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Forum Post: Whats Next For the Movement? A Discussion on Strategy. (Updated Dec11th, 2012)

Posted 1 year ago on Nov. 3, 2012, 2:55 a.m. EST by 10N (134)
This content is user submitted and not an official statement

This is a forum for ideas, and not opinions. How could the movement better strategized. What tools or skills are short? Could we be better structured?

To beat a corporation, should we not have our own business plan? Should we not be taking an accounting of our resources and skills in order to make one?

Any ideas or thoughts? No Rants please...

Idea #1: http://occupywallst.org/forum/proposal-a-tek-tool-to-fight-coruption

UPDATE -> Idea #2: This "Wikipedia" template is where people can work on an "idea(s)" through contribution similarly to Wikipedia, building a business plan for a Revolution/Protest. See Diagram Below... UPDATE -> https://www.dropbox.com/sh/3busdotbcnpexte/x308IE5pGF Visit Forum http://occupywallst.org/forum/occupy-hubpedia-technical-specifications/

Idea #3: Protest All 2014 made Cars Globally with the exception of 100% Electric Cars. (They did it in the 70's I think we can do it today?!a?)

Idea #4 TACTICS FOR "DEMANDS FOR CONGRESS" http://www.occupywallst.org/forum/you-may-have-seen-this-list-of-8-practical-goals-b/

Idea #5 Referendum for Mass Layoffs http://occupywallst.org/forum/referendum-for-mass-layoffs/


(Update)Recommended http://occupywallst.org/forum/occupy-is-a-fleet-of-ships-and-there-is-no-they-in/


Facebook: Occupy Ten'n

Twitter: Occupy10N

245 Comments

245 Comments


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[-] 3 points by gnomunny (6614) from St Louis, MO 1 year ago

Unfortunately, this forum is more like a coffee house than an organization. How do you structure a coffee house? Is it possible to form some kind of business plan with such a diverse group? I imagine it's possible but don't know how we would go about it. Taking account of the forum's resources and skills would be a good start, but you may come up a little short. A lot of participants come here just as much to socialize, I think, than to actually get things done. There are some doing some good work though.

[-] 2 points by rayolite (461) 1 year ago

If we share the constitution as defining the principles of the nation, yes.

"Is it possible to form some kind of business plan with such a diverse group?"

Further, if the constitution has mutual, equal value, then acknowledging what we share begins to have the requisite for the ultimate democratic action, Article V.

Acknowledging the principles of the constitution that protect "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness" makes us , "the rightful masters of the congress and the courts" (Lincoln 1859).

Aligning strategy parallel to accepted legal process is always a good idea.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

I'm thinking breaking down the tasks into mini tasks and have them available on an app. think of it as mini transaction, except for tasks, say a lawyer is need to overlook something, that task would be on a list. if the plan was broken down as part of it's plan...

Also if 1 out of every 1000 coffee drinkers you get one serious, now youre planing

[-] 1 points by gnomunny (6614) from St Louis, MO 1 year ago

Also bear in mind that this forum is only a small part of OWS. I'm not sure how many come to lurk on a regular basis, but as far as people that post to this forum, there might be fifty, maybe.

[-] 0 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

well... now there 51, do any of them have an MBA? or involved in census taking.

[-] 1 points by gnomunny (6614) from St Louis, MO 1 year ago

There's a fair chance someone on here does in both cases. Penguento, for example is an ex-politician turned businessman, I believe, but apparently has no faith in OWS.

Anyway, I gotta sign off (it's 3:15AM) so if you have more questions, I'll have to try to answer them tomorrow. Just go ahead and ask and I'll catch it when I log in.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

Cool, I'm about to log off myself. Nice to meet you.. I'll think of a few questions, that's for sure... talk soon.

[-] 2 points by peacehurricane (293) 1 year ago

One thing that can make a huge difference is simpler than whole business plan and may speed up process of some parts taking care of situations prior to "planning" It is to create a simple 1-2-3- things for all movements to stand in solidarity as what will be done next. The rest or not participating members of society await this and I feel anticipate the place they can take in it. For instance: #1 with 350.org insist upon/war on fossil fuels stop them on all fronts. #2 Stop paying for other war as promised in last election, if you pay taxes you are doing it. In my name establish what you will stand behind and this of personal choice though following ones heart usually equals the same ideals because they are the things to do. Follow heart not $. #3Change from current prison nightmare and insist on basic needs for all before punishing them for they are in survival mindset and unable to even begin thinking given these needs can and will become productive members of society. Lovin' you

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

1) How would you stop them in all fronts?

2) You can't not pay your taxes

3) Provide an example

[-] 1 points by peacehurricane (293) 1 year ago

That is what 350.org is doing for Earth. If you pay taxes the actions taken with those $ is in your name. Stop electing same politicians and yes you can. No harm intended none done. The separation of Church and State includes our pursuit to happily define Liberty. If government operated as such We will operate at reasonable cost. Let the people free and allow them shelter, food, clothing rather than locking them up for standing in defense of a given right to do what they so choose.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

350.org is different then what I'm proposing. It's half of it to be fair. There no data analysis, for example "300 miles in 36 hours" has anyone done an analysis of the effects of "300 miles in 36 hours -" toward it cause. How does it benefit it? what are the expected gains? Like a business. Why not cycles around offices that participate in the decisions process of Keystone, delay in development. What I'm proposing is analysis before protest? IF you want to stop Keystone, what is the route it will be taking, what companies have the contracts what roads do they use? Should there be a protest along that route. Tactics, Analysis,data 1st, protest 2nd.

[-] 2 points by Builder (4202) 1 year ago

Ralph Nader's Seventeen Solutions

Abby Martin talks to author and former US Presidential Candidate, Ralph Nader, about the US electoral system and breaking out of the "lesser of two evils" mentality

http://youtu.be/NO4UMbUNXbk

[-] 2 points by jrhirsch (4714) from Sun City, CA 1 year ago

Did anyone notice the vote count? Just 1.5% of the voters chose a candidate outside of the duopoly. Either the political parties are the greatest salesman who ever walked the earth or somebody's fudging the results. What happened to all of the Ron Paul supporters? Just 1% for Gary Anderson!

[-] 1 points by Builder (4202) 1 year ago

It does seem dodgy. Unless the people you and I are talking to are the only aware and awake people in the country.

[-] 2 points by stevebol (1269) from Milwaukee, WI 1 year ago

I think it's pretty acurrate. I'm sure I'm not the only one who looked past this election and looked to 2016 instead. I'd like to get the right candidate for the dem party (sorry joe and hill) and instead of marginalizing 3rd's invite them to the dance. You have to put a team together. It's time for a new generation to step up and they need the best among the old one to advise them.

[-] 0 points by factsrfun (6569) from Phoenix, AZ 1 year ago

Has Nader crawled out from his rock?

Does think that America forgot?

That he helped beat the man

Who had the great plan,

To keep the planet from getting too hot.

http://www.ijis.iarc.uaf.edu/en/home/seaice_extent.htm

[-] 2 points by brightonsage (4494) 1 year ago

I will give you the benefit of the doubt, because you appear to be new here. I will give you a serious opinion. Nothing of value is created and becomes substantial without risk. Risk implies responsibility. This forum is the poster child for irresponsibility. Anonymity is the essence of irresponsibility. If you had been here you would have experienced a barrage of hateful insulting diatribes trying to shout down every serious effort to organize, and to filter out a set of positions that a lot of people could and would support in meaningful ways.

People won't give up their anonymity for something that isn't serious. They won't risk exposure as a part of a group of bomb throwing lunatics. You can't blame them. So you have to attract the serious ones and get them out of here and into a forum where trust can be built and progress made. Here is how you can do it, Click on the person's alias and send them a personal message. Then, when mutual trust is established, you can exchange contact information or move to a Facebook, or similar, venue and go from there. I think their will naturally be sub groups that agree on sets of issues but only partially on others. Unanimity isn't necessary to work together. I think that is all I need to say here, for now. But that's just my opinion.

[-] 2 points by gsw (2697) 1 year ago

Expand the movement by meeting at state capitals regularly, monthly.

http://occupywallst.org/forum/if-enough-people-said-wtf-change-the-aura-of-ows/

http://www.justicepartyusa.org/ So movement will be more inclusive geographically throughout the nation, and for wider age groups and economic groups,etc, by being more positive, not just loudly protesting and getting arrested. Make it family friendly. Lots of 99 percent have kids and grand kids.

Have overall more positive message, rather than just protest. Such as for a list of llegislation, things that are concretely doable by someone-a legislative body.

Also, that would include protesting for corps to keep jobs in America and bring jobs back here.

Have it be pro family, so you can bring your kids and grand kids to the events. It is for their futures. Would be better pr for Ows too. Kid friendly music or activities too.

[-] 1 points by bullfrogma (448) 1 year ago

If you put legislation on a website you're going to loose almost your entire audience. People don't want to be politicians, or have to learn anything which is not part of their own living, and we shouldn't have to ask them to. We shouldn't need a planet full of politicians just to make a good decision.

The solution to corruption is democracy. The solution to democracy is public awareness, and the solution to that is communication. So what is the solution to communication? How can we make a powerhouse of information and organisation be easy enough for people to find and participate with. How uncorruptable can a website be made?

You don't need a leader. Just people. Just fight. The battle is your own motivation. Fight the feeling of smallness, bordom and tiredness, the unknowing of some unstopable evil, your self doubt and the chaos which smoothers us in uncertainty. Fight because we know the right things are not happening.

I took a walk the other day in the sun, ate apples from a tree, played guitar with some friends, and fell asleep on a hill looking up at shooting stars while being caresed by a warm wind. There is a huge difference between being homeless and poor. Poor is when you believe everything they told you.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

I have nothing against that, anything that builds a community I'm for. That being said I'm more thinking along the lines of say for example education. Is is funded properly, why? who's the administrator? where is the money going? is there a better solution? is in implemented? why? how?

It's one thing to complain about problems, but if you can back it up with a solution and a protest, then you have something.

if this same community put together a reform plan, and protested that these changes be made for a more productive education system, including a pot luck. Have a potluck, while going over the budget as a community.

In short a protest with a clear solution is reform, but a protest with no plan is a legitimate complaint.

[-] 2 points by VQkag2 (16478) 1 year ago

Isn't an idea wrapped up in opinion? Isn't your question "should we not have our own business plan?" an idea and an opinion?

How do I tell you if we should have a leader without giving you my opinion.?

Is it that you don't want others (or certain others) opinions? Our ideas/opinions must stand up & with all others if we are to create consensus.

What is wrong with opinions? It is necessary for opinions/ideas to compete in the 'marketplace of ideas' in order for one opinion/idea to garner support/consensus.

In my opinion we should welcome ALL opinions.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

To answer your first question you're right, so I made another forum. thanks:)

[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 1 year ago

no prob. Gotta have robust (but civil) debate ifwe are to come to consensus.

And I would agree that leaderless is a level of maturity we have not shown we can thrive under yet.

I think the ideal is a worthy goal. Maybe even an eventual evolution, but I have not been encouraged by the practical affect of it.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

I actually hope I'm wrong, but I'm on the very same page.

[-] 2 points by VQkag2 (16478) 1 year ago

Well it is what it is. Perhaps things will just gell and I will be proven wrong. Nothing would please me more.

I so want a strong, growing progressive movement to pressure all politicians for change that benefits the 99%.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

I think your right about excepting things for what they are, but I also believe that means If people are unresponsive, if it's an iPhone world make it an app, if someone can't pay attention be brief and solid. Make you point quick.

[-] 2 points by VQkag2 (16478) 1 year ago

Being flexible IS critical. Observant as to what is working. and responsive to the best approaches. Good people WILL do that. They will be the natural leaders. Um non leaders.

Sorry

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

Hahahaha, as long as there not in cage match ;) I'm off...later

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

http://occupywallst.org/forum/should-there-be-a-leader-after-all-is-leaderlessse/

What my intention was to keep Rants out and discuss ideas, so yes you have a point, but at the end of the day people got the message. If you want to re-write I'll update...

[-] 2 points by penguento (362) 1 year ago

Strategy and a business plan probably require leadership, and no one here is interested in a leadership paradigm. OWS has tried a no-leadership paradigm and it didn't end well. Others who have come here and urged collective action on a real initiative that goes beyond pointless street protests and general bitching have met a deafening silence. All that would appear to leave OWS high and dry.

[-] 4 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

Every Movement needs a voice, in a sense a "leader" or "council". Think of it as Occupy 2.0

As much as I agree with the movement, I can't help but wonder if leaderless is self defeating?

[-] 1 points by therising (6643) 1 year ago

Here is one perspective on what has been, what is and what's next: http://occupywallst.org/forum/occupy-is-a-fleet-of-ships-and-there-is-no-they-in/

[-] 1 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 1 year ago

I'd be hesitant to make I list of surface issues here... There are thousands. Just a thought, it's your party!

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

I like to think of it as our party, I'm just the host...lol

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

I've added a new Idea, I posted it's own forum. (see description above for other links) http://occupywallst.org/forum/protest-all-2014-made-cars-globally-unless-100-ele/ Protest All 2014 made Cars Globally with the exception of 100% Electric Cars. (They did it in the 70's I think we can do it today?!?)

Let me know what you think?

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

This is a Diagram I made for a Occupy Hub/Wikipedia https://docs.google.com/open?id=0B15LrTrKkwOsLXZpQjZMTHNkNzA any comments?

[-] 1 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 1 year ago

I'm really glad you started this, and I get what you mean by opinions/rants are not productive here. But in my opinion (had to do it), it's best to build a platform for the movement to stand on - one with a solid foundation.

So yes, a business plan is a good idea. Something globally sound for the scattered groups to adhere to. To remind us of the vision and to set limitations on conduct.

Best not worry about the surface issues yet, though logging issues never hurts.

Yes, corporations are killing the planet and they rule governments, using people like livestock. Unfortunately without a solid platform and social capital (financial leverage)... who or what will stop them?

Ideas are needed here, not feelings.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

I was thinking Occupypedia like Wikipedia. Where people can contribute there analysis (based on fact), or an "idea" (wiki) page where people can build on.

[-] 1 points by rickMoss (435) 1 year ago

The movement needs a vision, a strategy and a plan of attack. Our task is huge and complicated. Without a unifying vision to focus our efforts, there will be no way to pull together the real strength of our numbers and diversity.

“Be Smart!” - FIGHT THE CAUSE - NOT THE SYMPTOM

U.S. Citizens Read “Common Sense 3.1” at ( http://revolution2.osixs.org )

Non U.S. Citizens Read “Common Sense 3.2” at ( http://SaveTheWorldNow.osixs.org )

[-] 1 points by mserfas (652) from Ashland, PA 1 year ago
  • Become aware that MOST forms of terrorism are absolutely 100% legal. No one should ever need to be even thinking about smashing windows like an idiot, let alone some of the crazier things that have been heard in the news. There is no need to spraypaint graffiti when you can make what R.A.W. would call "an indelible mark on the MIND." You could have a plan to do immense damage, walk up to half a dozen FBI agents, tell them exactly what you're going to do, and they still wouldn't have any recourse (any legal recourse, anyway). That is true for the 1% when they use it - like firing people for political pins or Facebook posts. You should realize that, no matter what the slant is on the laws, it is also true for you.

For example, if you want to grievously harm the global economic system, realize it is apparently largely dependent on a fictional character. No Christmas binge of people scooping up unwanted consumer goods to shove off on someone else (because they're not worth buying for yourself) and "consumer confidence" and consumer spending collapses. Stake that creepy old kallikantzaros by the name of "Santa Claus", a character who would be copyrighted to this day if the play had been staged just a few years later.. Let parents sit down with their kids, teach them to plan out a budget, make purchases after open discussion and careful choice, teach them to carefully decide what they want at any time of year without waiting for a special day. Let them understand basic economics, like why "Santa" brings big sacks of stuff to the wealthy kids. Teach them to make their own art and turn Hallmark into a smoking hole in the ground. What is the government going to charge you with, telling kids there's no Santa Claus, failure to dutifully line up for a special opportunity to buy a half dozen defective products as-is on Black Friday? Yet when the junk fails to fly off the shelves, it's an authentic catastrophe.

To destroy the diamond cartel, simply reclaim the right previous generations had to be creative in their ornaments and not to use one particular stone that resells at only a small percentage of its purchase price. Save the money for something that retains its value, and put the thugs with the guns overseeing crews of slaves in mud pits of Africa right out of business. Somebody puts up TV ads about how "a diamond is forever", even though it's not true, and tells you to spend one month, no two months of your salary on it, and you have to believe it, because they couldn't say it in an ad if it wasn't true. But what if people suddenly stood up and said, you can reject your programming? That is an act of terror beyond what bin Laden could imagine - whole African nations would fall into revolution over it.

Regarding the possible repeal of Obamacare, I had been overwhelmed with the sense that if everyone who was not able to afford or get insurance for an organ transplant would refuse to donate their organs (why should the common people be the only participants in the process not to be paid?) then they could kill tens of thousands of 1% people - turning the very real and very lethal class war over access to health care into a fairer fight. But that is too harsh to believe in - who can think of the people to be affected, and not flinch. But what if people demanded as a condition of organ donation that the groups receiving and distributing the organs insist that they be made available equally to all needy recipients, without regard to ability to pay, without any tricks to move the wealthy recipients higher on the list by putting them in intensive care when the poor wouldn't be, etc.? Then you would kill no one on average, but save many poor lives at the expense of an equal number of wealthy ones. And even that approach, something more grim and terrible than the September 11th attacks, is entirely legal (though I anticipate bureaucratic resistance, and you'd need insider help in promoting it).

What all these things have in common is magic - our world runs on magic. Someone puts forth a notion that something is valuable, and all of a sudden some object is controlling people for their benefit - paper money, Bitcoins, collectible trading cards, Mickey Mouse watches, the Million Dollar Homepage, diamonds, Christmas lights. They tell you not to look behind the curtain, not to think about the route Santa Claus flies, how the decisions to assign organs or offer subprime rates to valued banks are made, and people stop looking and start worshipping. But Occupy Wall Street itself has wielded the magic, getting an idea into the public eye, creating words like "1%" and "99%" for the world to think about. And it will do so again. You have the power - you only need to realize it.

[-] 1 points by stevebol (1269) from Milwaukee, WI 1 year ago

OWS doesn't support candidates. We know this. We know they don't even support voting. If you really really want to piss off the establishment put someone who's not married or divorced in the White House. Heads will explode.

[-] 1 points by ComeTogetherNOW (650) 1 year ago

The problem starts with the first sentence:

"This is a forum for ideas, and not opinions".


and the last sentence:

Any ideas or thoughts? no opinions please...



Now, let's discuss just how organized your very own thinking is on this confused subject your entertaining at the moment.

"Freedom of speech is the political right to communicate one's opinions and ideas. The term freedom of expression is sometimes used synonymously, but includes any act of seeking, receiving and imparting information or ideas, regardless of the medium used. In practice, the right to freedom of speech is not absolute in any country and the right is commonly subject to limitations, as with libel, slander, obscenity"

Obviously, Mister 10N you jumped out and showed us your ignorance on just how opinions are ideas after all.

Do we have free expression here, or ARE YOU about to part the waters with your sparkling pearls of misguided wisdom.

I took my liberty my friend. And I am true blue American!!!

Come Together NOW, and come up with some sustainable and tangible IDEAS

Just a thought...idea...opinion...dislusion...unreality...half baked stone crab.........

For you Number 10N, that's an opinion.

;D

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

I didn't realize anyone would feel so strongly about my grammar, but the point I wanted to make was no rants....

[-] 1 points by ComeTogetherNOW (650) 1 year ago

Ok.

I couldn't glean that idea out of your premise for this thread. Your fine. So the clarification is welcome and I'm sure others here may appreciate that as well. I'm always up for intelligent well thought discussions. But I do like to be effective and that is the rub. If we focus and come by some authentic real ideas it could be time well spent. BUT, if we aren't standing on the "shoulders of giants" we are in effect re-inventing a wheel that was perhaps made by Thomas Jefferson for example. You may learn by re-inventing these wheels but there's a shortcut to that school of hard knocks method. Simply put, education can not be bypassed. Neither can science.

So there, just some general free thoughts. Let's have some new ideas, or, at the least, let's have the ones already proven to work.

This requires, bare minimum, understanding (education), and from there we may unify under common agreed upon ideas many times stated as principles. Kind of like the country in which we live.

GOOD LUCK!

Come Together NOW, AND Fight IGNORANCE...

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

Thanks, any suggestion for a better description is welcomed. I'm curious what you would think if this.... http://occupywallst.org/forum/proposal-a-tek-tool-to-fight-coruption/

[-] 1 points by ComeTogetherNOW (650) 1 year ago

Much of it are things I already do. I'm active in some different environmental groups for instance. We're all free to join those groups that align with our "big" picture of how we help make this world be one we want. Most people have this desire to see things improve, get better, and so on. But, how much? How far are we willing to go?

For me, I hit on as many chords as I can to make a difference. First thing, I vote obsessively, and constantly encourage others do the same. Second, learn how to recognize the evident truth in things and realize how much trust is too much.

Then we proceed to the most crucial part------> GOOD IDEAS based on irrefutable facts, EVIDENCE.

Everyone wants the shortcut but they don't exist. You must do your homework or YOU WILL be repeating someone else's idea. In that vain, you should know history, our history, very well. Understand it.

So when we stand on the heads of gaints, we're ready!

Good Luck!

Come Together NOW

[-] 1 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 1 year ago

We need to listen to the hate-posts form all the fools who are in the 99% but fail to realize it. It's all valuable feedback and we can use it to our advantage. We can improve the effectiveness of the movement while eliminating the things we do that give us a bad rep.

We need to convince 99% of the population that they are in our class. Police, for example, are people too and definitely not part of the 1%. Everyone in the armed forces can be convinced to see the light. They have to obey orders or they don't get paid, but they can be taught to sympathize.

So we need to take in the feedback, stop pissing everyone off, and formulate a new strategy to be used the same way around the world.

I have some ideas here. Keep doing everything we do that doesn't bother anyone. As far as protests and demonstrations go, target the police and military. They are the only groups who can stop us. We need their sympathy, but we can't stop protesting. There should be no unplanned protests, occupies need to all follow the rule. We need to plan flash-mob protests where an alert goes out and people show up knowing what to do. The world should know what will happen every time and be comfortable with the consistency. Citizens, businesses, governments, police, everyone will expect the consistency and be comfortable with the predictability. The rule is to peacefully disband at the first confrontation with authority. They will come out to stop a demonstration and we will show them we understand they have a job to do. No blood, no arrests, no hate. They will know why we came out, they will confront, and will be very comforted by the fact that their job will be easy, they don't have to hurt anyone, and that we sympathize and respect what they have to do to feed their families. There will be exchanges of smiles, not of hate.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

and... yes

[-] 1 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 1 year ago

Sorry, I hit the button by mistake. And on the other thing, no link, sorry. More will come soon though.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

looking forward to it

[-] -1 points by BetsyRoss (-744) 1 year ago

The protests and demonstrations are the problem. They DO bother people. They give you a bad rep. Targeting the police and our military bugs the HELL out of people who have loved ones who are police and or military. And you might want to consider the thought that they might not be as much "the only groups who can stop us" as they are-the "only groups between you and the citizenry".

You keep annoying the hell out of "we the people" who then categorized OWS as "you the protestors" and any sympathy given to you will quickly evaporate.

[-] 1 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 1 year ago

Maybe I came across wrong. What do you think I meant by target? I mean aim to get their sympathy so they see us in a different light.

[-] 0 points by BetsyRoss (-744) 1 year ago

Yes. Target is pretty much a hostile word these days.

Your original post has been changed, with more clarity. Thank you. But how on earth do you think you will be able to "control" every single protester? What makes you think every protester will AGREE with YOUR determination of what "should" happen or "will" happen?

The entire problem with your "plan" is that you can't control PEOPLE. You cannot prevent the black bloc from showing up. You cannot stop the violent fringe from being stupid. And not matter how peaceful or well meaning or comfortable the entire world might become with the predictability, you cannot MAKE the world agree on anything.

And it's hard to get the "sympathy" of individuals or groups when your words and actions are directly insulting to them. They do their JOBS and get yelled at, screamed at, ignored, have objects thrown at them, accused of all kinds of crimes against humanity, called every name in the book.

[-] 1 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 1 year ago
[-] 1 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 1 year ago

Maybe it is possible to communicate with someone in each city responsible for coordinating their group's members. Each city can have an entity responsible for -organizing flash-mob protests -shutting down protests which do not follow protocol -aligning their city with the global movement for unity

Each city should be like a franchise, operating exactly the same. Try to be like McDonald's restaurants... It's so successful because of the consistency and replication. I like the quote "anyone can make a better hamburger but nobody can make a better selling hamburger."

The problem with people these days is unity.

[-] 1 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 1 year ago

I posted this elsewhere but will paste some of it here when I have a computer handy. It's so simple but has enormous potential...

The Occupy Corporation: Beat them at their own game

Some small businesses end many entrepreneurs support Occupy. More people need to realize they are part of the 99%.

There can be a "conglomerate" corporation composed of supporting businesses. They just allow the conglomerate to "acquire" them. No profit needs to be removed from each business, until a later phase when it's worth it to pay fees.

Businesses will benefit hugely by joining and including the 99% logo with theirs. The world would be condemned for not supporting the 99ers by purchasing their products and services, givin the choice.

This will make more sense later and you will see the spectrum of advantages I've identified so far.

There is so much more to this so stay tuned, and offer any thoughts you have until then please!

We are better than capitalism and we will consume it. We will feed the excrement to the 1%!

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

I think that's incredible, I imagine you would need to categorize types of business. What would be the requirement? is a family of 10 has a business that makes a million? is that a small business? how do you define? your thoughts?

[-] 1 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 1 year ago

Small businesses and new ones will be the first to join but there would be no requirement or need to categorize until Phase 3: http://occupywallst.org/forum/p3-consumption/#comment-893210

Phase 3 is when the conglomerate has the financial leverage to start strategically consuming existing corporations. These would have to conform to specific rules, which wouldn't be forced on "your" phase 1 business.

The "consumed" corporations would have to follow the principals of "Democracy at Work". Employees take a half of a workday per week to meet and decide what/where/how products/services are made/performed and how much employees (including CEOs) are paid. And undecided but possibly shares stop being traded publicly.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

Is there a link, I still have some other reading first, but I'm almost finished it.

[-] 1 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 1 year ago

I finally copied stuff over to its own topic: http://occupywallst.org/forum/beat-them-at-their-own-game-the-99er-conglomerate/ Hope I got most of the good stuff.

[-] 1 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 1 year ago

Btw, I'm posting the goods here because I like your enthusiasm and spirit. When I have time away from work, wife, kid, chess and Civilization 5, I'll get my own topics going as promised.

[-] 1 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 1 year ago

Do you find this motivating? It's in response to someone who likes the idea so far but isn't totally convinced: I was thinking about what you said, less about beating them at their own game and more about finding a better game to play. I somewhat agree. We need to find a new game, quickly, with a serious global impact. Corporations are tough, challenging opponents. The 99er conglomerate needs to become the most predatory corporation there ever will be. It needs to dominate capitalism. Nothing can be permitted to stand against it. Corporations command armed forces and pull the strings of governments, so how can anything change their game? One hell of a bloody protest might have an effect, but citizens won't choose to starve and bleed on a large enough scale. When the conglomerate has power, it can start commanding forces and governments. Then anything can be possible.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

Sorry I've been scarce, holidays, family work, etc, life. I do believe we can beat them at there own game. A non-profit charity Bank, A Charity with stocks, which is responsible to its "occupy" share holders, don't forget Inc just pay fines, no jail time. you can use the same loop holes to cause havoc, as long as your making a profit it's legal, and the best part is... it's all for Charity.

[-] 1 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 1 year ago

Just so it's out there, this is what I had in mind for the phases: P1: -campaign for subsidiaries -develop business directory -develop/implement ad strategy -incorporate conglomerate

P2: -begin collecting fees -develop web and mobile apps -incorporate essential services -low-budget public ads

P3: -merge internal competitors -initiate strategic consumption -increase fees -update apps -massive public ads

I also don't think there's a reason to define what a small business is, at least until later in phase 2. Any business should be allowed in, even the crooked ones we hate. In time the conglomerate will straighten them out.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

at the base we still need a place to organize these thoughts.

[-] 1 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 1 year ago

Yea, you're right. I'll get around to starting 3 topics and cross reference them with each other and this one. There will be one for the conglomerate, one for the conglomerate web app (including Essential Services), and one for DG&RC (Departmental Governance & Responsible Capitalism). They are all complimentary stepping stones, very idealistic. I might link them up with a topic for The Venus Project. Have you ever checked it out? Google it. This is the direction we need to go in. I just feel DG is the only nonviolent way there. And the conglomerate is the only way to DGRC.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

I've heard of The Venus Project, but not DG&RC, looking t up now.Are you talking about the Digital Government Research Center?

[-] 1 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 1 year ago

There's some stuff posted now about the conglomerate web app: http://occupywallst.org/forum/p2-presence/#comment-892620

Starting to lay out a battle plan, so you'll see much more than that if you navigate around.

[-] 1 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 1 year ago

You probably won't find anything, it's just something I've been posting about here and there. From a thousand feet away it looks like a new way to govern a nation where there are no borders, districts, or geographic constituencies.

This is only about the DG side, Departmental Governance: Each "area", like environment, natural resources, economy, defense, armed forces, transportation, agriculture, infrastructure, social services, health and wellness, etc.... by those are how constituencies are organized. Each state must produce a certain number of leaders for each department, and the department's constituency evaluates (as opposed to voting/electing) the leadership.

It's actually getting quite comprehensive. The RC Responsible Capitalism part actually came first but it will take forever to go through and comprehend DG as it is. Suffice it to say for now that in DG there are no political parties dividing the nation and the "President/Prime Minister" is a figurehead to represent the nation abroad, taking the form of a group of representatives, hologram or robot :)

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

you should include all discussions must be held in a public forum.

[-] 1 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 1 year ago

Oh, no worries there! I think you'll like the decision-making processes.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

Can't wait to see it.

[-] 1 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 1 year ago

Hey 10N, been a long time! Have you been "Back to Topic References: http://occupywallst.org/forum/conglomerate-and-dgrc-topic-references/ " lately? Let me know what you think so far.

[-] 1 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 1 year ago

What will conglomerate advertizing do? Here are a few I can think of off the top of my head:

-promote the movement When a business is acquired, support increases. All employees and customers of that business will be supporting Occupy. Every view of the company logo strengthens the movement.

-increase profits for members Consumers will have their reason for choosing your business over the competition. Purchasing 99er products and services will be considered ethical choices. Supporting the 1% will be frowned upon.

-create awareness that spending elsewhere is supporting the 1% People don't seem to realize it yet but buying little things like toothpaste and baby jar food is what's fueling the enemy. Conglomerate advertizing will focus on making this common knowledge.

What do you want to do for money? Bake cookies? Build houses? Clean houses? Babysit? Sell coffee? Make toothpaste or soaps? Whatever it is, joining with the conglomerate can be your key to success. As it gets rolling, more and more benefits will come available... Legal, accounting, staffing, benefits, insurance, financing, and more. But to help get it rolling, just say you support the idea.

Before the conglomerate exists, may as well still sign up. All it takes is adding the 99er logo to your own and getting on the free ad list.

[-] 1 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 1 year ago

The 99er Business Directory:

When your company is acquired by the conglomerate, an ad/store page is dedicated to you, and your company's name, contact info, logo and slogan (slogo?) appear in the directory tree. It can work similar to Kijiji. Each ad is basically a tall row in a list based on the user's search results. The user clicks on your ad and is taken to your ad page.

I keep imagining this as a 3D world mall where your character can visit stores, libraries or whatever... interact with government one day?

Anyway, if I lay it all out, you would see that what I've described above are just a few ways people will interact with the site. A strategic objective is the entrepreneurial component, continually improved, to support business start-up and to manage your businesses online.

But to start, the Directory will just be a list of business names emailed or shared by whatever free means exist. When the website first appears and fees are paid by subsidiaries to finance the conglomerate, the intricacies of website business rules and design can be worked out.

All fees earned by the conglomerate for some time will go to operational costs, advertizing and website development. No person(s) or elite group will benefit from the organization other than what the conglomerate is designed to provide.

Everyone has equal opportunity in their industries, and yes, more than one subsidiary might be competing for the same market share. That can't be stopped, but there is always the option to merge and become more powerful. Merging of internal competition is always in the best interest of the conglomerate, but should never be forced.

[-] 1 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 1 year ago

I can't resist thinking about Phase Two and the website, maybe called FreeInfo? Starting as a simple directory with advertizing, it will evolve to something most people use every day for a variety of reasons. I've made sketches for a user interface in the past, and thought through scenarios and aspects of the user experience. Thinking, I can see it facilitating the manifestation of new economic and political frameworks - systems not yet invented or ever put into practice.

This is a bit off topic, but does anyone think government borders should NOT be geographical, but departmental rather? If I (a voter) know a lot about the environment and maybe transportation, why should I want to influence the governing of economics? Why would I want economists to have significant influence in the Environment Department? I am a constituent of the departments of Environment and Transportation. I do not worry about the Department of Economics as I trust its constituents care for it the way I care for mine. I understand my industries and know my leaders well.

Departmental Governance (DG) feels more responsible.

I could go into how the DG evaluation system replaces the voting system and how political parties go extinct. As they exist, political parties just separate nations in ridiculous political theater - theater as bad as fake wrestling soap opera. The DG political framework produces more responsible leaders in many more ways. It removes capitalism from government and will decimate the potential for corruption. It diversifies yet simplifies government and strengthens it holistically. Leaders replace politicians in this system - who could ask for more?

OK - done dreaming. Back to the conglomerate... ideas?

[-] 1 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 1 year ago

A lawyer reading this might see a great opportunity for him or her: helping draft the constitution of the conglomerate corporation. It might be worth providing legal advice to the conglomerate in the first phase. Then, by merging her own business with the conglomerate, she will be the first lawyer to advertize as a 99er (lack of a better term) subsidiary. Supporters of the movement will seek her services for any area of law she wishes to specialize in.

The Phase One rules would have to be such that though a business is "acquired" by the conglomerate, its operations will not be influenced by the conglomerate. The acquisition of your business does not interfere with the way you organize, produce or distribute. This rule would have to change in a later phase when larger mergers take place - takeovers, or the strategic "consuming" of capitalism by the conglomerate.

A lawyer would be handy for consolidating redundant departments, since one of the benefits for subsidiaries is lower costs for tax, legal and accounting responsibilities. Now the accountant is thinking about this rare opportunity, "Would it hurt my reputation if I was the first accounting subsidiary to advertize as a 99er?"

The few who choose to initiate this will certainly be known around the world in a few short years. Don't you think?

[-] 1 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 1 year ago

The 99% can beat them at their own game: capitalism. It's not all worked out yet, but that's a good reason to post - to evolve and flush out the weaknesses.

Basically it's a conglomerate. A corporation composed of subsidiaries owned by individuals like you and me. The long-term goal is to return power to the people.

Do you own or want to start a lawn maintenance or painting business? Just associate it with the conglomerate, and call it a subsidiary. We can do this with any business of any size.

To start with there should be no fees for associating, but your business will get great advertizing. Basically, you include the 99% symbol with your company logo. Someone or a group of people will find ways to share the list of businesses with the world (apps and emails, for example).

The conglomerate will become recognized and people around the world will begin to feel guilt for not purchasing Occupy products and services, given the choice. Society will begin to condemn those who prefer to support the 1%.

In time, subsidiaries will need to pay fees and so will be given the choice to separate. But say bye-bye to the benefits.

As subsidiaries grow large in numbers, they will be encouraged to merge to become stronger. And when the conglomerate acquires greater financial leverage, it will begin to consume existing corporate entities.

Wouldn't it be cool to see these "consumed" entities change the way they do business? I'd say stop trading their shares publicly and enforce "Democracy at Work". This means employees take half a day off each week and get together to democratically determine how/what/where to produce goods and how much each should get paid. This should ensure equity and keep jobs local... who would choose to pay CEOs shiploads then move their jobs overseas? (Remember I'm only talking about consumed entities here, not your business.) Do you think the conglomerate wouldn't eventually operate a non-profit financial institution for it's members?

I have ideas for a website too, to facilitate business start-up and ongoing support. I think it can revolutionize the entrepreneurial and consumer world, with an impact on society rivaling Facebook's. I won't go into that just yet.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

Would you mind if I put this as example 2 ? Maybe a summary in a paragraph.

[-] 1 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 1 year ago

Not sure what you mean I don't need to own the idea. Try putting it in your own words, or were you asking me to summarize?

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

What I meant was summarize, and I'll post it as example 2... unless you want your own forum... let me know...

[-] 1 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 1 year ago

Looks like someone is reading my posts! Lol, cool? http://www.occupypolice.org/

[-] 1 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 1 year ago

It made sense shortly after I posted. No, I think it would be great if you posted it as example 2. Add it to the collective. I was thinking it would be cool if you summarized the idea, then I can see it from your point of view. We might even have adjustments to make and so far it's just been my mind. Unfortunately I'm not the roundest ball in the drawer.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

That's actually pretty clever, But who would pay for the advertising, if no one is paying fees? Unless is was free at the start or even stayed free... you could even include a the year of original membership.

I don't think it would make much of a difference until Occupy re-flared again, but you gotta have the Ground Work.. 1) Start with the Logo? Any Graphics People Out there.... 2) Requirement for Logo For now... #2) might be a little tricky at first, but i'm sure someone already has it figured out...somewhere

[-] 1 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 1 year ago

Advertizing can be cheap and minimal at first, targeting only people subscribed to newsletters from occupy sites, Facebook followers, and such. It can evolve over time. I don't see ads on tv, radio, newspapers and magazines until later in phase 2. The logo doesn't have to be designed - just a small 99% in a circle would do. Businesses can start using the symbol and registering long before the conglomerate becomes incorporated.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

That I could do myself (logo). What would be the requirements? What defines a small business? Is a family owned franchise a small business?

[-] 1 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 1 year ago

I'm not sure what makes a small business small or if it really matters. Any business owner should be allowed to sign up. What would be the purpose of classifying?

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

Can McDonalds? How about a local franchise of 8 restaurants, that makes $10,000,000/ yearly?

You see my point... there is a shade of grey... But... I'm sure an economist could answer that question with ease... you know any?

[-] 1 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 1 year ago

Damn I gotta stop using my phone. I had a nice long post and deleted it by reloading the page. Oh well. In short, I like the idea of a "business plan" still for this leaderless movement, to align resources with a common goal. Here are some possible sections:

Vision Purpose Goals Structure Strategy Resources Initiatives

Initiatives could be like the wiki, conglomerate, website, apps, etc. Even the business plan could be an initiative in the business plan.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

I think the business plan being an initiative is the might be the best way to give birth to this idea....

[-] 1 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 1 year ago

So, #1 initiative is the business plan. We have the sections. May as well list the initiatives in sequence of initiation. An initiative can be managed like a project. With project management tools and methodologies, good structured work can get done. For example, breaking down projects in a work breakdown structure gives us a list of tasks to insert into a chart for managing time and resources. Not only that, projects can be documented as they move through phases, or "Process Groups" (Initiation, Planning, Execution, Controlling/Monitioing, and Closing". Outputs from one phase are inputs for the next phase, and the Project Management Body of Knowledge shows how. It doesn't have to get complicated.

[-] 1 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 1 year ago

I think that would kick ass if McDonalds had the 99er symbol on all it's advertizing! The constitution of the conglomerate, when in effect, would probably change the way it does business though.

No I don't know any economists.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

I'm writing a proposal as I'm typing this, just had a brainstorm, will post tomorrow!!!

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

http://99.occupymediawiki.org/wiki/Occupy_Encyclopedia Pro: I like the structure, but it seems more for organized data, which is part of what we would need Con: Pitch of interface layout, more like wiki would be better, it gives people an interface there familiar with

[-] 1 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 1 year ago
[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

Good sources!!

[-] 1 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 1 year ago

That one is full of good info. We should verify and take what may be useful, like what's under the Cities link.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

Occupy Restructure Diagram: https://docs.google.com/open?id=0B15LrTrKkwOsLXZpQjZMTHNkNzA

It's done, feel free to pass along... 1st Draft... Let me know what you think then I'll give it it's own forum...

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

I'm working on the next version, should be done Sunday/Monday

[-] 1 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 1 year ago

Looks interesting. I imagine skillful customization would be required, but I'm no pro. Sorry for the delay, I couldn't log in because I never realized it's case sensitive!

[-] 1 points by brightonsage (4494) 1 year ago

If it isn't about opinions you could have eliminated about 95% of the posts. Then with all due respect, you ask for opinions. Which is it?

Skills? Leadership, as always is in extremely short supply. Most who want to lead really want to dictate. As usual most of the leaders don't want to. They are always the best or maybe the only kind. Yes, we could be better structured. Maybe that is because there is, in practical terms, no structure now. I hadn't seen this when I posted this:

http://occupywallst.org/forum/now-that-we-have-the-government-that-we-deserve/

I guess you will be the final arbitor of what is an idea or a thought and what is an opinion . That will be amusing to watch.

I used to quote Emeliano Zapata's line from the movie by the same name, "A weak people need a strong leader. A strong people don't need a leader."

I used to think we were a strong people, but we have lost a lot of that strength as evidenced by this election. Based on that, we need a a weak leader. Just don't pick one who says. "Me, pick me Mr. Kotter. Then, when we are strong again, we can abandon her.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

Well.. you kind of contradict yourself? In your second paragraph you point out how hard a leader is to find, but in your last paragraph your clearly trying to make the point a leaderless point,

at then end of the day all you have is a very articulate and well written rant.

My goal here is to aggregate all the ideas based on user info and comments.

[-] 1 points by brightonsage (4494) 1 year ago

I don't think I did. Policies are what matters. It will take organization to move the ball ahead, Those combined with a leader who recognizes that the policies are what matters not personal charisma of brilliance, therefore a willingness to get out of the way, IMHO is what is needed. Special interest groups can be an effective way to advance the support of policies.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

I couldn't agree more, The right kind of Special Interest groups (for people, few as they may be). In order to organize is the key question? I do feel the best step forward would be a step backward if you will, re-analysis protesting, what are the top 10 cleverest protest in the world? What do they have in common? I'm sure it's already been done somewhere. I can't say that I know the answer to that, but maybe we should be analysis them, can there be a template, point being, we need to develop 21st century tools, that suit are needs.

Corporation have it right when it comes to using methodologies, to acquire profit, we need to use the same to acquire freedom.

But... our resources are divided, we are individuals, we don't have networks, but we have peer-to-peer (think seti) There are alternative, and solutions.

I suspect the main answer lies around aggregation of data of the corporation that support these actions, instead of the politicians that prescribe them into law. (why go after the puppet, when you could go after the puppeteer)

[-] 1 points by hchc (3297) from Tampa, FL 1 year ago

I would like to see a big push on money in politics, this election has been disgusting.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

I was thinking the same thing, for this sole reason is when it affects a corporations profit margin, when it's not worth the expense....

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26307) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Always reach out to the public with good reasons/issues to get them interested and involved. What grabs one persons interest to get involved may not motivate another. Remember all issues of the people bring the people together.

Example of a good peoples issue that might inspire some to get involved and active in protecting their world:

National Parks Conservation Association = people protesting Fracking and mountain top removal mining?

Get the public's attention - inspire them to see the connections that run all through our world.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

Inspiring people to see the connections that run all through our world is not an easy thing but are waiting for it.

[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (26307) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

We have begun. The birth of the world wide protests and world wide communications on the protests have opened the door for outreach and education of the average individual who uses the internet. Issues and their cross connections can now be talked about ( bypassing the MSM information/education blackout ).

It may not seem like it at times - but communications and awareness has changed in this last year.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

you have a point

[-] 1 points by Shule (2036) 1 year ago

We can start by making a list here of those things we want to hold Obama's feet to the fire to (seeing that he will most likely be re-elected.) I'll start:

1.) Get out of Afghanistan and the rest of the Middle-East. Spend the military ops money here at home to build infrastructure for protection against future hurricanes.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

Again, There are so many issues, I'm more concerned about how to strength or fortify, how do we plan better, be stronger, were up against corporations. How can we use the same tools, but in Solidarity.

How is this done? How do Corporations have offices all over the world and manage to stay in Sync?

We need to use the same tools in Solidarity.

[-] 1 points by Shule (2036) 1 year ago

Things start from seeds. I think we can start by rallying around a few key issues. Then figuring out game plans for each issue. Basically, getting small groups in motion, and then later trying to build synergy between them. I work for a big corp. That's how its done. Unfortunately it all takes time.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

That's my whole point. " I think we can start by rallying around a few key issues. Then figuring out game plans for each issue."

Why can we figure out first, then rally ?

[-] 1 points by Shule (2036) 1 year ago

I'm not exactly sure what your question is?

But what I'm trying to say is one first needs to create a concrete message. OWS has done that to some extent, but one needs to get the message down to advocating some simple actions that individual folks can execute. (There is also this problem of too many folks believing false economic and political theories which need to be debunked.) Synergy is built by rallying and by "spreading the word." Good would be starting independent newsletters, etc. However, rallying and spreading the news alone does not solve any problems. (Remember we are up against a lot of phyco-nuts. They are not swayed by any sort of popular protest.) Eventually what needs to happen is groups need to actively lobby, take up issues in courts, and take other actions in the streets and elsewhere that would force the hands of legislators. Preferably if groups can do all this in solidarity that would be super, but that is not going to come about overnight. But there is no reason individual groups can't start activating now, and let the synergy come later as they see they are each doing basically the same thing.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

I would agree, the problem with going to court are the resources, the data mining, which could be a "mini" task for the individual folk,

In short were saying the samething.

[-] 1 points by Shule (2036) 1 year ago

Maybe that is what we are talking about; establishing a resource base? Like it or not we, live in a capitalistic society, and the first question on most people's minds is "what is in it for me." Without $$$$ little moves.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

Again, what you saying makes sense, but before we even get there we need to figure out to how to unite the occupy groups, on a technical level, using everyday tek. Smart Phones, Peer-Peer, etc...

[-] 1 points by Shule (2036) 1 year ago

If we are really serious, unfortunately, fancy tek is not the way to go. It is too often compromised. The most secure lines of communication are the old fashion ways; face to face meetings, may be a note or two, maybe a short phone call, but not much more. I think it amounts to local groups arranging peer networks... these networks building into larger networks....

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

I believe in power of the people, not to say that may not be needed, but here is my stance.

When 0.01% can influence 0.99% to steal from 99% that a pretty powerful maneuver. Basically 1 per 1000. How? Using the latest and greatest tools The Art of War states to learn from your enemy. We need to create tools design for us.... Tek, I believe is one of the most powerful tools.

Example: An App Game: Catch the Politician You see 5 lines of your local Budget? At the end of each line you see several options. OK, I Don't Know, Seems Suspicious, I Caught A Politician.

At the bottom you have Next (for the next 5) and a Quit. Tek is the tool to use.

It's Simple, everyone can participate, you can do it while you wait in line....

It All goes to a website, Where you can see the top "hits", globally locally, etc or even on the app.

[-] 1 points by Shule (2036) 1 year ago

From all the posts below, looks like you got some thinking going on. You ask how does the .01% get the .99% to steal from the 99%. Personally I think their secret is $$$$$$.
If we could somehow come up with some of that, or something like it... There is this stuff called micro money you know, which is used a lot in Europe.
Maybe folks can create their own credit systems?????

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

i think there are a of of good ideas out there, and that's the problem. The solution or at least the foundation to the solutions are out there. But even before problem solving, We need to be structured in a way in implement solution.

An procedure/app/local community which takes a pieces of the solution then passes it on to another procedure/app/local community. Using Wikipedia template perhaps.

But In order to to that I believe the Occupy(s) should have a central hub Where all the protest (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Occupy_movement_protest_locations) can be cross referenced, looking for a commonalitty

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26307) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

How about a video game - Do unto Others - this game would reward fellowship and creatively punish selfism/aynism.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

I'm not to sure how that would work....

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26307) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Something opposite of grand theft auto? I don't know either - IT is not me.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26307) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

I will have a look later - btw add another r ( corruption ) there are plenty here who will give you grief about it.

[-] 1 points by niphtrique (323) from Sneek, FR 1 year ago

You need an overall plan and a strategy for success.

You need people to rally around the plan and the strategy.

Many have unrealistic demands, failing strategies and do not rally around one plan.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

I don't want one or many plans (well..may we do, but..), what i want is a system to organize a plan(s), a very different beast.

Corporation are effective, because of the tools they use. We need to start looking at the tools they use, because they are effective.

How can we better organize. Are we like a government disenfranchised ourselves?

[-] 1 points by niphtrique (323) from Sneek, FR 1 year ago

A fool with a tool is still a fool.

The problem of Occupy is not (lack of) tools.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

Give me an example?

[-] 1 points by niphtrique (323) from Sneek, FR 1 year ago

An example?

I work in IT and have seen it many times before.

If there is a problem (often there is no real problem but only a perceived problem), then the solution managers introduce is often a tool or a new technology.

Example: "Testers do not know the software they are testing. So give them a test tool."

After that testers do not know the software they are testing and they do not know how the test tool works.

Example: "Give everyone an I-phone, so they can work better."

Really, it is not true. New communication tools drag down organisational effectiveness.

Until a few decades ago communication means were costly so they were only used for relevant communication and data. New communication tools that can process large amounts of data at low cost open new possibilities but can also reduce the effectiveness of organisations because the capacity of people to process data does not increase. Irrelevant communication and data distract the attention from relevant issues. This is not efficient so the situation probably will change. The current information era may be labelled peak bullshit in the future.

Reducing irrelevant communication and data can increase the effectiveness of an organisation. Many organisations do the opposite and invest in data communication and communication skills of people. Often this will only increase the number of meetings, mails and documents, resulting in additional cost. This situation is sometimes called information overload.

Advertising is a type of communication that spreads irrelevant data and increases cost. Advertisements can also create a negative self image with people that cannot live up to the standards promoted in the advertisements. If all corporations would agree to stop spending money on advertising then products and services could become much cheaper. Within the current economic system this is not possible because there is a worldwide competition of everybody against everybody.

http://www.naturalmoney.org/organisation.html#comm

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

I haven't read the link in't it's entirety, (but I will) What tool/produces are there used today to weed good data from bad useless data?

[-] 1 points by niphtrique (323) from Sneek, FR 1 year ago

Rising cost of communication and data storage can solve this issue.

Another option is local currencies and stimulating local economies. This will then reduce communication as more affairs will be settled locally.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26307) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

I think that starts in the formatting - questions asked - choices of response laid out. It is not very flexible on a question by question basis - so good information gathering will compensate by flexing the questions to cover more ground then specifically laid out answer choices will allow to a single question.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

let me read the whole article tomorrow in detail tomorrow, I'll get back to you...interesting read so far...

[-] 1 points by stevebol (1269) from Milwaukee, WI 1 year ago

It's a young middle class movement so I don't know what will happen.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

I would Strongly disagree with you about that...

[-] 1 points by stevebol (1269) from Milwaukee, WI 1 year ago

I'm not saying it's exactly like the Clintonista baby-boomer movement but it's a middle class movement just the same.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

I would include the poor too, everyone except the rich

[-] 2 points by Shule (2036) 1 year ago

I would not exclude any rich folk merely on the grounds they are rich. There are some benevolent millionaires, and even billionaires out there most willing to support their 99% other fellow humans. Backing from a big daddy, and a little money in the pot is always a good thing.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

Well, of course

[-] 1 points by stevebol (1269) from Milwaukee, WI 1 year ago

OWS isn't going to help the lower class any more than the clintonistas did. We've seen this all before.

[-] 2 points by VQkag2 (16478) 1 year ago

I disagree!

We help people all the time. The greatest help we will accomplish is yet to come. As we grow and sharpen our message, while we target all pols for specific change that benefits the 99%, then help for the poor will be clear!

1 year of growth is nothing. We must stay with it. The best is uet to come.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

Two Words: Occupy Sandy

[-] 1 points by 37thBarrel (1) 1 year ago

gnomunny- i couldnt have said it better, this forum is more into complaining and proving their point to 'internet antagonizers' than actually doing anything that involves getting off their ass, look at the last 100 posts on the forum, anything resemble a call to action..? no (o wait) there is one calling for people to organize on election day..a bit late i would think

[-] 1 points by LeoYo (5866) 1 year ago

FreeDA http://occupywallst.org/forum/free-democracy-amendment/

Your local PIRG has the organizing and resource assessment faculties.

Just because OWS is leaderless doesn't mean your specific cause has to be. Having a leadership structure for a specific cause and being apart of a leaderless movement are not two mutually exclusive things.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

I see your point, but I do feel there are a lot of wasted resources,there are so many I.T, Engineers, Mechanics, Lawyers, etc that voluntary, I can't help but wonder if there was a leader body, those resources would be put to more positive tasks then protesting. A sense of management. The movement could be pushed forward, instead of pots and pans...

[-] 2 points by LeoYo (5866) 1 year ago

OWS is what it is. Accept it for what it is and create something else with others and/or individuals in OWS.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

What should it be called? Occupy 2.0 ?

[-] 2 points by LeoYo (5866) 1 year ago

At this point, that's soley for you to determine. Like it or not, you are the leader of your own idea. You are the post to draw others to your idea even if your idea is simply to have a discussion on what direction to take. Personally, I would come up with a different name as to not cause friction with people who accept OWS just the way it is. Something new should have a new name that distinguishes its purpose and direction.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

Of course...

[-] 1 points by jrhirsch (4714) from Sun City, CA 1 year ago

We already know the correct direction to go. We just need to convince ourselves to take that first step.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

Which is?

[-] 1 points by jrhirsch (4714) from Sun City, CA 1 year ago

The core of Occupy's message can be boiled down to seven words. "A fair vote and a fair wage." Because we know we have neither, we must educate the masses who blindly believe the fantasy that they possess both, and instead convince them of the reality that their work and their vote benefits the wealthy at their expense. This is the first step.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

I'm not so sure, I sure it's more about corporate governance.

[-] 1 points by jrhirsch (4714) from Sun City, CA 1 year ago

Corporate governance has it's root in both our lack of political and economic power. The wages we deserve to be paid are siphoned to the wealthy, whose billions through TV advertising influence our vote in favor of their candidates, who then write legislation that favors the wealthy, which funnels even more of our resources to the wealthy.

It's a vicious cycle that must first be understood if we are to be successful in our battle. Every wrong that Occupy boldly proclaims against can be traced to this economic and political stranglehold. It's a two headed snake that needs both heads severed to kill it.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

any ideas?

[-] 2 points by jrhirsch (4714) from Sun City, CA 1 year ago

Ideas to kill the snake? Simultaneously increase our economic and political power while we weaken theirs.

First economic.

Boycott businesses that don't pay a living wage, form unions to raise wages.

Raise taxes on the wealthy.

Increase the minimum wage gradually until it is equal to 25% of average income.

Second. Political.

Limit direct and indirect political contributions per candidate to $200 from each person or entity.

Boycott businesses that spend money to influence elections or use lobbyists to bribe politicians.

And most important. Change the mentality of the people so they fully understand just how badly they're being screwed by the current system. That they are more numerous and more powerful than any political party, business, or government and once united cannot be defeated.

[-] 0 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

Fair Enough...

1) Which Business? 2a) List of Politicians who are against fair wages 2b) List of there Top Fund Raisers 3a) List of Politicians who are against Limit direct and indirect political contributions 3b) List of there Top Fund Raisers?

[-] 1 points by jrhirsch (4714) from Sun City, CA 1 year ago

Boycott businesses that pay less than $10 an hour for entry level positions. The largest are Walmart, McDonalds, Target, Kroger, and Sears, but there are many more.

Boycott businesses of top contributors. Sheldon Adelson (Las Vegas Venetian Resort Hotel Casino, Sands Expo and Convention Center, Adelson Drug Clinic), Harold Simmons (Dutch Boy paints, Titanium Metals Corporation, CompX International, Waste Control Specialists, Arby's restaurants in Florida, Texas, Pennsylvania, and Michigan), Bob J. Perry (Perry Homes), Goldman Sachs, James Simons ( The Medallion Fund, The Nova Fund, Renaissance Institutional Equities Fund, Renaissance Return Fund). Most of these corporations cater to higher end clientele so the average person should concentrate on boycotting businesses that pay low wages or lobby heavily.

Only support politicians who accept donations of less than $200 per contributor. This is a very short list. Rocky Anderson, Buddy Roemer, Even Bernie Sanders, the Independent Senator from Vermont, just 56% of his contributions were $200 or less. Obama received roughly 20% of his contributions from sub $200 donors in 2012.

Boycott entities that spend millions to lobby our representatives. General Electric, AT&T, Google, Goldman Sachs, Citigroup, UPS, JP Morgan Chase, Microsoft, Morgan Stanley, Time Warner, Bank of America. Many lobbyists are hard to target because their money comes from unions representing many individuals or organizations that represent many individual businesses. So those who receive their funds should be targeted instead.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

As for the Boycotting I would go 1 step further. Find out what the appropriate min wage is nation to nation, and boycott them globally on the same day/week.

[-] 1 points by jrhirsch (4714) from Sun City, CA 1 year ago

The U.S. alone will be a difficult enough nut to crack.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

The information is already out there, it just has to be organized.

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 1 year ago

My friend has vacation time he has to use, but the company keeps denying him any request for a day off

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

Should there be a Leader.... After All? Every successful Movement has had a voice that reflected it heart, and direction. Without a single voice to give a united a direction, Is a Leaderless Movement Self-Defeating?

[-] 3 points by penguento (362) 1 year ago

A leaderless movement is doomed to fail. Pure consensus can only work in small organizations, and to effectuate change an organization must get large.

[-] 2 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

As much as I agree with the spirit of the Movement, I have to agree

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26307) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

effectuate change

Shades of G.W. Shrub. effectuate - Heh Heh

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

How difficult would it be to create only a template for a census of peoples time and skills. What would be the questions asked? How would it be organized. I'm sure it's been one many times before. There must be a procedure for this? Can this procedure can be "app-ed" for a better word?

to create a template, what would need to be asked besides, Skills, Voluntary time,

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26307) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Add it to the current census - only make the census something that is done on a yearly basis ( hell attach it to tax returns - for those who are filing - should be easy enough to include a few pertinent questions ) Aw hell fuck the census they don't do that properly to begin with. Then once you have answered a question you need not do it again until your circumstances change. Those receiving Social Security could report through those offices. Those receiving state aid could report through the state the state forwards to federal data base. For updating changes - when you get your new form ( yearly ) it will have your answers from last year on it - check off the ones that remain unchanged and edit those that did change.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

But I'm not talking about something that complicated, just who wants to voluntary, When, Skills? I just wondering if I'm forgetting anything. I don't need age, sex, gender, etc...

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26307) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

To add just a report on skills - that could be accomplished as I stated - by individuals answering a simple question or two on a report they need to send off anyway. Schools could also report students receiving specialized training and the government could confirm with those individuals. I mean they already are supposed to be tracking this kind of information from our educational system - right?

What would be helpful would be information from business/industry as to what skills they are currently looking for and how they may relate to curriculum could be addressed by the education system working with government and business/industry and the public.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

I was thinking of collecting a set of skills, and time, Based on that create a Plan. Basically Incorporate the movement. Reinvent protesting logically based on resources with tradition means.

Could protesting at certain junctures effect a profit margins? Could not taking the bus? or taking the bus to much? Could buying and selling a stock on the same day be a form of protesting?

... A Plan

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26307) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Sure - find a really great green energy company on the market and BUY BUY BUY - Protest banskters and their practices by moving to a credit union. Protest wallmart nationally for their labor practice ( poor wages ). You may also want to move any 401K money out of speculation and into bonds.

Send true green energy technology information to all of your representatives in local and federal government. See who supports and who does not - vote out those who do not support - after complaining to them long loud and hard.

Share all of this on social media - share it and keep it in circulation.

If you are so able and well spoken in public - you may want to grab any opportunity to speak in public like at your schools and at city or town hall meetings etc.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

Yes, but your missing the point. All this has been done by your local Occupy, If every Occupy said if 1 Occupy protest Wallmart on the 7th then we all do... I mean Globally. be organized....

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26307) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

You betcha - that is why planning ahead and getting the word out in advance over the internet is essential - just like the notices of events that this site puts out - noting upcoming events. Share em circulate em. We just had that global day of protesting Fracking - we should have more.

We have just started this activism - be patient and work to keep moving forward. This all is not gonna be ended won overnight.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

hmmmm... if you took a list of all the upcoming protest and unified it then in theory it could be done.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26307) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

write an article - OWS is looking for writers - they will even pay you 50.00 if they publish your article. There is a post on the forum from interoccupy looking for writers - look into it - it may be part of the key you are looking for.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

I'll look into it... thanks

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26307) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago
[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

I believe that the movement should protest a corporation in unison globally. To give an example: protest all McDonald farms not restaurant, and distributors.

Imagine they had a shortage of fries...

Get them at the core

[-] 2 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 1 year ago

anyone can make fries and raw potatoes are cheap

[-] 1 points by penguento (362) 1 year ago

All you need do is figure out how to organize such a thing, and then actually go organize it. Those are always where the problems are.

[-] 2 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

That's my point!!!! We need to figure out how to organize this, in order to do that you need a list of resources, in order to do that you need a pre-plan, which could consist of an app for example. But we need a pre-game if you will.

Before you make a business plan you first make a pre-plan of all your resources, to better strategize

[-] 1 points by penguento (362) 1 year ago

Ah, but that all requires actually doing something. No one here is interested in that. You're going to figure out very quickly that you're beating a dead horse.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

How many you need to start?

[-] 1 points by penguento (362) 1 year ago

How many what? People? A handful of leaders, enough followers to complete the task. Depends on the task. But no one here will lead, and no one will follow, so it's irrelevant.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

IF people did, what do you think the direction of the 1st task should be?

[-] 0 points by BenCarollo (0) 1 year ago

I have a suggestion of an idea, that could potentially move the whole occupy movement into a way better direction http://www.gofundme.com/1edk30

My idea is to use large amounts of used plastic bottles to build artificial islands where people could live, it would be a way to separate people from the debt that they have been forced to take on, and it would be an example to the world that people can live without money. This is a way we can actually DO some thing, protests are fine but why not show people the world we envision

[-] 0 points by WSmith (1942) from Cornelius, OR 1 year ago

The answer is UNITY! It's the 99% action the 1% fears and loathes most.

It is also an idea and opinion. So your post needs work.

Fortunately, I'm right!

UNITE AND WIN!!

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

How??? On a technical level? that the question where asking here?

[-] 0 points by WSmith (1942) from Cornelius, OR 1 year ago

Name: The People's Union

Pledge: The People First, UN UNIVERSAL DECLARATION OF HUMAN RIGHTS

Website: TBA, here until then

Headquarters: TBA, a very bomb-proof building with internet

Membership: US initially, perhaps more later.

Motto: UNITE AND WIN!

[-] 0 points by BetsyRoss (-744) 1 year ago

Three little letters-EMP

There is no such thing as a bomb proof building.

[-] 0 points by WSmith (1942) from Cornelius, OR 1 year ago

No patience for cryptic, what's EMP???

[-] 0 points by WSmith (1942) from Cornelius, OR 1 year ago

Maybe a little mad scientist-y??

[-] -1 points by BetsyRoss (-744) 1 year ago

EMP generators are used to test viability of electronic systems all the time. Here's one example- http://fbmonitor.com/2012/03/07/wsmr-uses-electromagnetic-pulse-generator-on-abrams-atec-tests-tank-for-us-ally/

Your requirement for a "bomb-proof building with internet" can very easily become "minus internet" even without an EMP though.

And every building can be blown up if someone wants to blow it up badly enough. Apparently you're anticipating that someone would attempt to try "very" hard.

[-] 0 points by WSmith (1942) from Cornelius, OR 1 year ago

RW Extremists. Yes. Our domestic terrorists.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26307) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Boehner and crew? Yep - lock em up.

[-] 0 points by WSmith (1942) from Cornelius, OR 1 year ago

B and C are mere go-fers for the 1% Power Elite.

[-] 0 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 1 year ago

we are not trying to make money

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

But the decisions made are based on money. Protest in the past have caused companies to lose profit to the point of a reversal of decisions.

If you know how much a protest is going to cost a company you can evaluate how many protesters you need and for how long.

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 1 year ago

I don't support Iran Sanctions

guaranteed numbers at protests would help

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

I'm not so sure I might agree, but my point is there needs be a central place to organize, so whatever the protest, it can be global.

[-] 1 points by gsw (2697) 1 year ago

why not at state capitals, (or county government buildings) same place and time each month, say 12:00 first sunday of each month.

Could this forum be used to organize 1 day a month, or 2 day a month "occupy" actions at state capitals, to at least keep this going in news, to focus on local bills, and lobby for the people, and organize for local candidates who can work for the people. Set a day, say first Sunday of each month at 12:00 to grow the movement nationally.

Then, the local movements can meet up at state/regional levels (and casual people who want to show up know where and when to show up).

Besides just chanting and getting arrested, there needs to be legislative bills that can be discussed, and petitioned for.

I don't think there will be a mass of Americans, who want to show up at rallies and be arrested. This place is too conservative for that, the people too passive.

But to stand up for specific legislative actions and bills: which have been enumerated numbers of times, such as

Universal Health Care,

things people are already behind and in agreement on, I think more people would show up if there were specific targeted message or bill they were supporting, rather than a vague "system change revolution"

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

Wow, Use this forum by all means, I have a few idea... it's a little different, but this is what the direction I was thinking about....

Example: A Bill for good, is being blocked by Governor Bob, Why? Insurance Company Acme gave fund raiser Whats my point? Why protest Bob, we need to respect it's a corporate government, protest Insurance Company Acme? How and for How long? 1) how much profit are they making by this? let's say it's $N.00 2) in order to pass this bill they would need to lose $N.00 in protest How many protesters do we need, and for how long? That depends on the protest strategy?

anyways you get the idea, i think it's time to rethink protesting

Use business against business

[-] 1 points by gsw (2697) 1 year ago

sure, but would we all have to be at the company's headquarters to do the protest.

couldn't we protest from 50 or 500 locations accross the country, at state capitals, or major cities or something.

If there was a direct bill that would be advocated as well as just protesting against the corporation, I think that would be more concrete for the general public to grasp as a positive force.

And if it was a set time and place, we could plan for making that time available, especially weekends are better for people with work week jobs.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

Again, it would be case by case, depending on what your protesting but that's my point is we should be doing this kind of research before hand from now on.

Maximize our Protest, the say way Corporation Maximize the Profits, ... through Analytical Research

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26307) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

What is needed are communication hubs communicating with each other. One on-line occupy group to another occupy group as well as other social groups like the sierra club and union of concerned scientists and aarp etc etc etc charities health groups etc etc Labor unions parent teacher associations etc etc

Each site could gather and distribute information and coordinate with the other sites and groups at an on-line gathering/meeting place that they put together.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

That makes a lot of sense. I was thinking off the cuff, A possible way to start would be to gather all the occupy protest date ans see how many are on the same day, how many are related on different days, and how many can be combined?

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26307) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Site to site group to group coordination/communication. Hell eventually pool resources and buy air time.

Occupy or coalition infomercials?

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

i don't see Occupy taking the cable route, I see it more of an online, but you never know.

I think maybe when an occupy wants to protest they give advance notice to a central occupy, and if there is a similar occupy or another occupy that could help.Then the central occupy sets the date. What do you think?

[-] 1 points by gsw (2697) 1 year ago

Do hey still have public access cable channel available?

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

I have cable

[-] 1 points by gsw (2697) 1 year ago

television cable TV channel. In addition, the cable television companies must make Public, educational, and government access (PEG) channels available for the Public-access organization to distribute the locally originated Nonprofit organization's programming produced by or made available to the organization.[citation needed]

Like Wayne's World http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wayne's_World_(film)

Cable Companies are required to provide access to equipment and time for broadcast.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_public-access_TV_stations_in_the_United_States

Have guests. Videos Or how about radio show?

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

Radio Internet...

[-] 1 points by gsw (2697) 1 year ago

I hadn't heard of it

http://www.globaltalkradio.com/shows/publicaccessradio/

They have 24 listeners now. Might take a while at that rate.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

Bookmarked for later....

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26307) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Yes - there has to be an idea - then a discussion - then a gathering of information on response to reach your best consensus - then that needs to be communicated. Time consuming so you want to start communications and information gathering well in advance of target action dates.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

Are there any specialized tools that are used for these tasks?

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26307) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

I would suppose that a data collection/compilation e-form would be the way to go - so that information gathered is already categorized and compiled as it is entered. Not really my area of expertise ( IT ) but I have used similar things when I was still working - so know that this kind of thing can be done.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

Even before that what besides, skills, education, experience, do you need to know?

if an app optional gps, if you in the neighborhood, don't shop at a certain store, or whatever...

you do not need name, age, race, address, (maybe email),

am i forgetting anything?

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26307) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

For approaching the subject of proper education and the teaching of needed skills - where the job market is hungry. To make it work for the individual - to graduate and be successfully employed.

In my opinion - there is needed an upgrade in technology teaching/education across the board so that at the very least graduates of say high school - will have a competency in all fields in an adequate general knowledge and working familiarity with technologies. Specialization should be addressed in the field ( working ) continuing education. As well as furthering depth of knowledge and skills in higher education - if there is a specific field and so specific knowledge needed for that field. But pretty much of every field of study or area of work should share similarities of required technical familiarity and know-how.

This is also why basics - manual ability can not be skimped either.

Versatility - the ability to go into any place of business and preform well as long as you apply yourself - should be the goal.

[-] -1 points by DogBone (-201) 1 year ago

Where is the movement ?? it is not ows because they crashed and burned from the get go. This site is the only thing they have left to cling to

[-] -1 points by hchc (3297) from Tampa, FL 1 year ago

These dicsussion were plentiful a year ago. And they kept going. And going. And going. And going.

People who wanted to help can only sit for so long, night after night, and listen to people debate how a GA functions for so long.

Everyone got a good dose of what organizing is like- getting people focused with no pay and relatively no rules is quite the challenge.

At this point I would say just do the best with what is left. Election season fucked a lot of stuff up. Im betting a lot of people who have been campaigning are going to come back and use their new found experience to try to reorganize their local Occupy.

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

I would disagree, and Occupy Sandy proves that. A year has passed and people realized structure is missing, I'm sure there is one out there...

I believe an app that divided tasks into mini tasks. you could go on this app and answer a random question? say if you skill was set to lawyer. etc... or do a small task, maybe based on Gps, a system of organization that fits the times.

[-] 0 points by hchc (3297) from Tampa, FL 1 year ago

Go for it

[-] 1 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

recognize there need to a procure and designing are two different things, but I'll help the "procedure expert"

[-] 0 points by gsw (2697) 1 year ago

Could this forum be used to organize 1 day a month, or 2 day a month "occupy" actions at state capitals, to at least keep this going in news, to focus on local bills, and lobby for the people, and organize for local candidates who can work for the people. Set a day, say first Sunday of each month at 12:00 to grow the movement nationally.

[-] 2 points by DKAtoday (26307) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Send in your query to the forum admin. Get it up on their news board.

[-] 1 points by gsw (2697) 1 year ago

Good plan.

Liking it I am trying to find the best email address to contact forum admin,

and I must be overlooking it somehow. Where will I see it?

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26307) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

Well there is this ( from the info button "ABOUT" at the top right corner of the page ):

Help & Directions +1 (516) 708-4777

General Inquiries general@occupywallst.org

Press Inquiries press@occupywallst.org

Inquiries Re: OccupyWallSt.org info@occupywallst.org +1 (516) 708-4777

[-] 1 points by gsw (2697) 1 year ago

thanks. I saw that and wasn't sure if that was it or not.

thanks very much.

PS Mesage Sent.

[-] 1 points by DKAtoday (26307) from Coon Rapids, MN 1 year ago

No problem - did you see the request for writers post? It may tie in to this effort.

http://occupywallst.org/forum/writers-wanted-for-occupywallstorg/

[-] 1 points by hchc (3297) from Tampa, FL 1 year ago

It is more like pullling teeth tahn you can imagine.....its tough getting people to show up.

[-] -3 points by KevinLark (-103) 1 year ago

Before ows can actually be called a movement it must involve people that are members, and from day one ows has not made any members. This site is basically all ows has left to cling to

[-] 2 points by 10N (134) 1 year ago

Occupy Sandy would disagree with you