantanamo. As it became known later, in 2002-2003. intelligence services have been built about ten of these pre-trial detention, including in Afghanistan, Iraq, Thailand, Morocco, Romania, Lithuania and Poland, where the "legal vacuum" contained about 100 prisoners. On behalf of five former prisoners of the CIA organization, "American Civil Liberties Union" (ACLU) filed in U.S. federal court lawsuit against the subsidiary, "Boeing" - "Dzheppesen Deytaplen" whose aircraft were delivered trapped persons in secret prisons. However, the Obama Administration has blocked its consideration, citing "state secrets". At the same time in May this year The U.S. Supreme Court refused to consider plaintiffs' appeal. In violation of international legal obligations of the United States under the Convention against Torture Justice decided not to prosecute security officials who have used during the notorious "war on terror" harsh interrogation methods for terrorism suspects. Meanwhile, treatment of prisoners in secret CIA prisons was classified as torture, including the reports of the ICRC and the Commissioner for Human Rights Thomas Hammarberg Council of Europe. As a result of "interrogation" is not one prisoner died (spetsprokuror Dzh.Dyurhem, who in 2009 was asked to investigate the legality of techniques applied by the CIA to knock testimony, recommended to start criminal proceedings only in two cases of violent death). Did not suffer any penalties and former employees of the U.S. Department of Justice (eg, Dzh.Yu teaches law at the University of Berkeley, became a judge of the court Dzh.Baybi sht.Nevada, S. Bradbury advises on legal issues of one of the major presidential candidates in the upcoming elections the Republicans M . Romney), authorize the use of torture techniques such as prolonged sleep deprivation, confinement in boxes with insects, forced nudity, dousing with cold water and simulated drowning. Could not get justice in the U.S. of A. Rahim al Nashiri, who had been in U.S. secret prison in Afghanistan, Thailand and Poland. In this regard, in September 2010, a Saudi lawyers filed an application to the Polish prosecutor to investigate the content of their client in a secret prison in this country. For the same reason Yemeni M.al-Assad sent in March of this year complaint against another state that housed a secret CIA prison - Djibouti - the African Commission on Human Rights. Very revealing and was released in 2011 under the telling name of the report: "Torture away with: the treatment of detainees under the administration of George W. Bush," "Human Rights Watch," which in comparison with similar reports greatly expanded evidence base Crimes Bush pores and the persons who, according to NGOs, should be held personally criminally responsible (Bush himself, former Vice President Dick Cheney, Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld, CIA Director Dzh.Tenet, presidential adviser on national security Condoleezza Rice, Secretary of State Colin Powell, Attorney Dzh.Eshkroft a number of other senior officials, called "the developers of legalizing torture.") As the defenders, with the advent of Barack Obama U.S. intelligence agencies did not abandoned the practice of spying on the "internal enemy." In particular, it is in full swing started back in 2008, the investigation ties pacifist activists and trade union movement with foreign entities, which the administration has made the list of terrorist organizations - "the Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia," the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine and "Hezbollah". Among the suspects fall NGO staff, teachers, bloggers, religious leaders - all who openly criticizes U.S. policy in Latin America and the Middle East. Just last fall, subpoenas received 23 activist. In May of this year U.S. Congress extended the adopted after September 11, 2001, "USA Patriot Act." Law enforcement agencies are still able to monitor those suspected of extremism, even if they are not linked to specific terrorist organizations. In addition, FBI, NSA and other intelligence agencies retained virtually unlimited authority on wiretapping without warrants of telephone conversations and e-lustration and e-mail correspondence of persons and organizations suspected of terrorism.
my friend! I understand poho in English, here's a link to official sources in Russia. ate will be able to - read it! That's interesting! http://www.mid.ru/brp_4.nsf/newsline/2B4694CD44B6411E44257974003E49C4 http://aftershock-1.livejournal.com/
MINISTRY OF FOREIGN AFFAIRS RUSSIAN FEDERATION INFORMATION AND PRESS DEPARTMENT
119200, Moscow G-200-Hay Smolensk Square., 32/34 tel. (499) 244 4119, Fax: (499) 244 4112 e-mail: dip@mid.ru, web-address: www.mid.ru
Report of the Russian Foreign Ministry "On the human rights situation in several of the world"
2076-28-12-2011 USA The situation in the U.S. is far from the ideals proclaimed by Washington. Home unsolved problem - an odious prison at Guantanamo Bay, where still contains 171 prisoner, suspected of having links with terrorists. President Obama legalized indefinite and extrajudicial imprisonment, as well as authorized the resumption of military tribunals. The current administration continues to use most of the methods of social control and the privacy of Americans, to adopt special services under the pretext of Bush's "war on terror." At the same time the White House and U.S. Justice Department harbor from liability CIA operatives and senior officials responsible for the massive and flagrant violations of human rights standards. There are continued violations of international humanitarian law in armed conflict and during anti-terrorist operations, indiscriminate and disproportionate use of force. Exacerbated long-standing systemic problems in American society, including racial discrimination, xenophobia, overcrowding, unreasonable use of the death penalty, including innocent, minors and the mentally ill, the imperfections of the electoral system and corruption. Deteriorated sharply implementation of basic socio-economic rights, including the collective rights of workers. In the chronic deficit of the federal and local budget crises appeared in the court system, including inadequate access to justice. The extraterritorial application of American law does the greatest harm in terms of US-Russian relations. It leads to a violation of fundamental rights and freedoms of Russian citizens, including arbitrary arrests and abductions from third countries, child abuse, criminal prosecution on the evidence "fake agents" and dubious evidence (the most obvious examples - the case of Viktor Bout, and KV Yaroshenko). During the presidency of Barack Obama's U.S. expanded its international legal obligations in the humanitarian field and continue to participate in only three of the nine core human rights treaties. The Americans have not yet ratified the Convention on the Elimination of All Forms of Discrimination against Women and the UN Convention on the Rights of the Child (it is also not only joined the Somalis). Washington refuses to cooperate with the Convention's mechanisms dealing with individual and collective complaints about violations of human rights by States, insisting that the American legal system copes with this problem without outside help. In January 2012 special prison at the naval base at Guantanamo Bay will turn 10 years old. In prison, the prisoner is 171 (at time of entry of Barack Obama in office - 242). Among them, a Russian citizen - who was arrested in 2002 in Pakistan, RK Mingazov. In July 2010, the first U.S. prisoner repatriated against his will: 35-year-old Algerian, A. Naji was sent home, despite fears that they are waiting for his new torture by the government or the Islamists. Obama has revised his earlier criticism of the military commissions. It authorized the resumption of their activities subject to the provision of additional guarantees defendants, inter alia, restrictions on the use of hearsay evidence and extracted under torture. As for the 48 high-risk guantanamovtsev, against which it is difficult to organize the criminal proceedings due to lack of sufficient evidence of their guilt or lapse of time, the administration decided to continue the practice of indefinite detention without charge. The same fate seemed to threaten 30 Yemenis, whose administration is ready to be repatriated only when their homeland "security conditions improve." In September 2006, Bush actually admitted the existence of secret CIA prisons, proclaiming the transfer of 14 prisoners detained in them to Guantanamo. As it became known later, in 2002-2003. intelligence services have been built about ten of these pre-trial detention, including in Afghanistan, Iraq, Thailand, Morocco, Romania, Lithuania and Poland, where the "legal vacuum" contained about 100 prisoners. On behalf of five former prisoners of the CIA organization, "American Civil Liberties Union" (ACLU) filed in U.S. federal court lawsuit against the subsidiary, "Boeing" - "Dzheppesen Deytaplen" whose aircraft were delivered trapped persons in secret prisons. However, the Obama Administration has blocked its consideration, citing "state secrets". At the same time in May this year The U.S. Supreme Court refused to consider plaintiffs' appeal. In violation of international legal obligations of the United States under the Convention against Torture Justice decided not to prosecute security officials who have used during the notorious "war on terror" harsh interrogation methods for terrorism suspects. Meanwhile, treatment of prisoners in secret CIA prisons was classified as torture, including the reports of the ICRC and the Commissioner for Human Rights Thomas Hammarberg Council of Europe. As a result of "interrogation" is not one prisoner died (spetsprokuror Dzh.Dyurhem, who in 2009 was asked to investigate the legality of techniques applied by the CIA to knock testimony, recommended to start criminal proceedings only in two cases of violent death). Did not suffer any penalties and former employees of the U.S. Department of Justice (eg, Dzh.Yu teaches law at the University of Berkeley, became a judge of the court Dzh.Baybi sht.Nevada, S. Bradbury advises on legal issues of one of the major presidential candidates in the upcoming elections the Republicans M . Romney), authorize the use of torture techniques such as prolonged sleep deprivation, confinement in boxes with insects, forced nudity, dousing with cold water and simulated drowning. Could not get justice in the U.S. of A. Rahim al Nashiri, who had been in U.S. secret prison in Afghanistan, Thailand and Poland. In this regard, in September 2010, a Saudi lawyers filed an application to the Polish prosecutor to investigate the content of their client in a secret prison in this country. For the same reason Yemeni M.al-Assad sent in March of this year complaint against another state that housed a secret CIA prison - Djibouti - the African Commission on Human Rights. Very revealing and was released in 2011 under the telling name of the report: "Torture away with: the treatment of detainees under the administration of George W. Bush," "Human Rights Watch," which in comparison with similar reports greatly expanded evidence base Crimes Bush pores and the persons who, according to NGOs, should be held personally criminally responsible (Bush himself, former Vice President Dick Cheney, Defense Secretary Donald Rumsfeld, CIA Director Dzh.Tenet, presidential adviser on national security Condoleezza Rice, Secretary of State Colin Powell, Attorney Dzh.Eshkroft a number of other senior officials, called "the developers of legalizing torture.") As the defenders, with the advent of Barack Obama U.S. intelligence agencies did not abandoned the practice of spying on the "internal enemy." In particular, it is in full swing started back in 2008, the investigation ties pacifist activists and trade union movement with foreign entities, which the administration has made the list of terrorist organizations - "the Revolutionary Armed Forces of Colombia," the Popular Front for the Liberation of Palestine and "Hezbollah". Among the suspects fall NGO staff, teachers, bloggers, religious leaders - all who openly criticizes U.S. policy in Latin America and the Middle East. Just last fall, subpoenas received 23 activist. In May of this year U.S. Congress extended the adopted after September 11, 2001, "USA Patriot Act." Law enforcement agencies are still able to monitor those suspected of extremism, even if they are not linked to specific terrorist organizations. In addition, FBI, NSA and other intelligence agencies retained virtually unlimited authority on wiretapping without warrants of telephone conversations and e-lustration and e-mail correspondence of persons and organizations suspected of terrorism.
my friend! I understand poho in English, here's a link to official sources in Russia. ate will be able to - read it! That's interesting! http://www.mid.ru/brp_4.nsf/newsline/2B4694CD44B6411E44257974003E49C4 http://aftershock-1.livejournal.com/
I agree completely
Talk about miserable. You actually counted the number of people who post here regularly? Sounds like you are desperately in need of a social life.
I do find the need to wash my hands more after being on here. I feel dirty and nasty. The battle against people wanting to take my money is important to fight. Fighting is dirty. You will not get our money. I'm not the miserable person that started this movement. I was "happy" before and you cant bring us down. I'm in for the fight.
Who wants your money? Not me. In fact I tell people who want to give money to the movement to keep it and join the movement. Bodies are a lot more important than the currency of the 1%.
If THIS movement is NOT about money, as YOU just wrote, what is the purpose? If the end game has to do with money, then your statement is not truth.
The only political statement that OWS has made is called the Declaration of the Occupation of New York City. It is available on the NYC GA link and elsewhere on the web. It is not about money. It is about power. It is about fundamentally transforming social relations. Thought through is is really about building towards what would amount to a post money society. Anybody who thinks OWS is about money has an extremely narrow conception of the world,
Actually, the only nasty, miserable people who are heartless and callous in this forum are the troll folks like you.
Poor sugar daddies! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9kLaupKL938&feature=related
One Question "Dunki"...how, exactly, did you manage to type this b.s., with your head buried shoulder-deep in Papa Bear Bill O'Reilly's gaping asspipe?
You are unhappy at the world. Your welfare check that I paid for late?
I agree with you but if you feel so strongly then why are you here on this forum? I'm sure you have better things to do.
Have you ever heard of "civil discourse?"
If you have heard of it, are you for or against it?
If you are for it, this forum helps the debate. If you are against it, perhaps you'd advocate a return to feudal times. Or perhaps you might be happier in countries in which people are too afraid to have civil discourse, and so it doesn't happen. Or, you might be happier in third world countries in which people are so desperately poor they don't have time for such things. Is this what you prefer?
Please don't criticize people for posting legitimate concerns about the very real issue of the 1% versus the 99%.
Just look at the C.I.A.'s numbers on this issue. It is spelled out very clearly there, probably slightly in favor of the upper 1%, but pretty close to reality.
Engaging in a conversation in order to promote understanding or ideas? Yeah sounds good. I do use this forum to debate. I am against the ideas of the movement and am here to understand them. I am happy here just fine. I actually want to go back to the system we had when we first started out as a country. Did you read his post? Its bashing you and me so I'm not sure why you're jumping on my back.
It's good we can agree on the importance of returning "to the system we had when we first started out as a country."
When I hear this phrase quoted above, what comes to my mind is a constitutionally based system of government, a capitalist economy based in the rule of law, no more royalty, no more feudalism, a chance at self-determination, and basic transparency throughout.
Do we agree on this?
You're right, the other was jumping all over you and we are probably more or less on the same side.
Yes sir we can. Probably off topic but I hate that the people that hold office are the way they are. Originally the congress and senate was set up as a way to offer you services as a citizen to your country. Somehow it has turned into a lifelong career which it was never meant to be. I agree with everything else you said but does that make sense?
Yes, this makes sense. Perhaps congress and senate office holders should be supported for the important work they do, so they are able to fulfill the functions of their job (meetings, negotiations, vote-taking/giving, and following legislative rules, you know, all that officiating stuff that some get good at) but the idea that "corporations are people" allows them to give millions to sway office holders to do what they want, rather than the people's business.
Congressional office holders might make it a career, but it shouldn't be the case that only the very wealthy get to take office, which we see happening today. Practically all congressional office holders are pretty wealthy, though I'm not sure they are all in the top 1% of wealth-holders in our country. Do you know what the net worths are of most in congress today?
It wasn't meant to be a lifelong career, but some people have a real knack for being effective within that sphere and should be recognized in this respect. If they are truly serving the public good, they should be allowed to stay.
Of course they need some form of compensation because of the work they are doing but they don't need to be able to get all of the extra perks that they get for serving one term or all of the extras that they do get.
You are also correct on your second point. To tell you the truth I plan on running and gaining as much public support as I can in order to get into Congress and then get rid of the pension, the special healthcare, and the special retirement funds that they get along with social security. I may eventually make a hypocrite out of myself because just that would take a lifetime if not more to accomplish.
Well, it's all a matter of degree. Participating in the leadership of a country as huge as ours isn't easy, and some compensation is in order. I wouldn't begrudge an office holder from a minimal pension and health care benefits similar to what most people SHOULD receive. I don't think ridding congress completely of any benefits whatsoever should be an office-seeker's overall mission.
What would your mission be?
No I mean they get the normal reimbursements and then the extra stuff. Removing the personal gain incentives may help remove some of the greedy office holders.
There aren't very many "greedy office holders." It's a matter of necessity. At the present time, an office seeker can't compete with other office seekers supported by the wealthiest 1%.
Money corrupts the election process. When corporations and unions are able to give unlimited amounts of money (billions) to help elect (through advertising, etc.) their candidate of choice, the system has become corrupted. If one office holder receives three million dollars from one special interest, but another on the other side of the issue receives five million dollars from a competing special interest, moneyed influence within congress has gotten out of hand. "Corporations" aren't "people" and shouldn't be allowed to corrupt our government this way.
If we got back to basics, where the "Fairness Doctrine" still applied in broadcast debates, and journalism was allowed to function fairly without being subject to moneyed interests' biases, we would be able to understand where candidates stand on the issues.
Yes you are correct. Thank you for this exchange of ideas.
Here is my answer. In our neighborhood we have a Watch Program. Nope,,,, no bad guys out there today. But we watch to see if there are any. If you dont pay attention to what is going on then you are taken for a ride. This group needs to be watched because we will all be taken for a ride if we are not watching. I dont want YOU to change legislation that I enjoy. In a couple of days there will be a new law in California that requires schools to teach GAY history. I had not idea. That is discusting. I dont want some GROUP to change the way things have worked to meet some miserable life style. Gays are miserable and they want attention so everyone else will be miserable with them. If they want to be gay,,,, fine,,, but dont shove it down everyones throat because they are miserable. OWS is the same way. I want to read what is going on and I will decide if I agree or disagree,,, not some Girl Friday tramp.
I'm sure that's how many people felt about black people as well.
Blacks,,,,, oh,,, the race card. And after all that has been given to the blacks,,,, they still cant figure out how to get themselves out of being the minority minded people while people from other countries come here and become successful. The blacks,,, just like you,,, have fallen into the,,, GIVE ME SOMETHING,,, liberal mind. You get what you voted and asked for. MISERY.
I didn't attack you over your facts did I? It was not a race card at all I was just providing an example. I don't give a damn what race people are I was just giving an example. And I'm not liberal and I've never had the ability to vote.
You used blacks. Here is the difference. You CAN work at it to become rich,,,, (if rich is having enough money to be happy with what you live withing). You cant be un-black. Dont compare the fight for racial equality and having the backbone to work.
What kind of work does your "backbone" allow you to do?
Aside from typing, of course.
I get up at 5:30 am each morning and get more work done before 7:30 than you could in a year.
Not an answer to the question.
Besides, before I retired, I got up at 4, so I'd have you beat by 6:30, anyway.
Why be so evasive?
I figured you must have gotten up at 4:00. Had I said 3:00 your mind would FORCE you to say you got up at 2:00. Give it a rest.
Another lame response.
I'll be honest. I built axles for Ford Motor.
The line starts early.
Honesty, is not your best suit then?
Why so evasive?
Stop working for THE MAN. Call in and leave that CORPORATION. Unless you like corporations.
So, you're unemployed?
(((((Still, you have problems with question answering.
Then you make a statement, based on assumption.
Dishonesty, is your strong suit, then?))))
So you do like corporations.
I will answer, after you do.
I detest dishonesty.
You have shown me none.
You work for FORD, a corporation. You hate corporations. I would guess you would turn your back on the corporation. Seems logical,,,,, dont you agree? I dont know how you can hate and worship the same thing.
Still, you have problems with question answering.
Then you make a statement, based on assumption.
Dishonesty, is your strong suit, then?
You used gays. You don't do that either. Before you jump to wild and ridiculous conclusions apply your 3 brain cells and think. You made the reference to gays and how even though they are people they do not deserve to be included in human history books. You fucking homophobe all I did was make the comparison to blacks and gays. And bring on the absurd comment................now
Geeezzzz, you still missed the original point. OK,, you use the race card,,, NOW the homophobe,,,, can you just include all the liberal democrat talking points in one memo and get them over with?
I didn't use the fucking race card. I gave you an example of where you thinking most likely has been applied before and the fact that I used the word black in the example is the only thing you fixated on. I actually agree with everything you've said other than the liberal shit and the fact that I used a race card.
Now we know how ill-informed you are, DunkiDonut2.
I happen to be straight, but gayness is not a choice. People are simply born with more pronounced orientations one way or another, and some people's don't correspond with their gender in ways most people take for granted. Those most vociferously against the gay lifestyle are usually those who are closeted gays in some way.
We dont need a history lessons for our children on gays. Gays want attention. They are miserable and need attention even if they have FORCE it on you. That is the problem. I dont care if you are gay,,, I DONT CARE,,,, be a miserable gay person,, leave me alone.
Everyone wants attention. In that sense we understand how the young feel. So many recent college graduates can't find jobs anymore in America. I certainly respect people's need for attention. I don't always agree with their points of view. It doesn't mean I am exactly like them. I only appreciate their pleas.
I just don't see how anyone is trying to "force" anyone else to adopt an orientation or assume a lifestyle. Please understand every sane, normal, healthy individual is susceptible to peer pressure. I remember feeling very concerned about it in junior high and high school. Luckily I was fortunate to be around people who told me to ignore most of it and just try to do my best to do what's right, and that advice has served me very well, including during the most recent decade, in which my peers spent lots of money buying expensive houses, etc., while we simply paid our small house off. We recognize peer pressure and see beyond it to what's really right for our individual situation and remain very grateful to simply be healthy, able to work, pay our way, live with a modicum of dignity, and that's it. I have some gay friends who are totally delightful. I celebrate them too. You should not begrudge them their rights to live with a modicum of dignity, to be justly compensated for their work and contributions, and otherwise mind their own business. I don't see the "force" that you're talking about. Perhaps the plight of poor Matthew Shepherd a decade or so ago still bothers all of us. We can't allow anything like that to happen ever again.
I think it's kinda cool. I'm reliving the 60's. they are protesting the exact same things as they did back then, Pretty soon we may even see another Woodstock
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Joined Dec. 28, 2011
How silly. I am a committed OWS supporter and i am saving money every month. I just don't waste them on luxury items i don't need. I however see the system is corrupt and the future looks bleak for everyone. If you can't see that continue with your life and ignore OWS.
People already thought everything would change with Obama, now it's the next president. Good luck with that.
Get a good night sleep and wake up tomorrow not worrying about some rich guy. Get a life and move on just as people have done for 200+ years. And people are still flocking to America from other countries DAILY to get what you are miserable over. They come here and succeed and you whine. Get a life person.....
Why are you so anxious to think we're miserable? I am not. We are simply worried about the future. Your blindness is pitiful.
Dont you think,,, just for a second,,, that your same words have been used over and over during many different time in American and world history? The difference is that 50 years ago people worked to solve their own problems. Today, YOU want me to solve your problems. You have discovered that you are not capable of taking care of yourself and you are miserable at some old rich fart. You probably dont even know the name of one rich fart. Someone planted this rich crap in your head and,,,,,"I'll go with that this month." Most of us just want you people to leave us alone so we can enjoy what we have worked for. We didnt work for YOU.
Do you think you could stop using such foul language? Just be polite.
I dont know that I have ever used foul language in my entire life.
Oh yes you have.
Happy New Years all of you OWS losers.
Go back to high school kid; go knock some other movement or go play video games and tweet on your i phone. I think calling other people miserable, just points the finger back at you donut
I'm 60 years old. Very successful. Have owned and sold a handful of businesses. I have money invested in the stock market and will not need the Social Security money to live on,,, but will take it so you cant have it. Nice home, grandkids. Shows just how stupid YOU are.
You hit the nail on the head and it's going to hurt the 32 (not 21) people on here. Unfortunately this site will be gone in a few months. My entertainment will end. This has been the greatest collection of whiny douchebags. I'll miss it.
Where will you go next? I'll make sure to stay away.
Starbucks.That's where most of you losers work!
I don't work there.
So, we're losers if we can't find a job, and losers if we can find one, according to you, o knowing one.
Have a nice life!
Get a job. It's easy.
I already have one and work very hard to do it well.
Too many others aren't so lucky.
Why is that?
High taxes, Obama, Barney frank, chris Dodd and Nancy pilosi.
Oh, well. I didn't think you had any constructive answers. Thank you for giving me the chance to clarify my own thinking about important issues. I'll respond if you have something helpful to discuss, but not if you don't.
Happy New Year!
Try pharmaceutical sales. Plenty of jobs. Both my sisters kids just got $50,000 jobs right out of college. Both companies said applications have never been so low. They also got cars and gas cards! 21 years old! Boy and a girl. Boy has a degree in history, girl has a degree in English.
Actually, It has been a little fun watching these people drag themselves down the drain. It is like watching miserable lab mice try to figure out how to grab a free piece of cheese. I cant imagine waking up each day and all you have on your mind is some rich guy and hating him so much you will live in a TENT.. Good GOD people,,,, grow up and get a life. Move on.
Is life a contest to see who can hate the best?
If it is, you are pretty far ahead of most people.
Happy New Year!
98% of us were happy,, just enjoying the vast and great amount of opportunities. Then comes along YOU, OWS, and you want to demand things that piss everyone off. We were just fine but YOU had to show hate toward the 98% of us that follow the 1% rich and the 1% OWS types. We were doing fine until you started the HATE. We didnt.
Whoops! I forgot my own resolution not to respond anymore to people like you who are being paid by the 1% to pretend they don't hear the truth, to continue to spread lies, to try to "catapult the truth" by repeating the same lies over and over and over and over again until generations come and go, more confused than ever by your lie-spew machine.
Whoops! You won't debate the writings of the founding fathers, you won't look at our own Central Intelligence Agency's own numbers detailing vast and expanding wealth disparities, you won't be polite, you will be rude, false, mean, etc.
Whoops!
It's a short life. Why don't you do something right for a change?
You're wasting your time trying to "convince" me of your point of view by BULLYING. I won't be responding to your pointless posts. You are just a mean person with no principles in your life, and you aren't interested in improving or solving anything for anyone. It must be torture to be you.
No principles? Are you kidding? I believe in the principles that have been in America for over 200 years and going back to Kings thousands of years ago. OUR principles have worked very well. No bullying,, cant be bullying on our part. YOU are the bully, wanting to CHANGE the way of life WE have E-N-J-O-Y-E-D. YOU ARE THE BULLY. And here is the test. "Dear ebri and OWS, Please LEAVE us ALONE." There you go. You bother us and you are the bully. If life in America has grown to the best in history, how can we have no principles? What lies? Not one lie. TRUTH is based on century after century of growth.
Growth is good. I support growth and hope we can maintain growth as in the past. I am not sure we can sustain the levels of growth we experienced during the 1950's and 60's, or what we've seen in China and Brazil recently -- although Brazil's growth is worth studying. We would do well to take a cue from Brazil's economic and social policies contributing to that growth.
Global economics have always been changing, with some periods of change more dynamic than others. My thought was technological advances in the last fifty years have culminated in the possibility of raising living standards for EVERYONE, not just a few (America, in relation to much of the rest of the world, for instance, post-World War II).
This doesn't mean we'd do away with competition, or pretend the drive to compete doesn't exist, or stifle healthy competition, or anything like that. The world will always, whether we like it or not, remain a highly competitive place, in which there are only a few really bright stars at any given time.
I'm sure you're familiar with games unfairly tilted in one team's favor, for whatever reason. Wouldn't you rather see competition between equally talented players? Isn't that a lot more fun?
Competition has always been alive and well everywhere you look. Our challenge is to properly manage it so as not to completely squash the disadvantaged, which for me takes all the fun out of it. How about you?
Ha ha ha, classic.
How miserable do you have to be to want to live in a tent in downtown NY?
Lets change the world. It is five minutes until noon. Let's get on it right after lunch. All in favor? "OK that is 21 votes for,,, 0 against"
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For the past 45 years I got along just fine without the help of anyone trying to do my bidding for me and have been successful.
I don't need anyone doing my bidding for me I can do it myself. If I want a job I will find it. If I want to become wealthy and rich I can do it. If I want a house, I will find a way to buy it. If I need food on my table I will find a way to provide.
It's all about determination and not expecting someone else to do it for me. That's what our country was founded on for if it was not, we wouldn't be here now.
Who's fault is it when someone gets so far in debt that they can't pay their bills? Who's fault is it when someone decides to invest in a college degree that there isn't a job for them when they graduate? Who's fault is it - it sure as hell isn't mine because I know how to survive - lots of you who are out there protesting don't and as a result you blame others because of it.
What I own is what I worked for - traveling the country looking for a job - that's what it took - not sitting in a park somewhere complaining about what others have.
It's all about knowing how to be independent - when you learn to do this there will be no need to complain about what others have because you will know how to have it yourself.
Todays society doesn't have a clue as to what it takes to succede because they weren't taught. They want it handed to them without having to work for it.
If this country was shut down because of a catastrophy there would be rioting in the streets - look at what happend in NO when they were flooded out.
Look how Japan handled the flood over there - you never heard about rioting or shooting - that's the difference between being independent and dependent.
There are those who know how to succede and then there are the ones who doing know how to succed who think someone else should provide for them.
Think about it.
In order to understand what OWS is all about and to understand just why So Many Peoople are SO angry, please watch the film "INSIDE JOB", The Latest Working Link : http://documentarystorm.com/inside-job/ and then ...
"Think about it" !!!
ad iudicium ...
Amen Brother!
See http://documentarystorm.com/inside-job/ so as to 'get a handle' on things ;-)
You are so correct. Some people only know how to whine, complain and TAKE something that does not belong to them. Then they dont get it when others, even from other countries, pass them with very little problems to succeed. The people on here only know how to complain. I wish them nothing but what they deserve,,, NOTHING.
It has been proven that in the past 15 years, the high school studens from other countries are much smarter then the high school students in this country.
They are also savvy when it comes to understanding the "global economy".
A study shows that out of 36 industrial countries around the world, the U.S. ranks 24th in math at the 8th grade level. A liberal agenda education, (beginning in 2012, California will require schools to teach gay and lesbian history) is our problem. This OWS movement is another route to dumbing down America.
I think a lot of the problem has to do with not understanding what being competitive means. Whe people are competitive they learn from it. They learn what it takes to be successful.
Todays schools think that when a team wins there are no losers - everyone is a winner even though not all participated. It has all to do with "being politically correct and not hurting someones feelings"
They teach the little tykes that you get an "A" for trying. You get an "A" even if the answer is wrong. You should never be punished. Then,,, when they grow up and the rest of the world is kicking their ass they go,,,,, "WHAT THE HELL IS HAPPENING TO ME?" I never had to do anything for myself. I need someone to wipe my butt for me. I'M MISERABLE and it is not fair that you arent miserable with me'
I think your a little wrong on that. It's about misery, conspiracy theories with no proof, paranoia, crap tv shows, and every once in a while, a good idea
I like the book Misery. The movie wasn't too bad.
That's a pretty good summary of the current state of this forum.
techjunkie nailed what is going on here. let me expound even more. OWS has devolved into a fascist cult with a tinge of religiosity. fascism needed a bad guy, in Germany it was the Jews, here its wall street financiers. The nazis early on took to street violence culminating in kristallnacht, here is police confrontation. OWS assumes a mantle of moral superiority, "money" and "wealth" accumulation are morally bad. there is a religipus fervor to protecting the "mother ship", ie the tent protests, even when they have lost value. if you ask for facts to support their positions, they give back only beliefs. techjunkie used "creationists" as a fiiting comparison and was dead right. there is no emphasis on personal responsibilty at all.
Huh?
there is also an extraordinary high level of frusration here, mainly because almost no one understands economics at all. there is no understanding if finance, of outsourcing, of competition, of how money works. the maases of OWS want some "god" to wave a wand and better their plight. that isnt america at all. america has always been about working very hard to achieve. no one here wants to achieve. for goodness sake start a 3rd party, hold a primary, create a voter base. nope, just camp out in tents and taunt police.
the contrast with rhe tea party is informative. the tea party worked on votes. they understand the currency of power is votes. its not blocking highways, its votes. deliver votes and you can move the dialogue. organize, elect a leadership and create a mass of votes. if you want taxes raised supply votes to legislators that hear your cry. walk into Harry Reids office and say, we are OWS and we have 20 million voters who will back you if you want ti raise tax rates on the wealthy. we have your back.
or you can smoke pot, sleep in a tent and knock down elderly citizens. which might have resonance with the common man?
Diogenes : You have superciliously append "Truth" to your moniker but only display specious, tendentious and subjective "cynicism" in your apathetic negativist's anti-OWS posts above.
Re. "almost no one understands economics at all. there is no understanding of finance, of outsourcing, of competition, of how money works." : So illuminate the rest of us then !
Or, conversely watch the film "INSIDE JOB", The Latest Working Link : http://documentarystorm.com/inside-job/ , for an insight into what motivates OWS ; it's rationale ; raison d'etre and the reason why OWS is so important !!
Your amnesia &/or ignorance as well your faith in the "Demoblican / Republocrat" faux choice are all rather eYe Opening !!!
respice ; adspice ; prospice ...
Automation and outsourcing of jobs is inevitable. The middle class cannot be protected. the days if a steel worker or auto worker with a limited skill high school education having a $25 hour job with benefits is gone. The Tea party worked within the electoral system to effect the change they wanted and they got it by electing Tea Party congressmen. Elect OWS congressmen and you have a chance and you can be seen not as fascists but as citizens engaged in the politics of america.
What? So you think it is futile to fight for a middle class lifestyle?
Really? We disagree on this key point.
The middle class CAN be protected if adults are in charge.
Thank you for encouraging political activism or participation. This is something only a healthy middle class can do. The middle class MUST, almost religiously (if you are at all spiritual) be protected. Even if you are not religious or spiritual (I am fine with that), for an economically sustainable, productive, and profitable future, we must support and sustain a healthy middle class.
I know it may seem boring, adult, tedious, and difficult to provide the transparency a healthy middle class needs to flourish. Has the middle class personally caused you any problems?
A few in the upper 1% probably pay goons to come in and "knock down elderly citizens." Did you ever consider that possibility? Wouldn't it be in their best interests to quell orderly assemblies of this nature?
I don't include the ethical citizens of the 1%, of which I am sure there are many. Just a few of the 1% have co-opted the rest of the wealthiest 1% and turned it into crony capitalism and corruption. Stereotyping isn't productive, but observation of the math and numbers involved is. Consult the C.I.A.'s numbers of wealth distribution throughout the world and the gross, inhumane inequities will become apparent.
The same percentage of folks who go in and ruin a peaceful OWS rally is likely the same percentage of the wealthiest 1% who ruin capitalism for the rest of us: VERY SMALL. This is all we are talking about. Successful practice in any profession is only possible with discipline within the ranks. That's why there are medical ethics boards, law review boards, credentialing commissions, administrative law judges, and others to help maintain professional standards, to help SERVE THE PUBLIC INTEREST. We demand the very wealthiest 1% also SERVE THE PUBLIC INTEREST in their endeavors, that the ideology around "free market" policies" takes this necessity into account. Otherwise, we might as well all live in Afghanistan.
I have seen the videos, OWSers knocked down old ladies. If you want to tax the rich and redisribute their income, you have to vote. Right now you look like a video game caricature of what the Nazis were 80 years ago.
No they didn't. You may have seen some deranged homeless hangers-on do something pretty bad, but these people are simply more prevalent during these hard times, and you're likely to see more and more of them if the very wealthy .1% don't change their ways. These homeless, mentally-ill individuals need to be kept in a mental health facility, but those have been closed, and so we see more and more of them on the streets wreaking havoc everywhere. It's really shameful.
The question should be, why have mental health facilities been closed?
OWS isn't about hurting anyone, it's about fairness in a new time of better living conditions made possible through advances in technology, automation, science, entrepreneurial innovation, research, development, and the like.
The possibility that a sociopath like Hitler could ever mobilize the population as he did 80 years ago is hopefully more remote in this computerized age. Within an ethical, transparent society, we can better monitor potential leaders' activities to insure against this ever happening again, thankfully. Please don't be afraid of OWS.
Honest question. How long will this take? I can tell you, at least 10 years. At least 2 or 3 presidential cycles. Can you last?
I am not sure I understand the context of this question "How long will this take?" Please ask "How long will it take for __ to occur?" and fill in the blank with the event/process, etc., to which you are referring.
Then I can answer the question. Thank you.
How long will it take to alter the tax structure of this country such that we run a balanced budget?
If elected officials in congress could communicate with each other, instead of engage in obstructionist point-scoring political jackhammering, and if corporate personhood were repealed, we could solve our tax system problems quickly.
Why do these things have to take prohibitively long times to do?
A very few of the wealthiest 1% profit off of the current tax structure, and they have the power to obstruct the will of the rest of us. A few at the very top are contributing mightily to the problem rather than the solution.
As long as the wealthiest 1% continue to accrue greater and greater wealth, and as long as corporations (much more so than unions) contribute unlimited amounts of money to politicians who will do their bidding, our budget will go the way of third world nations.
Politics are center-seeking, and third party candidates aren't the answer. We have no choice but to get involved in our current system and work to institute necessary reforms.
Total BS diogenessssssds
Then get to it and get out the vote. I dont disgree with some of the platform planks, but this tent camping and police confrontation is stupid. Form a party or voting bloc and effect real change. That means clean up, dress right, and form political alliances.
The political alliance we're talking about is already in power to some degree. I have voted since Reagan first came into office. Third parties rarely help solve problems. Politics is inherently center-seeking and change must be effected within our two-party system, as difficult and messy as this is.
so you get it, but you still think tent camping and acting like Nazi storm troopers is the best way to get traction with the common man. Thats silly.
Here is a framework for you:
Put on a coat and tie. Denounce pot. Denounce counter culture nonsense. Engage at local electoral meetings at the grass roots. work from within not without.
I actually have never, ever attended any OWS rally. I understand the risk to myself too well to engage in this kind of activity.
It's not that I disapprove of such activity. I see it as a way to dramatize the hard times so many people are facing. Many OWS rally participants have lost their jobs, homes, livelihoods, etc., and have nothing left to lose. This is how bad things have gotten.
The question is, why have so many people lost everything? Why are so many homeless, disabled, and mentally ill people not helped out in our society? Why are we not able to help "the least among us?"
I live like a cub scout and engage at local electoral meetings at the grass roots. My participation on this blog is an example of working within, not from without.
Well at least you can speak coherently. So many here cannot. This is working without, not within.
It will be very difficult to protect lesser skilled or unskilled workers from the realities of a global economy. Will you yourself pay $75 for a tee shirt made by your neighbor or $3 made by a Sri Lankan? You as an individual might but no most people will not.
If I buy a T-shirt or any other article of clothing for $75 I must REALLY, REALLY need it, or can't make it myself. Factories have made clothing and other necessities cheaper all over the world. Workers in this global economy are all human beings and deserve fair, reasonable working conditions. If a T-shirt only costs $3, some worker isn't getting compensated fairly. And whose fault is this? The greedy corporations and fraction of the wealthiest 1% who are, frankly, pathologically greedy at this point in time.