Forum Post: They're Ba'ack! Both Overt & Covert GOP Zombies Defy Natural Death & Shame
Posted 11 years ago on Jan. 24, 2013, 3:56 a.m. EST by WSmith
(2698)
from Cornelius, OR
This content is user submitted and not an official statement
They're Ba'ack! Both Overt & Covert GOP Zombies Defy Natural Death & Shame and resume their Walking Dead attack!!
Despite a devastating and revealing 2-6 year campaign and subsequent electoral rebuke, RepubliCon Zombies Overtly and Covertly resume their attack as if they weren't slaughtered and nothing ever happened!
From gerrymandering, voter suppression, gun control, using MLK's name in vain, to attacking Obama's Affordable Care Act, on and shamelessly on, the Con Zombies who should be demolished or at least hiding in disgrace are back! Denying, pettifogging, obstructing, recriminating, sabotaging, blaming, and falsely equating, just like before.
Overtly screaming about the rampant tyrannical overreach of Obama stripping us all of our "God-Given" constitutional rights! Covertly equating Dems and Obama with the Laissez Faire governance and the war mongering fraud and crimes of RepubliCons. Despite overwhelming GOP-damning revelations and regardless of the overwhelming will of The People, the Con Zombies come staggering back, unfazed.
The Good news, the Bad news, and the really really F'n bad news
[As OVERT GOP Zombies resume the attack on We The People, democracy, the 99% and Obama; and the COVERT/OBLIVIOUS GOP Zombies resume the "Both-Same" attack on Obama, RELEVANCE and REALITY!!]
There is a lot of 'new' talk going around Washington as we experience yet another peaceful transfer of power to our new duly elected government.
Obama is talking like FDR when he says '...that doesn't make us takers'. In a direct slap to Congressman Paul Ryan (or more accurately a beat down...) the President of the United States made it clear he works for the people and not the billionaires that tried to install Romney-Ryan as the mouth piece for their Oligarchy.
President Barack H. Obama, "We, the people, still believe that every citizen deserves a basic measure of security and dignity. We must make the hard choices to reduce the cost of health care and the size of our deficit. But we reject the belief that America must choose between caring for the generation that built this country and investing in the generation that will build its future. For we remember the lessons of our past, when twilight years were spent in poverty, and parents of a child with a disability had nowhere to turn. We do not believe that in this country, freedom is reserved for the lucky, or happiness for the few. We recognize that no matter how responsibly we live our lives, any one of us, at any time, may face a job loss, or a sudden illness, or a home swept away in a terrible storm. The commitments we make to each other - through Medicare, and Medicaid, and Social Security - these things do not sap our initiative; they strengthen us. They do not make us a nation of takers; they free us to take the risks that make this country great." Take that 'granny starver'.
Harry Reid is talking 'Constitutional Option', that is he's saying that 50 votes plus the VP should be enough to pass any bill in the Senate. While this isn't explicitly stated in the Constitution, it does list five exemptions from a simple majority, such as the 'veto override with 2/3 vote' and one can only conclude that the Framers meant a simple majority, and not 60 votes to do anything.
Nancy Pelosi is doing the 'real' talking as the de facto Speaker of the House. The 'fiscal cliff' bill was passed by Democrats and a minority of Republicans. The same as with the bill to avoid default on the expenditures that the Republicans have already made, also known as raising the debt ceiling.
That was all the good news, now for the bad news, the Koch brothers funded state legislatures are moving toward an Apportioned Electoral College in 'blue states' that the Republicans have captured through gerrymandering. In these states that would normally go for any Democrat running for President, the Republicans would cleave off the electoral votes in any Congressional District that they have managed to carve out for Republican domination (assuming that district was made to vote for the Republican). The end result would be a Republican becoming President with millions of fewer votes than a majority. Language in the Bush v. Gore ruling from the Supreme Court that establishes that there is 'no Constitutional right' for citizens to 'vote' for the President sets the stage for this abomination.
The way Gerrymandering works is that Republicans create as many districts as possible that contain a bare a majority of Republican voters, and as many districts as possible that contain nearly 100% of Democrats in liberal voting ghettos. Often distant pockets of Democrats are linked by block wide corridors that can be a hundred miles long and include few voters.
In practice a the 'Republican' district may contain only one third Republicans, that is if sufficient voter suppression is applied. Either through simple negative advertising that disgusts enough 'normal' people that they don't bother to vote while Conservatives goose-step down to the polls to vote against their own self interest based on their irrational fears and prejudice. Or through out right suppression of Constitutionally eligible voters who are kept from voting by any number of 'illegal' means, ranging from 'voter caging' where people are illegally stricken from the registration list, to selective denial of voter access to the polls.
If you live in a 'Democratic' precinct any number of means, including but not limited to an 'insufficient' numbers of voting machines to literal 'voter intimidation' by the use of goons to scare voters away, to the use of misleading mailers from official and bogus sources to confuse voters. The possible ways to make this happen is endless, the depths of their deceit bottomless, and the evil in the hearts unlimited by time or space. The 'really, really bad news' is the current push through the same Koch Brothers controlled state legislatures is to have a Constitutional Convention. Ostensibly this is just to pass an amendment to require a 2/3 majority to enact any increase in the income tax. This would not include peasant taxes like sales and excise taxes that would pass with a simple majority. All profits for the rich, all taxes for the poor. That would be bad enough, but a Constitutional Convention is not limited to a preset agenda once it's in session. Any number of really nasty 'reforms' could be put in place that would be pre-loaded with language that would allow the conservative Supreme Court to carve out anything they were ordered to produce.
That's not to say that the Supremes can't sing any tune at anytime, but with the tiny minority that the conservatives actually have, they must maintain the fiction that this is all the 'will of the people'. The only thing that can stop this is that 'the people' become fully aware of the difference, and enforce their will instead. Tuesday, January 22, 2013 www.prairie2.com
The 8 Most Extreme Moments of the New Congress
The 113th Congress has barely started, but that hasn’t stopped Republicans from already dishing out plenty of offensive comments.
There are those here who would have us believe that victories for the 99% in the political arena are somehow not victories. But they are victories - the only victories that matter.
Occupy sparked this broader progressive movement, and to see that movement go mainstream is not defeat, it is victory. That is why the mouthpieces for the 1%, both on this forum and in the mainstream media, are trying so hard to convince us that it is not a victoriy.
It is this effort, and sadly the degree of success those people have been having here in their efforts to divide us on each other, that has led me to drastically reduce my participation on this forum. We don't need to fight over turf, we need to strategize - inclusive of all those who share our goals, period.
Now is not the time to succumb to bickering about "political purity," as if politics ever somehow represented a stainless ideal. Idealism comes in in discovering what we need to do, politics is about finding a way to do it. This instigation to wrangle over "political purity" was how the progressive coalition was defeated in the 60"s, and I've had a crawfull of it!
The Democratic Party is still the party of F.D.R. To the extent it has become corrupt it has been a reflection of the will of the people over the past 70 years.
Sorry, there's just no way around it. American politics has become corrupt because we, as a people, have become corrupted, and just as we became corrupted we can also reinvigorate our politics and our society with a renewed moral vision.
That is the greatest thing humanity can do, simply because it has so rarely been done, but as we are human we are capable of refformation - capable of our own salvation.
I remember when America, in spite of its stayed "conservativism" (not to be confused with Neo-Con Neo--Fascism), was a fundametally moral and decent country. What we were we can not only become again, we can surpass what we were then. That is the potential of the human spirit. All it takes is the will!
The name of a political party does not guarentee either its integrity or it's corrpution. It is up to "We the People" to impose integrity upon those who are among us, and have always been among us, who would divide us for their own ends.
That is why the founders of our democracy said that the preservation of liberty requires eternal vigillance. We must now Become the political will of America through engagement and support of those leaders who champion our cause, regardless of whether they are Independent, Democrat, Green, or of some other party as of yet numerically insignificant.
It is not the Democratic Process, but those who would divide us that are to be feared. Through our continued and relentless engagement we can transform the Democratic Party, or achieve whatever we want to achieve in American politics - but only through relentless and active engagement in the process. The choice is up to us, engage or waste our energies in pointless and self-defeating squabbling over "political purity." I know that all those who came here to begin with though honest intentions will agree that we need to Band Together now and Get This Done.
Hey GK. Just because you continually keep saying that those that oppose your point of view do so because they are concerned about "political purity" and/or are "mouth pieces for the 1%"... does NOT make it so. It might make you feel more elevated or justified in your beliefs by continuing to repeat that, but it is belittling to those who are in disagreement for what they believe are legitimate reasons. You seem to have misconstrued those reasons to make your arguement stronger, and you have chosen to not have addressed them here. You must know all this by now because we have had this discussion many times over the last 17-18 months. If you are going to state the position of kindred people to me, and there are many (an overwhelming majority in OWSNY I believe), please state it correctly, and suffice to say, let me know if I state your position wrongly.
Next, all the people here that are in disagreement with you on how OUR struggle should progress are not all "mouthpieces for the 1%," nor are we "squabbl[ers]" or "bicker[ers]" for the sake of being so, at least, no more than YOU are for not agreeing with us that Occupy Wall Street should stay outside the rotten political system for what we believe are good reasons....if we want to have a real sea change anyway.
I/we believe that for OWS to go "mainstream" is a big mistake not a nuance. My conviction in thinking this is not to divide this movement, but rather to unify it, and have it be efficacious in the role that it plays in OUR struggle. But i guess we both believe that in the adversarial positions we have taken out of conscience. In any event the highway is littered with failed, well-behaved MS progressive movements.
There is little doubt though that there has been, and will continue to be "victories for the 99% in the political arena," and yes I do indeed consider them "victories", unlike your supposition that people in disagreement with you, erroneously suggests that we do not consider them "victories". However to use that as justication for us to seemingly become a branch of the Democrats, and that this corporate/banker-owned party is benign and not to be "feared" is a 'leap,' and it is a HUGE one.
Finally GK, I have devoted far too much time and energy into this movement, for you, or anyone else to label people like me who disagree with you as being petty.....a "political purist"...divisive..."a 1%mouth piece"....a "bicker"[er], or a "squabble"[r] These are all red baiting-like terms, and they are offensive.
I suggest that you get smalller opponent bags......and throw all the people who are trying to destroy this movement into one 'air tight' bag,..... and then all the people who have legitimate conscience driven diasagreements with you AND who dearly want this movement to succeed into another bag, rather than having us all thrown in one convenient, easy to proselytize or criticize bigger bag. And in doing so, you will help set the tone in which we hopefully will be able to overcome our differences for 'The Greater Good,'... and "Band Together Now and Get This Done."
~Odin~
And BTW, I could give a shit who takes credit for the "political victories" to come. I just want them to keep coming.
I'm sorry if I have come off as strident lately. The reason I have done so is because of what I have seen as a great effort to divide people here on this forum. It is the people who have been trying to divide us, and not any genuine Occupier that I am reffering to as "mouthpieces of the 1%. If I haven't made that clear I'm sorry.
My fear is that even united we have a great uphill struggle against the powers of corporate vested interest. Everytime I come on this forum and see these agruments instigated between us by plants on this forum I feel a small sense of loss.
There are those we can't unite with, namely the Republican Party and fellow travelers who are those upholding the staus quo. But when we become divissive with each other over issues that are neither really relevent to the aims of this movement, or within our power to change, we are playing into their hands.
I hope that explains my comment. I also want to say that I am just one voice. I'm not always right. I know that, and I'm sure others are quite well aware of it too.
Thanks, I apologize for my 'rant' according to DK too. I do not like to give ammo to my detractors on here, but there is an old self-depracating saying about Swedes, "You can tell a Swede, but you can't tell him anything." 'cause he already knows it all. ;-) The negative inferrence that comes out of that saying, and knowing that we all have to deal with a certain amount of stress in our lives even well beyond this forum, well apology accepted.
You're right GK, we do have a "great up-hill strugle," and you were also right in your comment when you implied that we must have a return in our "integrity," or on a broader scale as BW has called it "a change in our ethos." So once again in that light, apology accepted.
The world we want starts now.
~Odin~
Thanks Odin.
It is because of you, and people like you that I still have hope.
It is also funny that GK's comment gets you all bent out of shape ( for no apparent reason ) - but you have nothing to say to the author of the original Post ( you know the topic author ).
See my reply to GK.
~Odin~
I did not care for GK's comment either. Odin may have taken a passionate stab at it, but I, in no way, shape or form think this movement is a movement of the Democratic Party.
Wow - yep that was probably worded poorly - I think - and you should ask GK - But I think he was going for Democratic not party.
That would be much better! I've been thinking about GK's comment all day which is good, because it is thought provoking, and of course, I like GK, but for me, I did like Odin's reply. It spoke for me.
BW, I also in no way think this is a movement of the Democratic Party, but I also don't believe it is a movement that excludes members of the Democratic Party. The point is there are those who would like to convey that belief - that this movement excludes those people. That idea is in my view positively detremental to building a coalition that can actually gain the power to turn America, and by extension the world, towards a more positive social order.
The other side, in their death grip on economic power, holds all the other chips and so it seems to me that we must now confront the battle for power in the political arena, and win.
I hate the two party system. I hate the compromise and corruption of the New Democrats. But I also think the New Democrats arose out of a generation in which the American people made traditional, progressive Democrats unelectable through to their own beliefs. In other words people bought the Reagan propoganda. In that sense it is we, as a people, who are responsible for the corruption of the Democratic Party.
I am a Jeffersonian Democrat, as in "Demos," as in "the people." I am an FDR Democrat, as in the legacy of social justice that he and Elenor represented.
In a two party system (which we cannot reform without first controlling), the only way to make change it seems to me is through forming an enlightened polity, to the extent that an enlightened electorate comes to form the majority. That means above all unity as opposed to exclusion. Attempts to change the system through direct action have historically had limited success in this country, and in the face of an entrenched power elite armed to the teeth, seem unlikely to do so any time in the near future, and so we appear to be thrust back into these terribly complex and frustrating questions of how to proceed in the face of this corporate juggernaught, and of the two party system they now largely control.
These are serious conundrums. I have spent a lot of time thinking about the question, and the ONLY way I see to get through to the other side is through Unity, coalition building, and consciousness raising all at the same time. But to me the" bottom line" is Unity, and since the majority of progressives in America still identify with the Democratic Party it seems counter-productive to spend time bashing that party (as some here seem to spend most of their time doing) rather than working to reform it, especally as, I for one, don't see them going away voluntarily any time soon.
We can run people under another banner, and I think that is a good idea, but the real solution seems to be to force our vision onto the system through unity and aggressive activism; and that these values will either succeed of fail irrespective of the concept of political party. They see to be more a question of character, courage, and commitment than of party. . .
I don't know if any of this makes sense, but it is what I have so far been able to conclude.
In any case, I am always in solidiarity with you, with Odin, and with this movement regardless of which course we choose to take, or into which course the flow of time and fortune carry us.
I agree completely that this movement includes people who consider themselves Democrats. Of course. It includes the Green Party, Republicans and libertarians, too. The issues we face affect all of us, and in the end, they even affect the 1% who would benefit from a society that had a better economic system as well, but who just have yet to learn that money isn't everything. I think Occupy Wall Street has already had a major affect. In fact, Obama might not have won if it weren't for the change in discourse the Occupy has brought to the nation. Occupy has perhaps, prevented a fascist takeover, lol.
My feeling is that we just keep pushing the envelope outside the political system, that way we can stay true to who we are, to what we really believe in, without being co-opted. The ideas will be absorbed into the current political system because that is inevitable. So, we can do both, and we have. Solidarity with you too, GK.
Well of course it did BW - you are a lover/defender/protector - and you felt empathy with odin feeling picked on - so - you were ready to defend.
But I honestly think you both overlooked:
The Democratic Party is still the party of F.D.R. To the extent it has become corrupt it has been a reflection of the will of the people over the past 70 years.
Sorry, there's just no way around it. American politics has become corrupt because we, as a people, have become corrupted, and just as we became corrupted we can also reinvigorate our politics and our society with a renewed moral vision.
and :
I remember when America, in spite of its stayed "conservativism" (not to be confused with Neo-Con Neo--Fascism), was a fundametally moral and decent country. What we were we can not only become again, we can surpass what we were then. That is the potential of the human spirit. All it takes is the will!
The name of a political party does not guarentee either its integrity or it's corrpution. It is up to "We the People" to impose integrity upon those who are among us, and have always been among us, who would divide us for their own ends.
I say unite in the truth, not the lies spewed by rhetorical speeches that result in absolutely nothing..
Support issues - oppose issues - not parties.
That is the point.
Exactly - so there should be no disagreements. Hey?
Focus on the issues, and no, there won't be. We have no shortage of issues, as you know.
The issues . . . yes, but the human spirit really is the issue! There are none so blind as they who will not see! The question is Why they will not see!
THAT IS THE ISSUE!!!!!
We need to take a quantum leap in honesty about our own natures! The right hand does not know what the left hand is doing! Our consciousness is split, divided, conflicted! We are miserable and we must now Fight our way through to becoming fullly human, to become whole again, to become integrated or perish!
We are broken by the conflict, the complexity, the paradox and the duality of existance, and by our inability to come to terms with it while retaining the wholeness and integrity of our spirits!
We humans are in a harrowing situation. I really have admiration and sympathy for every one of us!
We can rise again, but only by destroying the "mind forged manacles" thrust upon us by the struggle for survival - that sadly most of us have forgotten we are even shackled by! We are conditioned to block out the titantic significance of existence, and the incomparable question of Being.
Conquer the fear of death and the love of life and you are halfway there!
Americans need nothing short of an apothiosis.
Pity This Busy Monster Manunkind
'pity this busy monster, manunkind' pity this busy monster, manunkind,
not. Progress is a comfortable disease: your victim (death and life safely beyond)
plays with the bigness of his littleness --- electrons deify one razorblade into a mountainrange; lenses extend unwish through curving wherewhen till unwish returns on its unself. A world of made is not a world of born --- pity poor flesh
and trees, poor stars and stones, but never this fine specimen of hypermagical
ultraomnipotence. We doctors know
a hopeless case if --- listen: there's a hell of a good universe next door; let's go
-E. E. Cummings
“Therefore I tell my sorrows to the stones; Who, though they cannot answer my distress, Yet in some sort they are better than the tribunes, For that they will not intercept my tale: When I do weep, they humbly at my feet Receive my tears and seem to weep with me; And, were they but attired in grave weeds, Rome could afford no tribune like to these.”
-Shakespeare
I agree, GK, the deepest roots of our problems are within our ethos as a society. The biggie is choosing love over fear. That would lead to sharing over greed.
Yes, in global society we must learn at a gut level that striving for the good is not just right, it is also self-interest.
That is the solution.
Damn straight - GREED topping the list as a major cause to all of the illnesses of society/environment/world.
There are plenty of illnesses and they all stem from few causes.
I absolutely agree. And, what allows that greed? A capitalist economic system that is not regulated properly and works for the wealthy and corporations and not for the masses.
A loaded deck - and insane people in position of control/power/influence riding along at 1000 mph and not seeing the impenetrable wall just ahead.
Wow - quite the rant Odin. Why do you identify yourself as being an attacker of the forum or of OWS - or why do you identify yourself with being an entity that GK is calling malevolent? His comment says nothing that should set you off on a rant - like you were personally attacked - as you were not.
I didn't attack Odin, or any genuine Occupier in that comment. It was a plea for unity, and a reminder to not allow ourselves to be set at each others throats. Well, maybe it's just me - my level of frustration with the entrenched power of this system - that comes over wrong these days, I don't know. Anyway, I just have one word - Unity.
One more time on this in case you missed it GK. From a speaker at St Jacobi Church in Sunset Park, Brooklyn this just past MLK day.
"We must build COMMUNITY because in community, there is unity, and in UNITY, there is POWER
And with a church that was very involved with Occupy Sandy relief efforts, once again on this too, three largely printed words on a black-board which i took a picture of: RECOVER....REBUILD....RESIST !
~Odin~
I believe we are begining to win this battle! It will take time and patience, but especially if we can run a slate of candidates in the mid-terms who support our goals we can turn this country around!
My effort here for some time has been in combatting the various techniques our opponents have used effectively in the past to diffuse resistance movements. If in that effort I have offended you, or anyone else who is here legitimately, I'm sorry.
I have nothing but respect for you, and what you have done for this country, and the same to all those who have been actively involved.
I also believe that Occupiers are wearing down the opposition on this forum through our persistance. I didn't miss the call for unity, I am simply reinforcing that call, because I think it's the most important issue - unity and engagement.
Once again, if I said something that you thought was aimed at you, nothing could be further from the case.
I believe that we are winning too, but we still have a long way to go. As I said in another post: "The world-wide revolution is well underway, but don't expect the CMSM to cover it.' Our struggle will take PERSISTANCE (as you said) on all of our parts, and we must build up resistance to the current corrupt status quo... into our every day lives in as many ways as we can think of. All this while we continually reach out to others.
Since coming back from AK two weeks ago, armed with a lot of things to think about after many conversations, and experiences there, and my return to Occupy in NY, I have consciously stayed out of the 'combat zone' on here, and have let you and others do the drudge work which is very necessary. The reasons for my reluctance to be there in that zone was two fold, 1. To take these guys on causes a certain amount of negativity to form in yourself, hence I just haven't wanted to feel that, and the 2nd. reason is after having spent so much time, not contributing much here, and learning how simple life can be from my 22 mo. old granddaughter ...well the down-side was i felt kind of simple ;-), and not able to articulate myself well enough to get in their faces if it came to that.
I know that I started my rants on the wrong person, but the up-side is I'm ready now, so maybe you can relieve your stress, take a break from combat, and return to the thoughtful comments that you are well-known for, while I deploy.
~Odin~
I agree about engagement here eventually building up a negative, or excessively combative state of mind, and I also don't want to be in that state of mind right now. For that reason I also haven't been commenting here nearly as much as I used to.
I've created a blog where I can try to do some more reflective thought and dialogue, and if those ideas bear fruit ,hopefully present them here fully formulated.
It's great to hear from you, and to know you are still in the fight:)
Thanks, i don't see myself ever leaving the fight. After having learned a lot on my own, and learning a lot on the forum from all the great posters here including you, I know to leave this struggle is to give up on the future of my kids, and granddaughter. I may well take time off to do more reading, do outreach, etc., or take a different tack than I am now on, but I can't see that now. In any event RESISTANCE to this corrupt system is embedded in me now. Good Luck GK...we'll all need it.
~Odin~
I am with you!
Good Luck.
GK, no one said it was going to be easy . But all the hardwork we have gone through , the struggles, the fighting, has only made us stronger.. so maybe the trolls plans have back fired on them .. they thought we would run home in tears.. but instead we gained strength.
Good Luck to us all.
~FOB~
I sense that - that their plans are back-fireing on them. In fact I sense that most wonderful of all things, a turning of the tide!
We are Together, We are in the Right, We are winning!
I predict here that before this decade is out we will be living in a different world. Sometimes those moments come . . . humanity is capable of amazing things once we finally drop the blinders and re-discover our full potential!
It's nice to dream, but just remember," this fight is not over". Many people do not want what we want.. they are evil people.. and they will do ruthless evil things .. Do not worry of trying to gain their support or unity .. simply attack. and anihilate the enemy. Those on our side will always be on our side in this fight for a better tomorrow , those that are not .. we will break them.
"Cowards die a thousand deaths, the valliant die but once."
It's strange, but it is actually easier to die for our convictions than to really LIVE. Most people don't have the courage to do either, but that is subject to change.
To the point though, I think we neeed to be sure we don't somehow, through that strange alchemy of human emotion and revolving fate, become our own worst enemy, again:)
Good Night.
Fear not. The dream has survived for milleniums.. once achieved will not be easily lost.
Good night.
~FOB~
Abolish the Electoral college
http://www.usnews.com/opinion/articles/2013/02/06/abolish-the-electoral-college
Hello since I am new here thought to greet you. Once an understanding as you mention is reached it is easier to keep in check of it getting very far in effecting us. These tactics are my real life everyday and everywhere I go for many years with headphones as saving grace I shall dance and pray it all away so we can live in peace. For the future of the children to have lives free of the cycle of abuse that has been broken to which this generation is credited. I will not ramble on just wanted to introduce myself before anyone else make false accusation or indicates me other than whole heartedly all in all one I am WE... Lovin' you...
Thanks for introducing yourself, and hope that you find your time on here sharing, teaching, and learning to be productive, as I have. I will learn more about who you are with the comments you put up.
~Odin~
I know - that was my understanding.
Unity
Unity
For Peace Health Prosperity for ALL.
I want to thank you for your support for me here DKA. I'm a guy who usually just says what I am thinking and let's the chips fall where they may. I don't believe in self-censorship on a forum like this because I believe it is when you really bare your soul that progress is made.
We do far too much self-censorship, and that is one of the ways we have been conditioned to cooperate with injustice, but I do care what many here think of me, and I am grateful that you have consistently seen through the complexities of the questions I have attempted to grapple with, to my underlying good intentions:)
EDITED
No problem GK. I saw nothing wrong with your comment.
EDIT: except perhaps you meant to say Democratic Process instead of party at one point. As at this point you were also talking about getting past party - and I thought - saying we all need to address issues.
↥twinkle ↧stinkle reply edit delete permalink
No problem GK. I saw nothing wrong with your comment.
EDIT: except perhaps you meant to say Democratic Process instead of party at one point. As at this point you were also talking about getting past party - and I thought - saying we all need to address issues.
Yes, I meant democratic process. I'll correct that.
Cool - {:-])
"rant"...do you think so? I think that we both care deeply about the success of this movement DK, and the path that we, Occupy chooses moving forward is very important.
I do not see where i identified myself as an attacker of the forum, but when GK lumps people like me who believe as I do that OWS should have no connection with party politics, with people who are indeed trying to destroy this movement, I have a problem with that. He has got to make that distinction, if we are going to have an honest discussion with the hope of moving forward from it. Read it again
Despite our differences on how this movement should progress, i have maintained good relations with GK because i believe that his convictions are based on his conscience, and I hope that he feels the same...err maybe not now.
Just for the record too, if I ever do get arrested for a direct action, i plan to carry through with my promise to GK, and write his initials on the arrest ticket.
~Odin~
I did not say you identified yourself as an attacker - I was wondering why you were identifying with them - as there was nothing in GK's comment that came after you. Chalk it up to misunderstanding - but wow something set you off on a wrong perspective.
I do not believe that I was totally off-base DK. It is important to delineate who you are criticizing, which GK could have done a better job at, but yes I was a bit too defensive..But again understand that anyone who has been challenged on whether they were altruistic to this movement as I have been in the past is bound to be a bit sensitive towards criticism that seemed too wide in scope to me. Let's just let it go, and forget about it, OK?
~Odin~
Your comments moved me. Good post!
I've heard it said that we get the government we deserve. This has lead me to some times envision the state as just a reflection of her people. So from this perspective, if her people change, that is all that is needed for government to change. I know it sounds kinda cheesy and a little idealistic, but it's also beautiful in its simplicity.
I agree. Occupy has reinvigorated the progressive movement in America. Occupy may choose to stay uninvolved with politics directly and that is fine. They have empowered innumerable progressive groups to stand up and make a difference. I believe the Dems abandoned progressive principles decades ago because the movement was bludgeoned to death by Reagan and the right wing. Progressive people gave up. Occupy has resuscitated the progressive movement, the many progressive organizations, the principles, and even a few progressive politicians in the Dem party. Occupy can stay uninvolved but they have moved the country left, they have begun the difficult task of turning this aircraft carrier. And as you know once begun it is hard to stop it. Occupy should continue as it has. All the progressive groups re awakened will continue as well. People will be emboldened, and influenced to pressure their representatives and change WILL come. It will take years of hard work, but it has begun. Thank you Occupy.
This is an excellent comment, and I agree with it whole-heartedly with the one exception being, "Occupy may choose to stay involved..." Not "may"......MUST..choose to stay out of party politics, at least well into the foreseeable future. It is my strong belief that our value is on the outside.
For the first time in decades the whole political spectrum is moving to the left.... The change in the country's demographics which includes age, race, income, etc, combined with a people who have started to wake up...make it increasingly difficult for the right wing to sell their selfish agenda.
Even though all that is true, I believe we should promote our struggle as a right vs. wrong one, not as a Left vs. Right one, as the latter just causes people to dig their heels in and argue their case from a worn-out playing field we have been on for far too long, and it is no longer applicable, or condusive to recruiting people to our side.
Many of the people who we need to reach out to are in the 'middle' or republicans, and either they themselves,or their loved ones have been screwed....daughters who can't pay off their college debt working at Wallmart...their unions being busted...their homes being foreclosed....parents who lost their retirement nest-eggs...etc. etc...all being caused by the corrupt corporate/banking owned system that we all live under.. These people are REACHABLE, and we need them....and how we go about reaching out to them is important. Case in point: During a Con Edison lock-out of their employees last year, one guy said something to the effect that, 'I have been a conservative republican all my life, but now.....' Many more people will experience this epiphany AWAKENING if we go about this in the right way.
Having been a merchant marine (inland and coast-wise waters) for thirty plus years, I wanted to add to your analogy of the country moving left "...they [Occupy] have begun the difficult task of turning this aircraft carrier.".... 'WE are like the powerful twin-screw, 4,000 HP (whistling noise) Tug"Grace McCallister", NY. Tug Occupy is now assisting that carier in making that turn more quickly. We are putting out a call though for all available Tugs ("progressive groups") in the vicinity to assist in making that turn even more expeditiously. Your original analogy is a bit more vivid now, eh? ;-)
"Thank You Occupy." I totally agree. It was in NYC.... in a state of AWE, I witnessed a mostly younger generation AWAKEN and then go on to help awaken us, and it is on this forum where I was able to put all the pieces of this sordid puzzle together.
~Odin~
I can't argue with that. First I would say that the radical positions of Occupy preclude any success in attaining political office. This is probably the best reason to stay out of politics directly. To do so requires we moderate. Big mistake. Better we continue as radicals who serve as an example/goal of existing progressive groups and future political candidates. Occupy should always be unsatisfied with the progress to come (although I DO embrace all slow progress, & small victories) in order so that we might urge the country further away from the selfish agenda and towards the agenda of compassion & fairness. In so far as bringing others to our cause, I believe we can grow naturally if we focus on the kind of issues you mentioned, the high tuition/college loans, union busting, as well as stagnant wages, high interest indentured servitude, outsourcing,and so on will slowly appeal to all victims regardless of their party affiliation. I believe the crimes against the 99% hurt all of us equally. The biggest threat to our growth is the comfort of so many middle class people who do not believe they can be hurt by this system. I don't want them to be victims but they will come over to this righteous cause if they either become victims or realize the could be a victim, or perhaps fear their children will be victims, or simply see the victimization of others and have an epiphany of compassion. but I do not see the need to focus on party so much. Finally, your expansion of the naval analogy was appreciated and interesting. Thank you for that, for you service to the country, and your devotion to the righteous cause that Occupy has joined and reawakened.
Radicals, and reformers have a long history of working well together. The corrupt elite only capitulated to Roosevelt's demands for a quantum change because they knew what was waiting in the wings, the radicals, or in particular the communists who had a lot of support at the time. This dynamic was also present during th Civil Rights struggle in the form of the Black Panthers and wide-spread riots; in Gandi's time with people who thought there should be an armed resurrection; and even in the early 20th century during the political upheaval in Norway and Sweden, where it was once again the communists waiting in the wings. We are, and must remain today's radicals who want more than we may get, but still might be willing to settle for a sea change in the way our political and fiancial institutions are run..
There is no reason to thank me for my "service to the country" as merchant marines are private enterprise. They do however often get governemnt contracts. Anyway, except in time of war, usually transporting troops, or supplies in which they often are in danger, especially in the North Atlantic in World War II, we are like any other private profit driven business.
I did know this old merchant marine who was in a convoy of 44 ships heading for Russia to supply the Front. Only 5 ships made it to their destination. Sadly the rest were vicitms of u-boat attacks. My Swedish born Dad also chose to sail under the American flag during WW II, and when he applied to become a citizen of the US, that fact in the form of a letter was instumental in him being accepted. I still have that letter, which my Mom wrote due to his still poor grasp of English. Anyway, those are the guys who deserve our recognition, and Thanks, not me.
~Odin~
Indeed I also knew Merchant Marines who provided the services you mentioned to the government, which is why I offered my thanks. That we can transfer to all those we know did so, but my thanks for your devotion to our mutual cause remains.
Those merchant marines like my Dad who in WW II often went out in unescorted convoys.... in unarmed vessels were heroes, who often were forgotten as being so.
Thanks for recognizing that, and for your efforts to our cause too.
~Odin~
We can only succeed together. United we stand. "We will hang together or surely hang separately." Franklin?
Agreed...man ;-)
~Odin~
I say look to the progressive caucus, and add to their ranks.
That is an acceptable strategy. the party duopoly is an impediment to progress. Never give up, never give in.
Agreed completely. We can all engage on different levels, that is our strength - no need to draw lines in the sand.
Exactly, we must work towards inclusion man! I don't wanna find difference to exclude supporters. I wanna find common ground that fosters inclusion.....man. ;)
Right ON!!!
Latest repub attack on 99% vote.
http://www.minnpost.com/eric-black-ink/2013/02/latest-attempt-manipulate-electoral-college-vote-isn-t-new
Thanks!
Can you encapsulate for the newbies and ADDs?
They can see the writing on the wall.
http://www.truth-out.org/news/item/14139-finally-the-republicans-are-afraid
Top posting for what We stand for . Exactly what is to be and in case you missed it a formal introduction: WE Party... with first official endorsement WE proceed The People equality, separation church and state (to each own) ensure freedom,liberty and justice remain. The current party system is way laid off course. The more work we do to make things better makes us stronger, faster ever ALL ONE...
good article on Occupy
http://www.truth-out.org/opinion/item/14095-occupy-everyone-making-revolutionaries-not-a-revolution
[Deleted]
Yes, it does sound a little idealistic, but it's true.
Thanks for the kudos. It's appreciated.
Hey GK - good comment.
Issues people - ISSUES - and kick a naysayer in the junk - do not need defeatist BS.
Thanks!
No prob {;-])
Hey - check this out :
http://occupywallst.org/forum/a-call-to-walk-the-walk-rather-then-just-talk-the-/
Thanks, there isn't a day that goes by that I don't sign 2 or 3 petitions, write a few letters to congress, initiate a petition, go to a demonstration, or Do Something to turn this whole situation around, and all of us who do that - whatever we can - whenever we can - Will Make This Work. We Are Winning!!!
Yep - speaking out - it is good for the spirit - helps people find their feet - good personal growth exercise.
Shut up and go to your local Dem campaign office and start making a difference then, if you love this current system so much.
[Removed]
And go to your church and worship your Satan!!!
Just a bump up 'cause this is an important post. Thx
Why thank you.
The election is over, but the Anti-Democracy campaign just restarted anew!!
Just today:
http://www.slate.com/blogs/weigel/2013/02/04/the_return_of_the_pennsylvania_electoral_college_skewing_plan.html
GOP to Filibuster Obama's Consumer Watchdog Pick
—By Adam Serwer | Fri Feb. 1, 2013 2:50 PM PST
Consumer Financial Protection Bureau/Flickr
A little more than a week after Senate Democrats decided not to weaken the filibuster, Republicans are vowing to filibuster President Barack Obama's nominee to head the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau unless its powers are reduced, Reuters reports.
The CFPB was created as part of the 2010 financial regulation bill specifically to prevent financial institutions from engaging in the kind of exploitative practices that helped lead the country to the brink of economic collapse in 2008. Since January 2012, when Obama appointed former Ohio attorney general Richard Cordray to head the bureau, it has done exactly that—reigning in unscrupulous mortgage lenders, credit card companies, and debt servicers. But the CFPB has only been able to do those things because Obama, using what's called a recess appointment, installed Cordray in his post while most of Congress was on vacation—an attempt to bypass Senate Republicans' efforts to block the nomination. Before Cordray was picked and blocked, Republicans had vowed to filibuster Elizabeth Warren, who came up with the idea for the bureau and helped found it, too. That didn't go as well as they had hoped: Warren recently returned to the chamber as the new Democratic Senator from Massachusetts.
Last week, a DC Circuit Court panel made up of conservative Republican-appointed judges ruled that Obama's appointments to the National Labor Relations Board (made at the same time as Cordray's) were unconstitutional. Although the Constitution allows the president to make temporary appointments while Congress is in recess, the court ruled that a GOP procedural gimmick of holding brief sessions for the express purpose of blocking Obama from making recess appointments meant that Congress was technically not in recess. Not only that, but the court also so narrowed the criteria for making a recess appointment that most of the recess appointments made by Republican or Democratic presidents over the past hundred years could be considered illegal and unconstitutional.
Senate Republicans want three big changes before they'll stop blocking Cordray. First, they want the CPFB to be by Congress rather than the Federal Reserve. Subjecting the bureau to the congressional appropriations process would compromise its political independence. Second, Republicans want the range of financial institutions the bureau has authority to regulate narrowed. This would leave unsupervised some of the problematic institutions the bureau was created to regulate. The GOP also wants to replace the single director with a board of directors, which would hamper the ability of the bureau to make decisions. Finally, the GOP is demanding that other bank regulators—the same ones who failed to prevent the 2008 financial meltdown—be allowed to chaperone the CFPB by "verifying" that its rules "would not harm the safety and soundness of banks." This would let regulators who turned a blind eye to exploitative practices in the past because they were profitable tell the CFPB what to do—and the more different regulators have to approve of a rule, the more convoluted and less effective it is likely to be.
Blocking Cordray could leave the CPFB without most of its powers to regulate the very financial institutions whose practices helped lead the country into near-economic collapse in 2008. That's just how Republicans want it. Having failed to prevent the financial regulation law from being passed, they are now seeking to nullify it through procedural extortion.
This post has been edited to reflect the fact that Senate Republicans are also demanding that the single director be replaced with a board.
Correction: A previous version of this post stated that Cordray's appointment was declared unconstitutional. Last week's NLRB ruling did not directly deal with Cordray's appointment, instead ruling that another set of recess appointments made at the same time were unconstitutional. Cordray's appointment has been directly challenged but a decision in that case has not been reached.
http://www.motherjones.com/mojo/2013/02/gop-filibuster-obamas-consumer-watchdog-pick
I've heard. Hadn't read it. Thanx. The weakened consumer fin protection agency head approval is a good illustration of which politicians actually challenge the 1% corp enemies of the 99%.
{spell checker}
LOL. Sorry. in a rush. i improved the comment.
Great informative post! I agree and encourage all efforts to highlight anti 99% policies, and politicians who are enemies of the 99%. There are pro 1% politicians in both parties (Duopoly!!!!) but "Nobody does it better", and without shame like the trickle down, war mongering, austerity lovin, vote suppressing, neocon fucks. Thank you!
In the effort of concise-ity, details and exceptions are left out...
Enough is left in to be useful and informative. Viva L'Occupy
Virginia Republicans Replace “One Man, One Vote” With “Heads I Win, Tails You Lose”
Republicans in Virginia are mad at voters for supporting President Obama in 2012. So they’re planning to punish them by rigging the game next time:
http://blog.workingamerica.org/2013/01/23/virginia-republicans-replace-%E2%80%9Cone-man-one-vote%E2%80%9D-with-%E2%80%9Cheads-i-win-tails-you-lose%E2%80%9D/
GOP Eyes New Election Laws
http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2013/01/18/us/politics/ap-us-republicans-electoral-college.html?pagewanted=1&_r=1&ref=aponline&
Mississippi Governor: ‘There Is No One Who Doesn’t Have Health Care In America’
By Tara Culp-Ressler posted from ThinkProgress Health on Jan 23, 2013 at 6:10 pm
Gov. Phil Bryant (R-MS) In an interview with Kaiser Health News on Wednesday, Mississippi Gov. Phil Bryant (R) explained he remains a staunch opponent of Obamacare because health care reform is unnecessary. According to Bryant, every single American already has the health care they need.
In order to justify his continued refusal to expand his state’s Medicaid program — which would extend health coverage to an additional 200,000 low-income Mississippians — the governor explained that poor people don’t need a “massive new program” when they can simply visit an emergency room to receive care:
BRYANT: There is no one who doesn’t have health care in America. No one. Now, they may end up going to the emergency room. There are better ways to deal with people that need health care than this massive new program.
This is not a new train of thought in the Republican Party. During the presidential election, GOP candidate Mitt Romney claimed that “we do provide care for people who don’t have insurance” by picking them up in ambulance and taking them to the hospital. But suggesting that uninsured Americans can simply get the care they need in the ER is naive. Emergency room and ambulatory care are some of the most expensive medical services in the industry, and the current health care safety net isn’t able to accommodate the strain of an influx of uninsured, low-income Americans who can’t foot those bills.
And, of course, Bryant’s assertion that “there is no one” who lacks health care in this country is false. The Census Bureau estimates that nearly 49 million people were uninsured in 2011. Over 20 percent of working Americans don’t have health care, and 40 percent of the people living in poverty were unable to visit a doctor in 2010. Some of the country’s poorest residents are currently unable to qualify for Medicaid coverage — and even when they do, they can still struggle to access the health services they need.
Obamacare makes big strides to improve Americans’ access to care, particularly with its optional Medicaid expansion, which could extend coverage to 17 million previously uninsured low-income people across the country. But if Republican leaders like Bryant — whose own state has a 19 percent uninsurance rate, one of the worst in the nation — continue to oppose health care reform by pretending uninsured Americans don’t exist, that progress will be placed in jeopardy.
Republicans: Fighting words from Obama in inaugural speech
By JOHN BRESNAHAN | 1/21/13 3:41 PM EST
Republicans had some sincerely nice things to say about President Barack Obama’s second inaugural address.
It was delivered flawlessly. The president mentioned God and the republic. You certainly can’t top Beyoncé’s rendition of the national anthem as the coda to the ceremony.
But the GOP’s attempts to be nice couldn’t conceal its real feelings about the content of Obama’s address, delivered before lawmakers from both parties on the Capitol’s West Front. Republicans really didn’t like the liberal policy agenda that Obama outlined, including just about every progressive priority and only some of their own, including hugely controversial topics like gay rights, income inequality, climate change, gun control and immigration.
In fact, Republicans complained that the 18-minute speech sounded much more like a sharply edged partisan campaign speech meant to set up a fight than an inaugural address intended to inspire togetherness and unity with soaring rhetoric.
(Also on POLITICO: Obama testifies to the power of government)
“The words were code for a progressive agenda. I’m hoping that the president will recognize that compromise should have been the words for today, and they clearly weren’t,” said Rep. Darrell Issa (R-Calif.), a frequent Obama critic who has zealously pursued a contempt case against Attorney General Eric Holder.
“We were hoping that he would use this day to reach out to all Americans and all parties. He clearly did not.”
Republicans are aware of the larger import of Monday’s ceremony. Obama will be sitting in the Oval Office for the next four years, he’s riding high in the polls and he’s already forced the GOP to retreat on increasing taxes since his Election Day victory. They know the Obama of 2013 is not the same Obama of 2009. Gone are the urgent calls for bipartisanship. Instead, they find a commander in chief who knows what he wants and is willing to use all the tools at his disposal — including the unmatched bully pulpit of the presidency — to get it.
Read more: http://www.politico.com/story/2013/01/republicans-fighting-words-from-obama-in-inaugural-speech-86514.html#ixzz2Isuy494d
http://www.randirhodes.com/pages/journal.html?feed=380723&article=10718510
wow! I mean wowwy wow wow!
Obama's Inaugural Address Sends Fischer Off on Another Anti-Gay Rant
Submitted by Kyle Mantyla on Tuesday, 1/22/2013 3:44 pm
It has been awhile since Bryan Fischer went off on a good ol' fashioned anti-gay rant on his radio program, but yesterday's inaugural address by President Obama seems to have set him off.
In his remarks, Obama declared that "our journey is not complete until our gay brothers and sisters are treated like anyone else under the law for if we are truly created equal, then surely the love we commit to one another must be equal as well" and that did not sit well with Fischer, who proclaimed that "homosexuals do not have a constitutional right to engage in sodomy" any more than people have a right to engage in pedophilia, incest, and bestiality ... and that fact that Obama does not realize this only demonstrates that he is appallingly ignorant of the truth about homosexuality and, as such, is embarrassing himself in front of the entire world: http://www.rightwingwatch.org/content/obamas-inaugural-address-sends-fischer-another-anti-gay-rant
Texas Republicans Call For More Guns In Schools Following Shooting At Lone Star College
By Igor Volsky on Jan 22, 2013 at 8:20 pm
On Tuesday afternoon, the nation experienced its 49th school shooting since the Columbine massacre in 1999, when an altercation between two individuals set off at least five gunshots at Lone Star College in north Houston, Texas, injuring both parties and a nearby janitor caught in the crossfire. The college and the surrounding schools went into lockdown as police secured the area, chasing one of the suspects involved in the incident into a wooded area behind the school. Both men suffered gun shot wounds and are now in custody.
Texas is one of 49 states with a concealed carry law, permitting licensed individuals to carry firearms within the state, and lawmakers have introduced legislation that would allow college students and staff with concealed weapon permits to carry firearms on school grounds. Firearms are currently prohibited at Lone Star.
Now, top Republican lawmakers — including Gov. Rick Perry and Rep. Tim Poe — are using Tuesday’s incident to call for more weapons on campus. KTRK’s Ted Oberg has the report:
OBERG: Governor Perry said this afternoon his thoughts and prayers are with all the victims, but that anyone licensed and who has training on how to carry a weapon should be able to carry that weapon anywhere within the state and [that he would] indeed review the bill that’s been filed quickly. …. We talked to Ted Poe from the north Houston area, who said students today were defenseless on that campus.
POE: It brings to focus the fact that many schools and universities and students have — are defenseless at the schools and places of higher education and this seems to show that.
Watch it: http://thinkprogress.org/politics/2013/01/22/1483121/texas-republicans-call-for-more-guns-in-schools-following-shooting-at-lone-star-college/
DeMint’s Bold Plan for Heritage: How to Lie More Effectively
Submitted by Peter Montgomery on Friday, 1/11/2013 11:29 am
Former Sen. Jim DeMint, hero to the overlapping Tea Party and Religious Right wings of the Republican Party, was kindly granted space by the Washington Post to tell us what he plans to do in his new job at the Heritage Foundation.
DeMint, a former ad man, promises to launch a “conservative revival” by figuring out how to do a better job selling conservative policies to the American public. That’s not exactly a big shift for the folks at Heritage, which is and always has been a giant marketing operation for right-wing “ideas.”
The most revealing thing in DeMint’s column is his use of a thoroughly debunked lie that Republicans tried to use against President Obama in last year’s campaign. Says DeMint of President Obama, “He disabled welfare reform last year, when he took away the work requirements that were at the heart of that law’s success.”
That false claim earned politicians like Mitt Romney and Rick Santorum “Pants on Fire” ratings from Politifact and similar ratings from other fact checkers. It’s a gross distortion of an Obama administration decision to give states more flexibility to come up with new ways to meet the law's work requirements – something sought by Republican governors. Even some Republicans, including one architect of welfare reform, called the charge false when the Romney campaign made it.
As we know from his climate change denialism, DeMint isn’t as concerned about truth as about creating his own reality -- the way Fox News and the right-wing echo chamber have tried to do. “One lesson I learned in marketing is that, for consumers and voters, perception is reality.”
Maybe reporters should start referring to Heritage as a “perception tank.”
Oh that HORRIBLE GOP! If only they were gone!
Most recent effort to manipulate the vote of the 99%
http://www.minnpost.com/eric-black-ink/2013/02/latest-attempt-manipulate-electoral-college-vote-isn-t-new
WSmith,you mean you're really a Democrat Shill?? And all this time I thought you were an intelligent,thoughtful independent thinker........LOL.
And what/who are you?