Forum Post: Well oKAY then. Try This . . .
Posted 10 years ago on July 27, 2013, 2:39 p.m. EST by ZenDogTroll
(13032)
from South Burlington, VT
This content is user submitted and not an official statement
While I was over on the rabidly right wing WorldTruth.com website it appeared that there was no end of fools intent on some of the most insane reasoning. It was as if the entire concept of one rabid, right wing extremist using another rabid right wing extremist to get the dirty work done was just . . . unthinkable, let alone something that could ever be considered standard operating procedure.
So Try This
Strictly as an experiment of course - set fire to a Koran. In fact, why be conservative about it in the least - burn several. In a highly public manner.
What is my point?
A reasonable question. The answer is really quite simple. I value free speech, and there is not one type of conservative you can name that cannot be shown to embrace a willingness to place significant curbs before dissent, if not actually guilty of placing the stumbling blocks themselves.
Salmon Rushdie, Kurt Westergaard - individuals whose freedom of speech has been significantly curbed - by radical, right wing extremists.
Radical, right wing extremists
of any variety are extremely dangerous. I say it does not matter what nationality they are, it does not matter what God they choose to believe in, or even if they choose to believe in one at all.
We must simply kill them, in sufficient numbers that they may learn and understand well, the rest of us intend to live in peace, with each other, in the blessed absence of their insane meddling.
"Strictly as an experiment of course - set fire to a Koran. In fact why be conservative about it - in the least, burn several. In a highly public manner."
It should be no surprise that a people who have been, and continue to be persecuted by a Western country and its allies seeking hegemony should find comfort in their religion
There is no room for organized religion in my life, but I do realize that there are many good religious people who practice what they preach
To show such insensitivity to them is bull-shit
Hence I view your xenophobic...mean-spirited thread and rantings of the last few days as garbage, and a sign of some sort of personal problems you are having
~Odin~
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As with all people that have been oppressed...for generations in this case, they are far more likely to hold onto their religious beliefs in the hope of someday having a better life for themselves and their loved ones
This in many cases may be their last shred of dignity....their relationship to their God
And for you whose tax dollars goes to keeping these persecuted people in bondage...making their lives miserable.... to flippantly suggest that we burn Korans to prove some sort of point..... to flush out the fanatics perhaps... is totally insensitive and disrespectful to them as fellow human beings
But I get it..... if it's not an American life, it doesn't count...right?
It is an 'out of sight..out of mind' hypocritical, xenophobic.. moral bankruptcy that we have become conditioned to accept as it eases our consciences to the suffering that these people endure in our quest for hegemony
The sea change we are seeking is not about creating more divisions, but rather about creating unity, and a return to justice and doing what's right. And in case you have forgotten, this is a world-wide struggle
And we have a common oppressor, and it is them that we should be channeling our anger...and perhaps our "experiments"... against, not each other
~Odin~
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And how or who exactly should i broaden my definition of "they" or "them" to include
~Odin~
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The difference...one group has been maligned and persecuted at least since the time that oil was discovered on their lands, and the other group has been hell-bent on extracting their resources, forcing them into a horrible life, and expanding Empire
How would people here take it if the Pope was severely ridiculed, or Bibles were burned
This would most likely not even be a topic of conversation if our exploitation were not so
Who's to say that we should push our value system on them, and considering that they have not had the chance to progress in a natural way..... in the fact we have supported despotic leaders who have made their life a living hell.....I mean, what right do we have to judge them?
I mean look...at the human misery we are causing throughout the world, and our prisons are bursting, and whether that is because of a rotten criminal justice system, or because we are a bunch of deviants, we have lost our right to preach and pass judgement on other people
If we want a more just system for ourselves, we must support one for the world
I dislike religious fanaticism, no matter where it emanates from as much as anyone when the results are injurious to our country, but most Muslims simply find comfort in their religion from the pain the West brings to their home-land, the same as many African Americans did during slavery and the Jim Crow days especially. That pain was brought out in many of the powerful gospel songs that of that era.
This is about respect and justice for other people, the same thing we want in this country....and once again, we have lost our moral right to preach either of those virtues to other civilizations, as there is simply little basis for our ethnocenticism
~Odin~
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He's trying to play you.
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Is radical, right wing extremism a division of the collective unconscious that places its perceptions, purposes and plan over all other life?
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No need to underline the practical awareness of corruption that we need to protect our human interests. My point is that the uniformity of the corruption belies any conscious organization I can imagine.
There is very good evidence that the collective unconscious exists, besides being completely logical to tend to accept that there is reason it must exist even though our conscious cannot examine it directly with ease. That, is intentional by the elite of material power who started burning people, then books. Now they have pc's and virus's.
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A method and theory of conspiracy. Then, of course what is unconscious is better than secret ,
If you value free speech, then stay off of college and university campuses, many of which have "speech codes".
...and speech codes aren't pushed by radical, right wing extremists. To the contrary, they're pushed by the radical left wing establishment, not in Iran or Denmark, but right here in the good old U.S. of A.
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It's clear where you stand on the ideological spectrum. Lie to me, but not to yourself.
And this little diddy about "we must simply kill them"? What are you going to kill them with? Your keyboard or your iPod or your Starbucks Latte? Please.
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Careful ITG, there's a black helicopter circling you. rolleyes
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Burn them? Wouldn't that be a lot like "smokin' shit"? Why not just take a dump on 'em and push 'em out of an airplane? Matter of fact, if we lit them up before the drop we could really hit them with some smokin' shit. We can bomb whomever you like.
http://www.eclectablog.com/2013/07/protest-singing-and-watching-singing-in-the-wisconsin-state-capitol-now-arrestable-offenses.html
Can we start with Wisconsin's First Church of Koch??
How about an Allah/Mohammad cartoon coalition? A comic coalition?
If you take your religion so serious that you can't make fun of it.....It deserves to be made fun of!!!
And as for you shooz! "How about an Allah/Mohammad cartoon coalition? A comic coalition?"
I find it surprising that you have not only kept your silence when it was another group besides your own being persecuted...Muslims, but now you have joined in on Zen's 'xenophobic....mean-spirited' thread in persecuting Muslims
It's amusing to me how you have repeatedly used the lyrics to Dylan/Hendrix song over the past few days, So let us not talk falsely now," in answering your critics
Here's another few lines for you to ponder & battologize from a Kris Kristofferson song, although it is unlikely that you will considering how applicable they are to your base, simplistic outlook on life
The lyrics....."Jesus was a Capricorn, he ate organic foods....He believed in love and peace and never wore no shoes...Long hair, beard and sandals and a funky bunch of friends. Reckon they'd just nail him up if He come down again.
'Cos everybody has got to have somebody to look down on. [ding, ding, ding] who they can feel better than at anytime they please. Someone doing somethin' dirty, decent decent folks can frown on. If you can't find nobody else, then help yourself to me [shooz as my shoulders are far bigger than my belly]"
And while you seem to have forgotten your own people's plight by ignoring the plight and injustices to others
I am in the planning stages with two of my daughters (one who is visiting from AK) to attend the 50th anniversay of MLK's March On Washington. I'm sure you remember, my Dad left the comforts and ignorance of white America to be there on that day in 1963
Perhaps there is a lesson to be learned from this white boy, and that is when you stand silent in the face of a people being persecuted, you are just as guilty as if you openly perpetrated it yourself
Enjoy your cynical, xenophobic wallowing.....the kind needed to have gotten us to this rotten place in our history. I'll stay with the positive....
~Odin~
Oh my.
You too have decided to jump on the "put shooz on the defensive" bandwagon?
This is rather assumptive and presumptive too.
My comment does not exist in a vacuum.
Let me do this in two parts.
Notice the link and the comment below it.
I was trying to pull him away from what he was suggesting and show him someone who's books we really do need to burn, right after we strip them of their power to affect us.
You do remember that I really, really HATE what the Koch's have done and are still doing.
While we sit here and bicker about politics.
They are stepping up their game of dismantling those parts of democracy they haven't already destroyed, even now...............
I would prefer to stop them.
Deflection as tact. That's what I was doing there....with a touch of cynical humor, in an attempt to draw his attention else where..
Which brings me to the second part.
Humor!!
A theatrical art form. ( when done right)
Carlin knew this, and was proudest of himself, when he believed he'd finally achieved it.
Humor is very important to the human condition.
So is freedom of speech. Even if that speech, pokes fun at a religion.
All of them should be poked fun of.
Especially those that think you're not supposed to.
Comedy...IS a human right.
I also believe in art. VERY strongly.
Many artist have created and or desecrated icons over the years.
Some have been vilified by churches, but the art remained.
The latest being Pussy Riot.
They got prison.
Do I think wantonly burning Korans in front of Muslims for the express purpose of insulting, or attempting "stir them up" is OK? No I don't.
Any more than I think it would be OK to burn Bibles or flags, under similar circumstances.
Laws should be written against such excitement.
And I'm really not that rude.
That being said, I don't think someone who did, should be stoned to death on the spot either, although that could happen.
No one should be forced into hiding for the written word, as Rushdie was. No one. Not Snowden, not Manning either.
That is true freedom of speech
In the end, they are all still icons. Books of paper and flags of cloth.
Before you get off on some other assumption?
I know the VERY fundamental, and profound difference, between religion and spirituality.
Are you done looking down on me now? (ding ding ding)
PS: Dogma is one of my favorite movies of all time.
It did nothing BUT poke fun of religion.
This is amusing, white boy.
"Amusing"...perhaps, but true.
~Odin~
No.
That deserves it's own thread, right there. I guarantee the Koch whores here would object.
OK done!!
Anything to get the Koch Whores screaming - Hey? {:-])
Granted that it is not a difficult proposition ( getting Koch whores screaming ).
You gotta be kidding?
They'll be starting yet another thread about being censored, before they'll bump a thread about their favorite Koch Whore.
I like it when the koch whores/shills scream censorship - and then get booted anyway. Good Humor. Where is their outrage at the MSM??? Different when the shills get censored I guess.
Ha Ha the Koch Whores are doing their silent screaming again - downvote BS. HaHaHahahaheeeheheehehe
Lame is what they are. Lame antics are what they do.
Other than just plain making stuff up about everything.
From bridges to the ground, to twinkle teams, they are built on lies.
Clean coal???? HaHaHahahaheeeheheehehe ... what utter BS
Scream Koch Suckers - SCREAM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Wouldn't it be better if we just put them in a cage with the other groups and let them go to town? Like MMA?