Forum Post: Scores Arrested as the Police Clear Zuccotti Park
Posted 12 years ago on March 18, 2012, 5:35 a.m. EST by pewestlake
(947)
from Brooklyn, NY
This content is user submitted and not an official statement
1:09 a.m. | Updated Scores of Occupy Wall Street protesters were arrested on Saturday night as police officers swept Zuccotti Park in Lower Manhattan and closed it.
Dozens of demonstrators sat down and locked arms as officers moved in about 11:30 p.m. The protesters chanted “we are not afraid” as the police began pulling people from the crowd, one by one, and leading them out of the park in handcuffs.
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By 12:20 a.m., a line of police officers pushed against some of the remaining protesters, forcing them south on Broadway, at times swinging batons and shoving people to the ground.
Kobi Skolnick, 30, said that officers pushed him in several directions and that as he tried to walk away, he was struck from behind in the neck. “One of the police ran and hit me with a baton,” he said.
If you weren't there demanding an Article V convention, then the masters of the police can pretend you were breaking the law, rather than the master with the tool you paid for.
Abraham Lincoln - The PEOPLE are the Rightful Masters of both Congress and the Courts
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Thanks for posting this, it could of been worst what if no one got arrested.
The point is to bring attention, I hope that everyone is ok now and no one got hurt,
You know, a thought just occurred to me.
At what point do the number of protesters assembled reach "critical mass"? At what point are there not enough cops and/or militia, and not enough jail space in America, to house arrested protestors? What does the country do then? Build more jails? Create a penal colony by converting one of the states to a National Detention Facility?
I guess I'm just trying to speculate that if the Occupy movement gains not just thousands, but millions of followers -- all willing to be arrested for peaceful civil disobedience -- how will the Fed government respond? Would they declare everyone "domestic terrorists" and treat them as such as per Patriot Act, NDAA, etc?
Just trying to imagine.
I have a hard time rushing in to defend the protesters. ie: "members of the group ignored orders from the police".
Is the media trying to defend/justify inappropriate police actions? Who knows.
But I do know that OWS does this again and again. Intentionally ginning up confrontation in an effort to demonize authority. As if the situation needs additional fuel.
Do you believe police orders trump constitutional rights?
What if those police orders are not communicated clearly as orders and are contradictory from one officer to another (e.g."get off the sidewalk", "get off the street")?
Whose Constitutional rights trumps whose? Do you believe OWS's rights trumps other people's rights? It's midnight. I have a child trying to sleep. There's crowds of people and noise outside. Can OWS practice their Constitutional rights in daytime? Whose rights are more important?
It's almost impossible to understand what kind of confusion may be taking place from any news report. I'm not sure it's useful to speculate about it. It's nearly impossible understand the full context without being there. And even then, each person is going to have their own lens that they see through.
What I do know - OWS uses every opportunity to demonize authority. In many cases they seek out the confrontation. Then they like to splash that all around in their flashy "News Articles" with lots of inflammatory language. This is all very intentional. It's clearly meant to incite people.
So no. I'm not rushing in to defend protesters when they are in the park at midnight and were told to leave.
thanks for telling me how i write
The constitution does not grant anybody rights to ensure they get quiet time at night. Bars and clubs don't have to close before midnight. Construction work goes on at all hours in some places. What the constitution does grant is freedom to assemble and freedom of the press and those rights are being violated. The police have threatened, attacked, and arrested journalists because they were doing their jobs. Does that not bother you?
New York City code prohibits excessive noise after 10pm and before 8am. It's a quality of life issue. Bars don't have to close but they do have to avoid disturbing their neighbors. That's why the big night clubs in New York are far away from residential blocks. I'm not trying to pile on or take sides between you and April, just pointing out the ordinance. The police do have the authority to break up loud disturbances after 10pm.
Let's be honest here. City councils pass ordinances as a way to pull an end-run on constitutional rights. When the ordinances don't accomplish their purposes, then sanitation and health issues are raised. If we can't "loiter", we march and if we march, we're blocking the sidewalks, if we're forced into the streets we're cited for j-walking or some other nonsense. We're harassed, our banners and signs are destroyed by police and random, often violent arrests occur with physical harm being done to protestors. Yet some will come to this forum and claim that the police are "just doing their job" and that we "don't follow police orders." We're given "orders" by police who in the course of "doing their job" violate the law themselves. THEY FAIL to uphold our right to assemble and "speak" in protest when they harass us. The police get no "pass" from me for "doing their job." They're breaking the law.
Of course it does. Your rights cannot infringe on my rights. I'm not going to argue about noise ordinances with you. It's the principle.
Journalists being arrested - without knowing the specifics, just because a person is a journalist doesn't give them a free pass to defy police orders either.
OWS does not get to presume righteousness and use it as reason to trample over the rights of others by acting up like putulant children.
Blocking subways, blocking ports, blocking bridges, breaking into buildings, taking over public spaces, defying police orders. This is just more of the same. And then wonder why people get pissed off about that. It's the media's fault, it's the governments fault, it's the 1% fault. Blame it on others instead of taking responsibility.
But where there's no leadership, there's no accountability. How convenient.
MLK didn't cross the bridge from Selma to Montgomery. He turned around. He got a court order. Then he crossed the bridge. He worked with the system and used the system as intended. To lead by example. He held himself to a higher standard of conduct than those who would oppose him. Rather than lower himself to their level.
So the 1% have trampled over the 99%. Now OWS would trample the rights of others. All this trampling around - jeesh. Childish.
If crime is given a blind eye and no justice or accountability is pursued.
If the truth is not brought to the public attention by the MSM news sources ( the most available to the public at large).
If the public is being lied to by these same MSM sources.
If the Government is not serving the people.
If you are being ignored in the hope that you will just go away.
What do "you" think should be done?
Should we just roll over and play dead?
While we wait to become treated as so much garbage.
No I don't think we should sit idly by.
Yes the constitution does grant freedom to assemble as long as that freedom doesn't infringe on someone elses rights. I am not sure you are aware but there little pieces of paper with written words on them called City Ordinances drafted up and passed by lawmakers. Now if you violate them you can be arrested or fined, constitutional rights or not.
Gosh, we should apply that kind of thing to the second amendment too.
Oooops the NRA has a well funded lobby.
We do in NYC at least. The NRA is the Grover Norquist of gun violence.
If OWS was demanding their rights, as in a convention to propose amendments assuring American have their rights, which congress has been evading for 100 years causing IMMENSE problems, that would be one thing, and in that case those would be your rights to. But they are not, they using their rights without invoking legal process.
They actually do not rise above the status of "complainers" within the generalization the PTB uses to distort the very real issues and demands that give rise to the protest, albeit, not within legal process.
I agree. But even beyond the legalese of invoking the legal process,(not that it isn't important), but public perception is important as well. I don't understand how OWS expects to gain respect when they don't show respect. Especially to those that they claim to represent. It's twisted.
I ran across this post which I thought was interesting and pertinent.
http://occupywallst.org/article/march-18-solidaritysunday-support-those-arrested-n/#comment-681551
Thank you very much for that link April! What is expressed there is similar to my feeling but I have a deeper understanding.
Invoking the legal process is vital because it has a great deal to do with public perception. You point is well placed though in a slightly different context.
IF no invokation of legal process is made and THEN respect for public space is violated in ways that turn public perceptions against the movement, FAILURE is immiment.
People are reasonably outraged. Perhaps they cannot express that as an action well designed legally or socially, but that becomes the blame of their leadership rather than the outrage; therefore I perceived OWS as designed to fail from the beginning (when I asked about Article V and was ignored).
It is a sophisticated psyops utilizing people who actually do not know what they are doing, they only know their demands, making them very easily mislead.
Those who can reasonably see the same, should register where I've been lead by reading those posting here about the preparations for convention on this dedicated Article V forum,
http://articlevconvention.org/showthread.php?31-Mass-Formation-Of-Informed-Opinion-Techno_service-to-American-Citizens
Pretty inspiring for just preparation!
so the city is spending money on unnecessary arrests again
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We needed more Cowbell in the drumcircles! Dammit. I'm pissed. What are we protesting again? The president? Oh,yeah...Fuck Geotge Bush!! The president is always the cause of our current problems!!!!!