Forum Post: Is OWS a Patty Cake Social Gathering? Or an Active Movement to Effect Change?
Posted 11 years ago on May 24, 2012, 10:55 p.m. EST by JIFFYSQUID92
(-994)
from Portland, OR
This content is user submitted and not an official statement
Is OWS a Patty Cake Social Gathering? Or is OWS an Active Movement to Effect Change? Namely, Ending the Tyranny of 1% "Kings" Over the Rest of Us 99% People! But if We Don't Vote to Achieve This Goal, HTF do We do It?
Some of you ask, "What's Politics gotta do, gotta do... with it?" Really? What planet do you live on? "Planet Perfection," where moral mind melds produce a constant "Common Good?"
That's Not Reality!
Last night we had a censorship attack by anti-Free Speech, anti-American, RW Zombie Trolls. I've dealt with these cretins on other boards and forums. They censor everything that goes against the 1% "Kings" and their political operatives the RepubliCon Cult.
But some people still ask, in astounding naïveté, "What's Politics gotta do, gotta do... with it?"
Does this answer the... question:
Politics MOST CERTAINLY has EVERYTHING to do with "it" ~ the censorship of Free Speech especially that which conflicts with the dictatorial propaganda that comes from the 1%-owned, RepuliCon, RW, MSM, Fox (RepubliCon-TV) Lies, and Hate-Lie Talk Radio ~ UNDENIABLY and IRREFUTABLY!
Specifically, "conflicting Free Speech" that advocates a solution to the "Kings" tyranny of our Government, Media, Country and the 99% People: UNITY and VOTING!!!!
Sorry to spoil the "patty cake party," but we are in a Class War! We, The People, are suffering all the casualties, we are losing all the battles, and we fight each other instead of our real enemy all the time. Our "real enemy" is a group of would-be Kings (the "descendants" from the King of England's Loyalists and Royalists who hate democracy) in the 1%. We abandoned our democracy (lowest Voter turnout) so they stole it and use it against us to hoard unimaginable wealth and power (greatest disparity of rich and poor). That we might somehow wake up and get smart and Unite against them, makes us mortal enemies. Especially when elections come around (we are largely oblivious to this). That's why we are the most ignorant (37th in education), divided, non-voting (lowest in voter turnout), slave-waged, uninsured, population among modern democracies. All of which makes the "Kings" very happy and rich!!! And they will do whatever it takes to keep it that way!!!
That's the RW, RepubliCon, "KINGS," POLITICAL reason they sent out their cretinous Zombie Trolls to Censor posts on this Forum ~ and why we have to VOTE to kick and keep them out of our Government, local to DC!!
UNITE AND WIN!
Unite and Win! Unite and Win! 2010 Never EVER Again!!!
Register and Vote! Register and Vote! "We the 1%" NOT What They WROTE!!!!
Occupy America's Wake Up, then Occupy the ELECTION!!!
To which the "What's politics gotta do with it?" says:
"Politics should be approached in a nonpartisan manner. What is good and healthy for all is the key.
Private gain and profit at the expense of the community and environment is to be opposed.
Look to support progress that is healthy not destructive.
That in short is my view on politics and business."
It would be sweet, if it was not a recipe for complete and utter enslavement, permanently! But then came a spark of political hope, from WPGTDWI:
"Yes we have the vote.
I propose we use it in all possible forms.
Kick corrupt politicians out of office there are plenty to choose from some more obvious than their fellows at the moment.
But then we need to continue in ownership of the democratic process by telling our government what we approve of and what we do not.
Continuous Process Improvement through continuous involvement by the people."
Here, here, let's get involved in our political system and improve it!! Hell YES!!
"SQUANDERING!"
That is what I have a problem with.
I've been doing this a long time, I've seen people with good intentions squander their efforts and concerns, lose in utter defeat, and end up giving up. That's what the "KINGS" and Cons want! We succeed only with UNITED ACTION! I want success, don't you?
Didn't last night teach you anything??? Those were political agents ~ zombies, but agents of the Right, the RepubliCons, the "Kings." Dems, Libs, Progs don't do that. I've seen this RW censorship many times before, we can see it on MSM and Fox (RepubliCon TV) Lies (most ignorant audience) every night!!
If you advocate the denial ~ THE FORFEITING ~ the squandering of the system/weapons of defense our forefather left for us to ward off this tyranny ~ American democracy ~ you are asking for complete surrender. And I am Totally Against Surrender of any kind to tyranny!
Do you want surrender?
There is LESS perfection, less moral goodness, in surrender than participating in, or UNITING with, our political system to defeat the tyrannical right that has enslaved us!!
If you don't Vote, YOU don't count!
No Squandering! No Forfeiting! No Surrender!
This November 6th, fight back with the weapon our forefathers left us, THE VOTE!!!
So, your point is... A vote for Obama is a vote for the 99%?
All you got's to do is go to the polls.
Pat it. And roll it. And mark it with a B.
And put it in the box for Barrack Romney.
Because in a 'democracy' with 308 million people. We only get to decide between two people who will ruin, I mean run, our country for the next four years.
We don't live in a 'democracy'. It's a 'Representative Republic'.
Oh, well thanks for clarifying.
No problem. : ) Have a lovely day.
Yes. What's your alternative?
The ability of money to corrupt our political system is not a left-side or right-side issue, it's an insider-versus-outsider issue that affects people on both sides of the political spectrum. Twisting Occupy into an Obama rally is only going to perpetuate the existing system. Obama was the first major party candidate since 1976 to reject public campaign financing in favor of private campaign donations. Those donations are what are corrupting our political system. They're the mechanism by which corporations influence our government. This year, Obama is using a Super PAC, which is a device used to resist accountability, by enabling unlimited anonymous campaign donations from private sources. Obama's first act as president, literally, was to continue the Wall Street bailout. Campaigning for either side is a distraction from the goal of eliminating the influence of money over our political system.
http://occupywallst.org/forum/common-ground-one-way-forward-there-should-be-no-c/
Squandering a robust populace movement without a political happy ending is a sex crime!
actually a robust populace movement without a happy ending is a sex dysfunction.
Thankyou!
a vote by the 99%
I liked this post very much thank you
I think this gives me a venue to introduce a new voting concept.
First demonstrations are overtly powerful and by all means should continue. But the power to vote is are ultimate weapon. The apathy about voting stems from the belief that there's no real choice on who to vote for. Some people think you can vote for the lesser evil. And some people think they win if their canidate wins. All of which is nonsense.
So lets look at the only 2 choices you have for president, the problem with them is there both owned and operated by big money. In fact large corporations believe in their canidates so much that they bribe both sides. You gotta love their conviction, it gives me a warm fuzzy. I digress. So anyway rather then vote in the above manner let's vote "for where the money isn't" Ignore all rhetoeric and all campaign ads. It seems that the more money politicians spend the more likely people will vote for them. Personally this thinking doesn't work for me. I've been watching the geico for years but it doesn't make me go out and buy car insurance. I say lets vote for anyone who doesn't have money no ad expendature. I don't care if it's a green party, socialist party, or the happy clappy party. It really doesn't matter as long as you vote for someone not bribed by wall st. If enough americans vote for alternative canidates they could convolute the election to the point of shaking the top.
So go vote for where the money isn't
A little group of willful men, representing no opinion but their own, have rendered the great government of the United States helpless and contemptible.
Well quoted.
"Never before in all our history have these forces been so united against one candidate as they stand today. They are unanimous in their hate for me—and I welcome their hatred." FDR
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Action, people!!
Democracy is not a spectator sport!
If we turned out like BIG MONEY does, we'd start getting our way. But not until then!!
Wake up, this is all by design!!!!
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I have said this before and I will say it again:
This movement is too small to get into the political ring. We must continue to grow, and it will take time. A long time.
If we get involved now, we will be co-opted by the political structure. We are fighting the single most massive system of control and oppression in history. At least in the USSR you knew you were being oppressed.
The Movement must first build internally to change the view we all have of the world and our places in it. Right now, even at OWS, I see so much of the old world, the old way of culture, social, political and economic thought. Even amongst those of us who know this system is collapsing, in our discussions we resort to the language, ideas, and concepts of the old system.
But to become involved as a Movement in the political ring would be a mistake.
However, as individuals, if you feel you can participate in the voting system and straighten the Movement, do so. But when you do this, and I do, and you engage them with the intent to fuck up their world, you are a threat. It is a very fine line. If you seriously know what you are doing, and are willing to risk the consequences, go for it.
Like Trotsky said, anything that does not hurt the revolution helps it.
I appreciate your earnestness. You will find that things you have said before will always have to be said again, if they were ever worth saying the first time. Better get used to that.
You seem to speak for "the movement." But I want to believe that the movement's "points" are a little more developed than your beautiful, but not quite ripe ones.
I love new systems, but what sort of political system would not require public participation or could operate without it? That's the problem with the old one, and with the delusional mindsets I'm finding here, it's not going away. The system isn't broken, it's fixed; the "co-opting" is in your public mind.
Excerpted from below:
"Just what do people expect after decades of ever-increasing public delinquency in our democracy? Some kind of weird moral political aura to look after things? Idiocy!
"HERE'S THE REAL DEAL: Because we have neglected our awesome political system so carelessly and so severely, it has been ruthlessly corrupted and gerrymandered by Big Money exploitation. This is why it's so fucking expensive to run for office. Which is why EVERYONE who wishes to run for office has to grub so shamefully for money. But it's either that, or just give up and let Big Money buy our government and our democracy wholesale!!..."
We have a mess, and it's NO accident.
Occupy America's Wake Up, then Occupy the Election!
I understand your point.
But you think that the system, the current old system, is something other than what it current has evolved into. It is what it was destine to become. It has come to fruition, and is continuing down the road of complete oppression of the Working Class. We are not going to save this system, nor would we want to do this. All we can do is enhance is break down.
Also, I think big money has always been at the center of this system. When the rebellion against Britain started in the 18th century in the colonies, the only successful military rebellion in the history of the British Empire, it was funded in large part by the per capita wealthiest place in the world at the time, Virgina.
My point being, is money is at the center of this system, or at least control of resource for the betterment of a few. In part above, this is what I mean about changing the way people think. Until we as a Movement, in conjunction with the unfolding of the current economic situations, which may assist in the view of changes, whether we like it or not, change the way people see themselves, voting, by those who are psychologically locked into the system, will only enhance and strengthen the system by providing legitimate cover.
This Movement must provide a place that is an alternative. In Liberty Square the basics of the change and new directions were all there. This is why the corporate capitalist acted with savage brutality to destroy the encampments in the big media area.
But there is no doubt in my mind they understand these are delaying actions on the part of the Establishment. They know the period of capitalists market economic systems is at a historical end time. It may take another 100 to 150 years to finally put this to bed, but the world Movement, 80% of the world population, with telephones is opposed to capitalism, according to the BBC, is looking for a new system.
So to take it back to where we started. Voting should be a calculated move. Make sure you know what you are doing and work to undermine the system. But be very careful. Think of what happened in '72, when all these young people came into congress and ran for office to stop what was happening. Those were people like Bill Clinton, and look what they did.
"The old system" has become what our negligence and 1% opportunism has made it. Money, yes, but the ever-present power that is really to blame is feudalism. These fucks hate and fear democracy, they want their King back! Money has filled our political participation void (lowest voter turnout), democracy's not a spectator sport. And "free" wage-slaves are easily distracted. Also money makes a great mote around democracy Castle.
The Movement attracted attention to the Classwar that "they" have been keeping hidden/covert(30+ years), that's why "they" got crazy. If the Movement had loud and clear signs, banner and millions of big beautiful American flags and America saw police go crazy on that (pepper spraying flag waivers), America would have not only woken up, America would go batshit crazy! But they saw Woodstock reenactments(MSM), instead. Better work on that! I have!
Enough with the cliche labels, "Corp" "Cap"! "There was no doubt" we were going to end dependence on fossil fuels 30-40 years ago, we'd all have solar power, Raygun would lose, RepubliCons would be shunned in disgrace, living wages instead of minimum, polluting would get a life sentence, as well as investment fraud and war-profiteering and monopolies and election fraud and bribery! But things having no doubt, don't necessarily happen.
What happened in '72 was the Lewis Powell Memo and Nixon-Friedman-Pinocete Shock Doctrine! Beginning with Coke "Real-Thing" commercials, the Moral Majority and the freezing of median wages. Nixon and Raygun did more deliberate damage to this country before they were even sworn into office than the mistakes that could could have been made in 20 full terms of Clinton.
Occupy America's Wake UP, the Occupy the Election! They don't spend all that election money for nothing!!
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This applies to you as much as your defeatist and disparaging drivel deserves:
MY REPLIES (to writerconsidered123): The apathy about voting stems from misinformation and misconception.
The lesser evil argument is bogus, nothing and no one is perfect, so all choices are for "lesser evils."
Bribing does not equate to ownership. Our political reality necessitates ridiculously vast sums of money to run for office, Romney has it available, Obama has to catch-as-catch-can. Big Biz bribes both sides because they hedge their bets, they don't believe in winning or losing, just winning. This is why the term "Free Market" is complete BS! Posing possible campaign funding sources does not divulge a clear choice of candidate. Simply not having money is not serious criteria for electing government officials. If enough Americans got informed and voted, money wouldn't be the primary factor it is today.
Just what do people expect after decades of ever-increasing public delinquency in our democracy? Some kind of weird moral political aura to look after things? Idiocy!
HERE'S THE REAL DEAL: Because we have neglected our awesome political system so carelessly and so severely, it has been ruthlessly corrupted and gerrymandered by Big Money exploitation. This is why it's so fucking expensive to run for office. Which is why EVERYONE who wishes to run for office has to grub so shamefully for money. But it's either that, or just give up and let Big Money buy our government and our democracy wholesale!!
RepubliCons are a cult whose Charlie Mansons are the 1% Kings. Indys can't win, period. Which leaves Dems as our only sane choice. That some people don't see the superiority of choosing Dems is the result of misinformation, misconception, and/or prejudice. That some people can't see how we build and promote better results from our elected officials by participating in the process is also a result of misconception, misinformation, and/or prejudice and abject stupidity.
So go Vote like it was 2008 but don't wimp out like you did in 2010!
The only "paradigm" I see failing is ignorance, prejudice and laziness.
Pro establishment voters only help this disaster keep going.
You cant be against war, banking fraud and bought politicians and back the D and R parties.
If you do, quite frankly, you are just plain stupid.
http://www.alternet.org/story/155624/koch_brothers%27_americans_for_prosperity_goes_all_out_in_wisconsin_recall--and_denies_it!/
get a job
get a job I hate when people say this It's is the singlerly the most ignorant statement ever made. and my reply to this is do you got one to give? then give me your job? not! then go fuck yourself
give me give me give me. The entitlement generating LMAO
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MY REPLIES (to writerconsidered123): The apathy about voting stems from misinformation and misconception.
The lesser evil argument is bogus, nothing and no one is perfect, so all choices are for "lesser evils."
Bribing does not equate to ownership. Our political reality necessitates ridiculously vast sums of money to run for office, Romney has it available, Obama has to catch-as-catch-can. Big Biz bribes both sides because they hedge their bets, they don't believe in winning or losing, just winning. This is why the term "Free Market" is complete BS! Posing possible campaign funding sources does not divulge a clear choice of candidate. Simply not having money is not serious criteria for electing government officials. If enough Americans got informed and voted, money wouldn't be the primary factor it is today.
Just what do people expect after decades of ever-increasing public delinquency in our democracy? Some kind of weird moral political aura to look after things? Idiocy!
HERE'S THE REAL DEAL: Because we have neglected our awesome political system so carelessly and so severely, it has been ruthlessly corrupted and gerrymandered by Big Money exploitation. This is why it's so fucking expensive to run for office. Which is why EVERYONE who wishes to run for office has to grub so shamefully for money. But it's either that, or just give up and let Big Money buy our government and our democracy wholesale!!
RepubliCons are a cult whose Charlie Mansons are the 1% Kings. Indys can't win, period. Which leaves Dems as our only sane choice. That some people don't see the superiority of choosing Dems is the result of misinformation, misconception, and/or prejudice. That some people can't see how we build and promote better results from our elected officials by participating in the process is also a result of misconception, misinformation, and/or prejudice and abject stupidity.
So go Vote like it was 2008 but don't wimp out like you did in 2010!
My whole point is if you vote for dems your voting for money. My voting process is a long de-evolution until public financing comes along. We need to exercise the power of the vote and take a chunk of voter choice away from the two canidates. and we need to keep it up election after election until we are in a position to have a viable canidate not beholden to wall st. this is a long process to de-evolve the political elite. you can't change the elite by voting for them.
so go out a vote for a ficus tree
Meanwhile...?
well you could invest in wall st. and buy your own president (sarcasm)
Reevaluate $$:
http://www.alternet.org/story/155624/koch_brothers%27_americans_for_prosperity_goes_all_out_in_wisconsin_recall--and_denies_it!/