Forum Post: I'm the 1% that earned it
Posted 12 years ago on Oct. 15, 2011, 12:49 a.m. EST by FObama
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I own (2) million dollar homes, have five cars, 6 atv's, a trailer and a boat. Guess what, I worked for it. Took risks and they paid off. Chalk one up for capitalism!
Post your success stories here.
Congrats to you ... This movement isn't about ending wealth. It's about wealth being earned fairly. Not being given out in bail outs. So congrats to you. And I hope you get taxed a little more. But not beyond your means??
I feel like 99% is quickly becoming the 1%.
If you honestly believe what you said, you are a fool and blind...OPEN YOUR EYES!!!
Ar your eyes open today?
This guy "took risks". That's gambling, not working.
It's both.
What if he left a high paying but dead end job to start up his own business and worked 80-90 hour weeks on an idea that wasn't guaranteed to succeed? That isn't gambling, that is risk taking and working to see it through.
ok....so where back to the right way of life being, the only ones who should live good lives are the ones who don't fall victim of circumstance?
No. You have your sights set wrong. What is a good life? Working 20 hours a week and never having to live on a budget?
My father lost a high paying Union Job (which of course the Union leadership sold out for a kickback) back when he had 3 young children at home. He had to work 2 full time jobs for 6 years to make up the difference and save enough money to cut back to one job. Yet if you ask him today, he had the good life. His family was taken care of, he had roof over his head, and food on the table.
So I would change your statement to read, the ones who have the good life are those who make their own circumstances.
thats a complete pile of stank. Wow, someone who had to struggle made it out fine, and feels good for the strenght they have. Why don't you go ask the people who met that same struggle and are now on the streets cold and hungry. Or how about the people that don't even have the chance at obtaining a good paying job at all. People do not make their own circumstances, thats even impropper use of the word, circumstance is something already in place. Like, you can't get because you happend to a person of color, or the more real issue, because there aren't enough jobs.
You have a lack of thought to the possibilities that the system can even offer. All you have to do is step back and view the system. If every american woke up tomorrow and did the things you all consider trying there best to get jobs and education, it would not even be possible for all to be successful, with coorparations already in place, its not possible for the majority to be succesful....thats what started this whole thing. So i guess now your going to say there is no ploblem?
Whats sad, is some idiots are to dumb to get it, but i can bet if that person lost all and became poor tomorrow....they would be joining in. You don't really care because you haven't lost anything, or all.
Your view success by what figure...$60,000 a year or something? The 1% start at $300 million and make no less than $10 million a year. So do i think its right for few people have everything and don't have to worry....just live following there passions, no....i believe every human has that right. people should sit on wealth and live it up while just down the road people are starving and dieing for lack of health care.
I view success by being able to come home at night, kiss my children, and sleep with the woman I love. I cannot put a dollar figure on that.
Now I am not saying there isn't problems, but being jealous of what someone else has isn't the way of fixing them. Our way of government and the 1% are doomed to fail, they cannot keep up the pace that they are going and the system will collapse. Concentrate on your family, concentrate on your children, concentrate on your local government. Those are things you can change, those are things you can do to insulate yourself for the coming shit storm.
its not a matter of jealous...i did the math and created a post recently. The total wealth of USA as of 2010 is estimated to be 56.8 trillion, population is estimated in USA to be 280,218,971. If you divide population by wealth, everyone would have $2,026,986.24.
Now who says there is not enough wealth for everyone to live good? How many millionair's can't buy food or shelter?
So who says you are entitled to an equal slice of that 56.8 trillion just by existing?
Use deeper thought please. That means you caould have a working system where if you try, you will benifit. Rather than a system of gambling, if you try...it does not mean you will win. The point is a system which looked out for the people who contribute could be created in a way which rewarded more for being things like doctors, but still taking care of the people that take the trash out. And allthough construction dosen't require brains, it does require hard work, and should be rewarded as hard work. Slackers could be prevented by gettign paid by the hour, a fair price for what you do, so if you do nothing, you earn nothing.
Wow...that sounds a lot like a Free and deregulated economy. Interesting idea. So people get paid what their WORTH is for their contribution to society.
You can't see the forest through the trees. Why can't successful people be good people too?
you can't see what i see. You say why can't people be successful, but what you really mean is the case, why are people not happy with the fact that only a small amount of people have room to be successful. Kind of hard to start from scratch when you go against a coorapartion, there is no way to compete.
But enough about that, i want all people to be equaly cared for, its time the "in it for yourself" attitude ended.
You can't see the suffering, do to your greed of oppertunity to become wealthy. The basic human life is to shelter, eat, sleep and explore(in many forms:Land, science), so why do we think the best way to live is to leave the majority in constant struggle so 1% can own the majority of business and wealth.
America actually awarded a man a nobel prize for that exact economic structure, which is proof that this is not just by chance 1% ended up with all the wealth, it was an excuted plan.
I've even seen speaches where our persident(Bush) gives props to this man and economic strategy.
why can't we all help each other...and be succesful on a global level rather than a personal level?
Sounds wonderful and magical.
Totally agree, i left a construction office job that was paying over 100k a year to start my farm, now there are no construction jobs! That was a risk everybody said i was stupid to take, not looking so stupid now though with the economy being what it is!
yea....but if you lost all that and didn't succeed....what would you say then. "America is great, a place where you can give it your all and still be left with nothing. What makes it great is you can try, nevermind that 40% who honestly try acheive nothing"
So its kewl that you can work your ass off and it dosen't matter...it still depends on the way the dice roll.
Yes, yes i would! I generally Live week to week money wise, but know itll come in as long as i keep truckin along. and cant seem to save, paying 4.75/gal for deisel, health insurance would cost 800+ a month if i wanted to waste it on that, the electric is just under 500/mo plus allllll the other expenses, but hey its a good lifestyle, know ill always be able to eat, can trim the overhead to almost 0 if i have to. And i have lost everything a few times now, lost a house in Colorado, lost a business and went bankrupt here on maui, bumped in and out of jobs and had nothing for a couple years and finally am starting to be able to pay the bills with what im doing now, the cost of starting this and buying the hardware is unbelieveable, but so worth it, and i would try again if it all went to shit because thats what you do you get back up dust your sorry ass off and try again, you dont give up, and yes most of the time none if the effort means anything, 0, zip, nada, norhing, so yes roll of the dice, yes usa is excellent and bodatious and if i fail ill try again and do what it takes
thats laughable that you feel some should get to have no struggle...everything handed to them, but the common man should struggle....play on the roll of a dice....while few select families a garunteed to be rich until the people rise up.
They invest, they may loose some deasl, but win most. The keep stacking money...taking away from the pot that we all share. To many people are blind to this fact, as the pot gets smaller, less people manage to win this game you have played. Whta do you say for the people who tried as you did, but remain loosing?
You say america is great because you lucked out. Thats pretty shitty, for a person to view people without jobs as just slackers, thats why there broke. Well, why a nurses backing this movement? Why are employed people like yourself backing this?
I wish I even had that good of a job. I make $12 an hour as a boiler plant operator. I wish I could find a job that would pay me $50 an hour like you had. I can't even with a physics degree.
I do not mean to demean your risk or accomplishments, I wish you good fortune to you on your farm. Just do not assume everybody is able to do what you did.
Don't stop looking. There has to be something better.
Believe me i feel quite lucky that everything worked out, but i do work 12 hour days and pretty much 7 days a week, but feel its worth it, i can grow a lot of veggies and it can either be a gold mine or one bad storm and its a total loss.
Yeah, I live in SD so I know how that works ^^ Do you use the crop rotation method or do you have a herd as well? A bunch of my college buddies went into farming so I always ask questions ^^
Rotate, grow kale, harvest about 800-1000# a week, usually 1-2 1/2 acre plantings, i get about a year from each planting so can rotate cover crops for 2 years then do 1 year of kale, i also graze my goats on the cover crop every few months, so pretty good system, we have year round growing season. Borders are all planted for beneficial habitat so insect trouble is minimal.
It is scary, huh. I hope you are rewarded well!
"that wasn't guaranteed to succeed" -because A) you need to work hard enough for it to succeed? Or because B) there is an inherent chance of failure for everyone, hard-working or not?
If your answer is A, then I think you are wrong. If your answer is B, then yes it is gambling.
Then EVERYTHING in life is a gamble when you define it that way. Every decision you make from what to eat for breakfast (food poisoning) to driving to work (traffic fatality) is a gamble because there is a chance for failure for everyone.
Exactly :) So this idea of undercutting the movement by saying "I worked hard, why can't you?" doesn't fly with me, because it generally avoids all of the chance and circumstance involved with their life.
My dad was a college drop out, and now makes a comfortable living as a salesman in a job he was in no way qualified for when initially hired. He was hired simply because he had a very close friend within the business that knew how smart my dad is. I agree, if he were not hardworking, luck might have never found him. But to simply say, (like i here a lot of the dissenters to OWS say) "I'm hard working so my success is INEVITABLE" is infuriating to me.
Do you want to succeed?
How would you define success? If it's a specific dollar amount, then I could care less. If success is having a career that I am passionate about and the love/respect of my friends and family, then of course I want to succeed.
Then why are you demanding higher taxes. Seems greedy!
I am in favor of repealing the bush tax cuts... but that is far from the reason why I support OWS. I am here because of the overwhelming influence "high-finance" has on our government, and the inability for us, as voters, to fight it.
Why don't you like the Bush cuts? Do you want to pay more?
They cost our country 1 trillion dollars over 10 years... as we engage in multiple wars... it is an impractical policy. But as I said, this would be far from a top priority.
Look, I don't care if people are rich. What I can't stand is using that money to influence tax policy so they get wealthier, while those that can't afford a Senator end up with either the bill or the debt without any wealth. This guy mentioned Barney Frank in one post, as if I am going to defend any politician who takes money??? There are plenty of Democrats who are purchased by the wealthy too... look how much money Obama got from Wall Street last time. That's why he kept Wall Street in charge and that's why none of them have to answer to the ridiculous financial instruments they devised to rip people off. Even if rich people don't buy a Senator or two, they still support the PAC's, think tanks, and policies of those that do. Get rid of the lobbyists, political advertising and fundraising... then you can blame poor folks all you like.
How about we take away the incentive? Get the government out of the business of giving special favors, return to constitutional principles. Do that, and the corporations will not have reason to seek favor, special status or exemptions, and benefit from the government, because the government will not have goodies to give away, but will instead just provide a few basic services.
The only way to take away the incentive is to get the money out of politics.
And the only way to do that is to have a government that is only responsible for maintaining general lawful order, ensuring the right of each individual to life and property is not infringed upon by any other. If you give the government purposes other than that, it will become corrupted by the various crony capitalist forces we have seen corrupt our Republic to their own ends.
OK, but how to keep people with money from buying whatever they want from government? The reason government is screwed up is because they have to fund every crazy thing the lobbyists want, thus deficits. I like many of the government programs and many other citizens do too. They are affordable if we don't buy things we don't need (like two wars I can think of).
"keep people with money from buying whatever they want from government" -- We did it by removing the incentive to do so. If the governments only role is to protect our equal rights and insure a lawful order is maintained, the corporations wouldn't be able to use government to gain advantage. If we allow the government to do other things, special interests will always corrupt the process. Everything the government is doing that you think is worthwhile, you can also do, or band together with your community to do voluntarily, without the corrupting hand of government.
Word.
Well put it this way, taking risks means doing research, learning effectively how to spend his money and studied up to see if his risks had high payoffs. Thats not gambling. Its not like he won on a scratch ticket. He probably started/ invested in a business and made a lot of money. Thats what he means by "risks".
Exactly, but to some that is evil.
"Gambling, not working." That's an ignorant comment, which you are able to post on this web-site courtesy of hard-workers like Gates, Jobs, McNealy and many others, each of whom took enormous risks.
You don't get it! I don't care if people take risks and become rich! I just don't want them buying my representatives so they can get special tax breaks, subsidies, grants, no-bid contracts, etc. You know as well as I how much is being spent on lobbying. We're all ignorant about something. I want public financing of elections, no lobbying, and no political advertising lies protected with "free speech". I know things will have to get way worse for it to happen, but that's not being ignorant. It could be called wishful thinking, however.
agree, fairly... we shouldn't let these people make the rules... they tend to sway towards policies that are too beneficial to the few at the detriment to the rest of us.
Thank you
Yes, end disproportionate representation, not capitalism.
How?
His mommy pays for everything....he does not care about taxes or welfare.
Wrong, wrong and wrong. Anything else or do you hear no a lot?
Taxed more? Why? Obviously this person is an efficient user of what gifts and capital he possesses, why should he give more to an inefficient system?
Its capitalism thats inefficient....its the one system that leads to the greatest inequalities...you only have to look at your own country....
Disagree completely, looking at all countries that use it.
It's the most efficient monetary system?
When has socialism ever worked?
in Sweden, Norway, Finland, Denmark, Canada,Brazil(read about petrobas) list gets large.
It's not working. Try again. What great products do these countries make? Hell, what good are they? Once someone has a good idea they bring it here or Monaco. What made you think it works there?
I can't believe someone that makes as much as you lacks so much knowledge, Sweden- Volvo, Saab (cars), IKEA, Astra Zeneca Finland-Nokia, Norway-Oil, Natural gas, Denmark lego's, and there awesome Christmas cookies
Fresh. Do you think they would let you in to their country, no. Closed borders. Was there ever a time in America that made you proud. BTW, you wouldn't have posted without knowing that Volvo is owned by a Chinese company and Saab is now Dutch, and Lego's are made in Mexico?
That's right, and that's why we must save capitalism. And to do so, we have to end the current scheme of "socialism for the rich and capitalism for the poor." Ironically, your title post is such an example of the bias in favor of "socialism for the rich and capitalism for the poor."
Your view is not the same as mine. My view gives all an opportunity. Ask Herman Cain what kept him down, nothing.
an army marches on it's stomach
I'm sure you didn't make that up, but I'd recommend another catch phrase.
some ancient roman said it
there is government healthcare for the troops
there is a government health care system already running
that could be expanded to the citizens
and it sucks balls. whats your point?
Terrific!
Because his income is not remotely representative of his actual contributions to society relative to others. This notion that what income people receive is some natural process and not one that is socially designed must be eradicated. Not only it is obviously a false one, it is harmful to society.
Good message.
Why does his income have to represent his contribution to society?! Income is representative of what somebody is willing to pay for his work!
It doesn't have to represent that exactly. But that is by and large what the social contract is. Why would any reasonable society permit any one individual to possess X amount of its total wealth (or income) if X has no relationship to the person's individual contribution to society? That means that somebody is (or many people are) getting less than what they fairly contributed to society.
Remember, our economic system is just a socially agreed upon mechanism to distribute our collectively produced wealth/income amongst us. It isn't some natural order. If it is skewed, it's our obligation to fix it.
um..capitalism guys? it allows anyone to enhance his income, last year i made 8,000 due to layoff and trouble finding work, this year, up til 2 weeks ago, i made 36,000 since may due to opening up a new company fixing appliances and commercial equipment ( i fix crap) the last 2 weeks i invoiced out 22,000 to a new account and look at clearing (gross) over 200,000 in the next 12 months, i'm 25 years old and working 60 hours a week plus paperwork. i'm down for gov. reform but capitalism is whats up, YOU CAN DO IT TOO. unless you're busy holding your hand out of course.
The point is this. If you hire employee's and they're all working for you, then one of them starts to find loop holes in your system to start making money for themselves cutting you out of the system what would you do? You'd fire them. Well guess what? There are political, commercial, and even individual citizens of this country who are doing just that. They are finding, and in some cases, creating loop holes in the system to allow these thieves to continue stealing from us.
We're not saying down with the rich here. Hell, I wouldn't mind being rich myself. And I, like you, am a guy who runs his own business and works all hours of the day and night to get it done. But at the end of the day I know that any money I make is all thanks to the rights and privileges I have thanks to this country. And I have to pay for that by paying my taxes. I also know that I am only a small part of my community and to keep it safe both physically and mentally, I have to pay for it. Again, I pay in taxes.
However there are individuals out there who are making large amounts of money that are not taking into account their responsibility to the country they live in or the people in their community (not local, global community). These people are working loop holes to keep their money, forcing our government to cut back on it's needs to provide for the country and community, which eventually leads us to where we are now.
You are all over the place.
ok, i agree with every bit of that if we are looking at it the same way. You mean, in parenthesis, not local and not global community right? Because I don't know how I feel about the whole ''global community'' thing when it comes to U.S. tax dollars.
those people who are "getting less" are clearly the ones who overpaid him for his socially worthless work!
This ignores that economic power exists. Not all economic transactions are based on free exchanges. In fact, most are coerced by people with economic power from people without it. Consider all the transactions you enter for which there is no genuine negotiation. That would be the overwhelming majority of them. All of those are technically coerced transactions.
food, water, land, shelter, health, when all of these are commodified it results in their inaccessibility to MILLIONS.
You want land?
You want land?
i cannot remember being coerced into any transaction. i buy things out of my own free will.
ok maybe that necklace that my girlfriend was eyeing. damn it.
Wha, wha, what?
This guy u speak of is 2 million dollars in debt really efficient. Lol
How do you start and grow a business without incurring debt? I needed machinery, a building, inventory. I don't have a rich Daddy or Uncle.
You are invited to come sit in the chair on the Livestream and represent. The 1% chair has remained empty for a month. Nobody has had the courage to step up and have a civil conversation. Maybe you are The One, big man. Come on down.
Somehow I don't think it would be civil.
I'd rather keep being productive. But thank you.
I'm proud of you, for not giving up and toughing it out. I'm sure you will admit that the hard work paid off, and so did a few strokes of luck. The problem is that bad luck happens more often than good luck, and the lucky one's like you and myself should have no problem contributing to a safety net for the one's stricken more frequently with bad luck, and who knows, sometimes that safety net you build ends up catching you on the way down!
There is no such thing as luck or an overnight success. No one sees how hard you work but you. Everyone sees your success as lucky. Enjoy the fruits of your labor and help someone join you in success.
"There is no such thing as luck"
I had a good laugh at that one.
Then give me a definition.
Luck is the intersection of opportunity and preparedness.
I like that. Can I use it?
You certainly can. My good friend and real estate mentor gave me that one. I don't know who originally said it.
I like the Gary Player one quoted on here, "the more I practice the luckier I get".
Thousands of troops have died in Iraq since we engaged, how many of those who died are just those that "didn't work hard enough" at surviving? Is it possible that chance and circumstance can undercut someone who worked just as hard as his neighbor?
Pat Tillman got friendly fucked... I assume that was his fault as well? Seeing as there is no such thing as luck, chance, or circumstance.
If you enlist your luck might not be good. He enlisted to kill other humans. May he rest in peace for his bravery.
WOW! Its called loving your country...You must be a journalist because you have no problem speaking on someone else's behalf. Please move to Canada or France or just find some sand and stick your head into it!
I think you missed my point. My debate was on luck. Someone dragged a soldier into it.
My point is that chance and circumstance play a large factor in everyone's lives, it is just more apparent when studying a professional whose life is on the line.
I agree.
the harder I practice, the luckier I get.
Greatness!
I've had plenty of luck on the way, and I'm sure you have too, whether it be, choosing the right college, accidentally stumbling on the right guy with the right loan rates, or just shaking the right hand at a gathering you didn't even want to attend, those small breaks could have gone either way whether or not you want to acknowledge it.
Your right. But if you don't get up and ask for the loan, shake the hand or try to succeed then it will never happen. Luck would be winning the lottery without buying a ticket.
not everyone who takes risks lucks out. You're right, it would never happen without that. But for every success story there are hundreds of other failures. Many geniuses and talented individuals throughout history have died in poverty.
Sad but true. I never said there wasn't bad luck. My wife tells me if I didn't have bad luck I wouldn't have any luck at all. It's all perspective.
Funny you say that... I couldn't agree more.
My dad is a well off man. Started working at the age of 14 mowing lawns. And, he has worked ever since. He grew up in a poor household, had a severely alcoholic father, and his father was deaf. Took him YEARS to get out of debt and build up to what he is today. How did he do it? By working hard and continued trying every time he failed.
A few years ago, I was talking with a roommate of mine (came from a poor household... which I do not discredit AT ALL because he parents are hard working). This roommate I had was always a complete bitch to me. I could never tell why. I helped her when she needed it and put a lot of effort into trying to get a long with her. One day, we were talking about our parents and how they grew up. I told her about my dad and what he and my mom went through. I told her, as a little girl, we lived in a couple's basement and my parents could barely afford to feed my sister and I. But, my dad kept trying. My roommate, stunned by the story, said (in a very condescending way) "That's surprising."
I wanted to kick her in the face. I was so pissed. Does she think money just grows on trees???
There is no bad job. I respect all people who get up an work.
It takes a few low paying, physically demanding jobs to get to the good ones. And, I think all individuals should have to take a really hard job at least once in their lives. I did and I think it made me who I am today. I worked in fast food when I was younger. I am so thankful for that job. I learned a lot about people working their. In return, I go to fast food restaurants sometimes and I always make sure I give the person behind the counter the respect they deserve.
I am all for hard working individuals. What I am not for is taking away the American Dream. Give these individuals the chance to have a nice car and a big house one day if that is what they want! That is what America is about. Sink or swim... it is so nice to have the choice.
With that being said, I am so thankful I have the opportunity to come on here and speak my mind freely, have clean drinking water, and have individuals willing to fight for my freedom. I wish others would realize exactly what we have here in America.
My highschooler is working fast food. Builds character.
If capitalism was so great then how come only 1% are benefiting while everyone else's income is dropping.
I think I might have figured that out. I did a quite a bit of research when I saw the stats for wages in the last 30 years. The wages of labor are directly related to the cost of the neccesities of life. When that cost increases wages increase. However in the last 30 years personal savings has increased from 10-12% to around 1%. At the same time credit card debt has increased to nearly %17,000 a person. So decreased savings and increased debt has worked to reduce the necessity of the increase in the wages of labor. However it is unsustainable.
Right, the middle class tried everything means available to try and keep up with a higher cost of living and stagnate wages. Now we're trying direct action.
Right now we are in a period of discord. We have reached the point were we can longer continue to forgo saving, add on debt, and maintain the same wages. As we return to normal savings and decrease debt our consumption will decrease and with it our GDP. A short business cycle recession will follow at which point the natural equilibrium will force higher wages in order to increase consumption. The market is more efficient than any legislation's are. Have faith and in the mean time get rid of market manipulations through lobbyists and corporate contributions.
Ii think it has to do with how profit is created in an inflating economy. If the cost of resources are rising, then the business cat of operation is rising. If wages keep upwith inflation, then the business can not make a profit, because once the profit is earned it loses its value due to inflation. If wages are stagnate, then the difference between the declining work value, due to inflation, and the money earned beats out inflation, so the business earns a profit, because the money generated has real buying power.
I think I'm going to hurt my head trying to think this one through.
During inflationary periods, the worth or value of money decreases. It takes more money to buy goods and services. So if milk used to cost $1 and it now cost $1.25 that would be the result of the velocity of money increasing, trading hands at a quicker rate. What would seem like an increase in the amount of money in the market and the amount of times it changes hands, over that which is necessary to sustain the market, devalues that money. So while the cost of milk is rising it is because the cost of everything which goes into bringing that milk to market is also rising, which includes the cost of labor. The profit of the corporation that sells the milk in a free and non monopolistic market would stay nearly the same while the wages of the laborers would increase at the rate of inflation, which is pretty much the same as it was after adjusting it for inflation.
But wouldn't the earnings be different because of the time lag in a return on investment? Lets say I invest a hundred dollars, and I have a return on the investment in a year of 100 dollars. But in that years time, that 100 dollars has inflated the whole economy that last years 100 dollars equals this years 200 dollars. Then I have made no real profit. Now, suppose everything is inflating, but wages. Wages are stagnate. Then the workers incur the cost of inflation, and the difference I save is my profit because that difference beats out inflation... Or am I just off my rocker on this one?
Yes I do think there is a short lag time to it. And that profits were pocketed by the companies from then to now. However I think it is because decreased saving and increased borrowing has made it look to everyone as if they had more money then they did previously. And so the cost of labor didn't need to rise.It threw off the equilibrium and stopped the wages from having to be increased.While at the same time adding an extra cost of living, interest.
Everyone who is making a living is benefiting. Duh.
Are you calling survival benefiting. I mean people bust their butts to get a pay check in this country. We work more than any other industrialized country, We have less vacations and benefits. We are stressed out more than any other people in the western world. I think this kind of contemptuous view of the American middle class is unfair. Plus living standards are one average falling in this country for the 99%. This is happening even though Americans are working harder and longer than before. Now over the past 35 years the other 1% has more than doubled its income on average. This tells me that the problem is not about availability of resources or hard work. It's about priority and lack of concern for the majority of Americans.
I get a 38 hour week, 10 days personal/sick leave, 4 weeks annual leave, universal healthcare, modest marginal taxes ~20% actual, 10% sales taxes, 9% superannuation, and I live fairly comfortable on a wage that's around the average of my country.
It can be done.
Because of big government.
this is not an anti-capitalist movement.
I think more people need to understand this. This isn't about anti-capitalism. This is about large corporations and the wealthy having a disproportionate voice in politics.
Good
99% of us are not anti-capitalist. Perhaps 99% of us are anti-fascist. We should be at least
Probably. Not 100% sure what a fascist is. Just need to fix Washington.
Fascism is when Goldman Sachs contributes the most money to a politicians campaign and then in return they get to write the rules of finance for the country which allows them to exploit the hell out of it. Another word is crony-capitalism. Fixing that would fix Washington
GS is not the problem! He who takes the bribe is the problem!
I agree mostly but it's not a 100%/0% thing in my book. The politician could always stiff the lobbyist but in this system that politician would be looking for another job shortly.
Drug dealers need drug takers. People around here want to blame the drug dealers. I blame our elected officials.
I think it is fine to get rich through work. It is not good to get rich by being some union boss shaving percents off the workers paychecks. These union pimps live well for doing nothing.
Unions are lobbyist and are as guilty as Wall Street.
You have all of this stuff, yet you seem angry
Why are you here? Shouldn't you be off making more money?
I'm here to show folks their is hope. Why are you here?
I only work 9-6, Monday - Friday.
You'd better get used to the idea that you might not be able to replace any of your toys, because there are plenty of people who were making comfortable livings that are now impoverished. Now, while these people may not have been close to your level of success, they were successful in their own right until the rug was pulled out from under their feet. Take a look around you and hope that the corruption in D.C. and on Wall Street never reach whatever class you fit in with: http://www.pbs.org/wnet/tavissmiley/interviews/the-poverty-tour-part-2/
The sky is not falling chicken little.
Still, why are you here? Is denying people's right to express their disillusionment with their government a hobby of yours? Why not go enjoy the fruits of your labor, before the even richer than you Ayn Rand followers take it away from you?
The sky is not falling. Every protest deserves a counter protest.
So, you actually believe that you are part of the 1%? Who do you think the 1% will take from once they've eliminated the middle class. Do you think their greed will magically disappear when it comes your turn? Good luck with that, because there are plenty of people in the middle class who were working and making $100 K per year who are now homeless and poor.
I wouldn't call you 1%, but sounds like you live a comfortable life. Looking at the endless quantity of Ipads, iphones, and free time available to the protesters, as well as the sheer lack of racial minorities, it is highly unlikely that any of them even know anyone in the bottom 50%.
The primary complaint is the income inequality created by the Obama "Recovery", where Wall St made all it's money back and main street remained jobless. Complaining about Obama, though, is forbidden. Demand things of him, fine, but not complain about him. Better to focus on Wall St.
When Obama says he wants to tax the top 1%, those who earn more than a million dollars, that's me.
You say that as if anyone should give a crap.
If you pay over 25% in federal income tax, like most of the rest of the middle class does, I'm not a fan of raising your rates.
If you pay 17% like the true 1% does, then you should be paying more, though Obama's income tax hike won't do a lot to solve that problem, IMO.
Obama is just pushing for more cheese in the budget, and pushing a partisan selling point.
I pay the highest Federal rate.
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Big difference. Buffet is a political shame and you played into their trick. Buffet is scamming the system by not drawing a salary. He is living off his investments which are and should be taxed at a lower rate. By the way, the good liberal Buffet invested how much money into B of A? He scammed the gov for his benefit. Don't believe everything the political hacks say!
Right. Buffet is alone in scamming the system. Are you really that naive?
Every person at every level does what he/she can to pay as few taxes as possible, including buffet,you, and my Mexican cleaning lady. The worst on this front are the hedge fund managers, who take their payment as a portion of the profits, and have it taxed as capital gains when they didnt even make an investment.
I agree. But that was not what your original reply was about.
Only about 2% of the 1% pay the rate you quote. Warren Buffet is one example, not the rule. Very clever of Obama to select the words "Buffet Rule".
Most earners over 1 million dollars pay a much higher effective tax rate than those earning under. Look at the data!
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Do you think they are paying their fair share?
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You ok?
I'm fine. Decided against feeding the troll. What, you thought I bought your denial as fact and needed to answer your question?
Try this on. I am really Barack Obama, and I want you to vote for me. Now quit arguing.
Your the dick that came here and pussed out real quick, didn't ya?
LoL. Seriously, now you are name calling to troll? Pathetic man. You are the 1% alright. The bottom 1%.
Horde or Alliance?
Ride and hide is your best stroke.
Neither.
Do you think they are paying their fare share?
lol. the blantant non-answer made me laugh.
Ask me anything. I have not seen your question.
no Mikey D's non-answer
Ah, it's hard to keep up, sorry.
You will still pay the same amount of taxes on the first million. The second million will increase by a few percent. Which you probably offset with capital gains tax deduction. As others have said- this is about income inequality-most has been generated with the tax system and bush tax cuts and wall street fiasco.
I don't believe his. Can you provide me with more info?
Obama extended the cuts for a reason.
YES HE DID- in exchange for the extension-
Obama won a 13-month extension of unemployment insurance, a reduction in employee payroll taxes next year, and the continuation of a variety of tax credits aimed at lower- and middle-income Americans. Any employer or employee knows that
Correct. Glad your with me.
hehehe yea....you overate your rank, you aren't in the 1% dude.....you will still get taxed at a higher rate than both the 1% and the bottom 50%
Am, and proud of it. Don't envy me, just pick your hairy ass up, lose the tats and earrings and try to get a job.
Haha, I have a job. A good paying, high tech, high level job. Guess what, I actually agree with capitalism, I agree with innovation, and a lot of stuff. But I want to see the Wall Streeters lose their jobs and bonuses. I don''t know if you work in Wall Street, if you don't thats fine. I donated money to Occupy Wall Street because its time to bring those bankers down. :)
I own a private business. If anyone broke a law then they should be punished by the law.
Good for you. Because Wall Street has broken many many laws indeed and still got away with it.
Shameful
Agreed.
At least we can all agree on that. Even if we could just enforce existing securities laws it would be a step in the right direction.
the wallstreeters as u called them also have a family and a personal life not everyone is a cold villain like u may think
How is lowering taxes gonna help you hire more people??? There has to be more demand of the goods you produce to hire more people??? You aren't gonna hire more people just to get a little tax break.
Exactly!! I do not believe that the corporations need a tax break to hire people. Why can't they shave a few millions off the CEO bonus to create jobs? I'm all for rewarding hard work. But when the gov't takes money out of my paycheck to give to these corporations, and doesn't do ANYTHING to help me or the people in this country who are really suffering, then I have to support this protest.
Breaks provide cash and the opportunity to buy machinery. Remember, the break is letting me keep MY money. Not yours.
Amen!!!
If eveyone can become a 1 percenter then we would have 7 billion people in the 1% by now......Obviously this is economically impossible. If this happens then we would be living in a communist society. Wouldn't we??.......Everyone would like to be a 1 percenter, but they can't because it is impossible for the whole world population to be that rich. So this fake dream about how we all can be millionaires needs to stop
You’re talking about 2 different income levels here. Millionaires are not 1% and yes every American has equal access at being a millionaire. Every millionaire has the access to be a multi millionaire, and every multi millionaire has access to be a 1%’er.
The damn libs seem to confuse this point too often so I will say it again. EQUAL ACCESS! NOT EQUAL OUTCOME! As Americans we have the same access to the dream as any other American. What we do with that access is our business and no place for gov to step in and try to regulate the outcome. The world will always need ditch diggers too.
I think equal access alone is not enough because too much money is going to too few, and the too few have too little accountability for misconduct and too much power politically. That is one of the reasons why this movement has so much attraction. I suspect the 1% will soon find themselves taxed more and having to think about people other than themselves. When the people at the top of the pile get greedy bad things happen. The French, Russian and Chinese (Mao) revolutions, and the revolt leading to the Magna Carta are examples. It goes on and on. Yes you are entitled to be rich, but many people think it has gone far enough.
The top 1% are taxed enough. They already pay the most taxes in this country. In fact, there taxes total more than the lower 90% pay in total. Why tax the rich more? Why not tax the 50% of Americans that have no tax liability? Or better yet; force the government to live within its means rather than tax and spend till they need a new or higher tax.
When we place a punitive tax on the top 1% just for having money, then we drive them and their jobs, money, and taxes out of this country for good and then what? Who will be left to be taxed so much to let the Gov enjoy its spending lifestyle? A flat tax or fair tax would be more appropriate in my humble opinion.
I think these discussions are great! It has been a long time since we have had this kind of dialogue. Let's look at the 50% who pay no taxes. That is correct from an income tax point of view. However, the bottom folks who pay little or no income tax also pay payroll tax which is 7.65 for both social security and medicare. Since income is not taxed for social security above $106,800 a person making more than $106,800 gets a tax cut on all income above 106,800. On a percentage basis the low income tax payer can pay a higher percentage of total income on taxes if you include sales, payroll and income tax than a person who lives off investment income and the low capital gains rate. It is an oversimplification to suggest the bottom of the income group pays no tax. Sometimes they can pay more than the top end depending on the facts - especially if the top income earner only makes capital gains for income which the very top often do. So people who inherited their wealth and don't ever have to work a day in their lives pay very little compared to the folks taking out their trash. That is why the people are upset.
I agree that civil discussion is not only nice but much needed. While it is true that they pay other taxes, they do not pay an income tax. That was my only point there. The income tax of the top 1% is greater than the other tax paid by the lower 50% though.
Not to mention that the employer paid tax the top 1% pay that the bottom 50% typically don’t, makes up for a lot as well. Since the top 1% usually employ people, they pay vastly higher taxes than those who don’t since they are taxed twice.
Great post.
Income tax is "progressive," meaning the more you make, the more you pay, so if the top 1% pays more in income tax than all the other taxes the lower 50% pays, that's how it should be. You still can't say the lower 50% don't pay their fair share of taxes. It's actually the other way around.
Actually, most of the top 1% don't employ people at all -- they get their money being CEO's, managers, investment brokers and the like, in publicly or privately-owned corporations. They make their money in the markets, and by working to increase the stock price of their company so as to increase the earnings of the company's stockholders.
They are not taxed twice.
You have absolutely no clue what your talking about.
We will have to agree to disagree. The top pays 35% and the bottom pay 10%. That alone proves the inequality of the tax structure. We should all just pay 16-18% flat tax in my humble opinion.
http://www.moneychimp.com/features/tax_brackets.htm
I agree.
http://occupywallst.org/forum/job-theory-still-polishing-it-a-bit-will-need-your/
Can you help me with this?
That's just it. By you giving up, that leaves more for those of us who don't know how to give up.
you can see the post is bs from the way the sentence starts "I own (2) million dollar ..."
It's true and feels good. Sorry to kick your dick.
Hey I agree. If you can be happy with that imaginary wealth, good for you. Still curious, why did you say (2) instead of "two"?
Never said I was smart.
How much to see my W2 and K1's?
Whatever you can give me.
Well played, I opened the door there.
Doesn't matter. Any evidence will only be stated to be fake.
Of course
Good for you! =) Are you happy?
He'll ya. And I'm working harder for more. Never quit working, hard.
Then that's great! I will say though that you should work for something besides the success itself ;)
That's what I enjoy most. You can do it too.
I prefer to work hard towards the aims of scholarship, enlightenment, and religion.
Scholarship, enlightenment and religion? Sounds like justification of sponging to be a lifetime college kid, sitting around doing acid and then praying like hell that you'll pass your classes! Get a damn job.
I have never done drugs and I will be graduating next year, but I hope never to stop my studies. I don't pray that I'll pass my classes, I study hard, I excel in them, and I become wiser from the knowledge which I learn and retain from them. I'm a student of computer science, mathematics, and logic. And yes, I'm religious as well, but I don't need to pray to God for my own success; that comes through hard work which builds character, not by asking God/Parents/The Government to bail me out when I dig a hole I can't get out of.
Oh that's why you want me to pay more taxes. For your bullshit self-serving way of life. Get off the bong dumb fuck. TRY to get a job and then work like he'll. Use that powerful brain to find a way to better this planet through labor, not fairy tales.
As I said above, I've never done drugs and since graduating high school I've been a part of a co-op program at my university, under which I work a full-time job for around three months every other semester. I'm a programmer by trade and any company I've worked at could attest to the fact that I'm a damn hard worker. Exactly which part of my remark made you think that I was a drug addict or lazy?
Jesus, that kid is dumb. I am truly scared for our future if that is it.
Scares the hell out of me. Thank God no one seems to be listening.
lulz
Fits a lot of folks around here, right? Amazing the types of people CNN keeps showing at the rallies. I'm not convinced it's earth.
That was all over the place?
We used to say that about slavery, woman's rights or the fall of the Soviet Union.
Say what?
We can change the system because we control it.
By voting, right?
Direct action. Voting is a scam.
I feel like the 99% is really the 1%.
I have not asked for anything here. But I keep hearing the same mantra, give me this and we want that. Is that not greed?
Good but doesn't mean we don't have a right to a decent job, healthcare education. etc.
You have the right to obtain those things. Why is your idea of a decent job different than an immigrants?
What people like you for some odd reason fail to understand is thought not all of us can own 2 million dollar homes. This movement is about saying that we as the 99% deserve fundamental human rights (as afore mentioned). Hence if 1% can be bailed out by our tax dollars, receive subsidies, make business from gov contracts, then they can as well pay higher taxes so we can have decent healthcare,education etc just like they do
Your message about the bailouts is well received and I'm with you. You lose me when you expect entitlements and you want me to pay for it! Is that fair. If you want it so bad the attain it yourself. What demands have I made?
You benefit from the government too, I don't know what business you own or whatever, the government oversees to make sure contracts are legit, that no one is cheating you are stealing. Makes sure trade relations are done so you can get cheap resources to do business. etc. Heck you might even do business with the governmen
Where were those benefits when those bad loans were made. Why isn't Barney Frank in jail. Just answer a few of my questions.
I don't get what youre getting or trying to establish?
yes the government sucked at their job, but in general the government does oversee the transactions of these individuals and holds them accountable. Or else those enron execs never would of been punished.
You said the gov oversees the cheaters and liars.
My success story...I work two jobs...one as a waitress 30 hours a week and one as middle management at a small company 40 hours a week. I rent a decent home, own a car, have a small bank account, and the money to help my kids through college. I also have enough to be able to enjoy my life a little. I LOVE capitalism..because it means my bills are paid every month...and all I have to do is go to work!
I admire you. You gave me goose bumps.
Thanks..your post made me smile..I think it's awesome when someone works hard and gets the life they want..I am honestly pleased when my friends succeed like you have. It's all about good choices, and following your gut instinct...you, my friend, have done well. As for me and my family, I am happy and fulfilled and ever watchful of opportunities where I might be able to take a risk like you did..and my daughter is cleaning houses for whoever will pay her while she goes to college..instead of whining that life is too hard, she is doing what it takes to make it better! I don't think you should be taxed more, I just think the huge corporations and government are out of control and should be held accountable.
Your reminding me of how I was raised. My Dad tended bars and my Mom was a seamstress. They wanted me to do better than them and worked hard to keep me on track. Seemed like their daily message was to never expect someone to help me. I would have to take care of myself. We are missing that message now a days. Seems like the young ones are looking for more entitlements. Thanks for being a great American! You define me. I hope your kids pay you back 10 fold by being just like YOU!
Yep..I tell my kids all the time, "If you don't like it, do something to change it...nobody is going to do it for you." Your parents must smile on you...and you can be proud of who you are. My kids have already paid me back by being amazing people.. being grateful and appreciative of every dime I spend on them or give them to help them in college (averaging less than $100 a month), and absolutely shining with confidence because they have the will, power and satisfaction of building their own lives with pride. OWS protesters pay attention! Jeez..even my kids are smarter than those hippies..even my 10 year old!
Enough positive talk. Heads will burst here! God I like you!
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Should you live here for free. You want to squeeze me so you can have an iPhone? You don't see a problem with that. You want me to see things your way only, speaking of rich! You don't like me because I make money. Would you be happier if I didn't buy anything?
An iPhone? I don't even consider that, it's too far out of my price range. I mean basic phone services (i.e. magic jack, all I can afford atm).
Does it look like I'd be happy if you never bought anything for yourself? I certainly hope not. That's not at all what I'm saying.
I'm saying: unless you can get off your high horse and walk around in the muck, then you don't deserve that horse at all. Come down to the "ghetto" with me and walk a year in my shoes, and see if you don't want change over a wide gamut of issues.
So until you can open your damn eyes to see like an elitist AND the poor: Fuck you.
Until you can concede that the middle ground has all but disappeared for the 99%: Fuck you.
I grew up in a Philly ghetto. Now what do I have to do next? I didn't grow up with money. I want you to know you can do better. Each day think of ways. If you don't do that then only blame your complacent self and not me. Don't be pathetic!
Congrats. This isn't about the rich being rich though. It is about how they got there. Did they do it honestly and fairly taking care of those that helped them reach success (their workers)? Or do they sustain their wealth by treating their employees like crap and padding their own wallets by lowering wages, laying off, or taking government money?
People aren't upset because you did well and took the right risks. They are upset because head's of companies will lay off a few 100,000 employees on the basis of cutting costs but then give themselves multi-million dollar raises/bonuses that same year. They are upset because a company can be on the brink of collapse, get a government bailout (taxpayer money) and still manage to get bonuses that year and still don't get taxed higher. They get upset when wages get frozen, benefits get cut or pay gets cut but the head honcho gets his same salary or another raise. We just want to make an honest living doing our jobs. People shouldn't have to scrap by and need 2 or 3 jobs. Sure we won't get all the shiny things the boss can, but we should be able to live comfortably no matter what job position we have in a company.
We aren't asking for handouts, we are asking to be treated justly for our hard work and for those in charge to take the paycuts with us instead of payraises for the 1% and paycuts/layoffs for the 99%
I agree with everything you stated. Thanks for contributing. Why are there so many self proclaimed Marxists in here?
Gives a false sense of equality. Go ahead and make your money, buy and enjoy your luxuries, just don't forget and mistreat the people that helped get your there.
Read on here how well I treat my employees before giving backhanded compliments please.
wasn't meant as a backhanded compliment or to imply that you mistreated yours, sorry if you took it that way.
Fair enough, sorry back at you.
Can you honestly believe that? Took risks, how so? Everything you did was based of an infrastructure not created by you. By science and engineering knowledge not discovered by you. And more importantly, using resources and goods not owned by you! Everything you did, you've done on the backs of others before you - you do not live in vacuum, we can't have a society that both allows people to live in such extravagant ways while others can barely live.
It's immoral, and it isn't sustainable - and the affects from this will only become more profound as population increases. Do you really believe that just because you were born with more valuable skills it allows you to live "above" others. Sure, you should be rewarded for your efforts without a doubt. But do others really need to live in such dire straits just so you can own two homes? If you believe do, than, that's sick.
I believe I'm due to receive for which I seek. Why else would I seek it if I didn't want it. Teachers know they'll never be millionaires. Somehow I can't set my sights higher? We need all types. This country needs people like me and people like you. I own two homes because I can. I didn't steal or cheat my way to achieve it. So your assumption that somehow I contributed to fellow citizens dire straits is a false accusation.
How much gold do you own? Good to know you have lots of depreciating property.
1 ounce. I reinvest in my company. I trust me.
First of all, I wouldn't have "risked" anything for those things you cherish the most, because I don't have any use for them,lol! If that's what capitalism is about it makes a very poor argument in my opinion. I would venture to say that the leader of any non-capitalist country has more than that.
The leaders of all non capitalist countries have everything they could ever want! Can't imagine some here would cast their vote for that type of system?
Well I'm a Marxist so my personal belief is that you have too much money and that you're contribution most likely wasn't enough for that much. I'm not saying your greed or you didn't work for it or you screwed people over or anything like that. All I'm saying is as a Marxist I have a fundamentally different view of how wealth should be received. Or maybe you do deserve that much money, although I doubt it. I don't know what you did to get it.
Have you considered moving to Cuba, or China?
Reminds me of the premise of the old Merle Haggard song, "if you don't love it leave it". I say if I don't love it change it. I'm not a Marxist, don't know what I am, freethinker?
Take a stand.
Ok, I will. I am for real democracy.
Me too. Whew, that was easier than I thought! Now, let's remind our corrupt elected officials what we really want, no more corruption!
Maybe Cuba, I don't really like China. "IF YOU DON'T LIKE AMERICA, YOU CAN JUST GEEEEEEEET OUT!" Is that what you're saying? This is my home and I wanna fight for it.
Well then I'll fight you to keep Marxism out. Wouldn't it be easier to move. They would love you. I wouldn't treat you like a Marxist even if you begged me.
You wouldn't treat me as a Marxist even if I begged you? Don't worry no begging here. What are you going to treat me as then? And no, it wouldn't be easier to move (brush up on Cuban and American law if you want to know why).
As I would treat any good citizen, righteously. Is that not what we all deserve. This is and never will be a Marxist society. Why has being a Marxist or socialist become so chic? Does it get you laid. If it does I need to know this.
Marxists can be good citizens. I'm glad you would treat me that way, I would do the same to you. And you are right, I doubt this will ever be a Marxist society, I can try and hope though. As far as getting you laid, chicks don't give a shit if you're a Marxist or not unless they are Marxists I guess.
Damn. I was really hoping you were on to something! Peace.
I see you are very proud of your possessions. Will you be able to take your atvs with you when you pass away from this material world?
No dumbass. How is that adding value to this productive discussion.
I think very few people would disagree with the fact that Steve Jobs made a fair contribution to society and earned his wealth. However, there are many hedge fund managers and other people in the financial world who are equally as rich but have contributed very little to society.
Probably not.
instead of paying taxes to the government to give out to people who do nothing, he bought stuff. that stuff created jobs for builders, manufacturers, and alike. people who worked hard got his money, not the unemployed. taxes dont ensure jobs sorry
Ding. Ding.
chalk up one for the opportunity and luck that our great society provided too, asshole. taking risk isn't work; a monkey can take risk.
Are you as smart as a monkey? If not, what's keeping you down.
I have not made it as far as you have butI hope to someday. I came from nothing and hope to make it big. God bless capitalisim. Fuck these whiners
I have not made it as far as you have butI hope to someday. I came from nothing and hope to make it big. God bless capitalisim. Fuck these whiners
Don't ever give up.
I'm in the top 25% maybe. Not sure (where do I find that chart?) I've managed to hang onto the same job for the last 14 years. I feel lucky. (In that I prepared myself, and was given some opportunity) I feel like my income goes further today then it did 10 years ago, it has probably surpassed inflation. In some ways I feel my dollars go further. If I go buy a TV or computer, they cost less and I get more features than I did 10 years ago. I bought an inexpensive 3BR townhome this year and I feel like I got more for my money than what I saw when I looked in 2002.
So, I am positive I am in the 99%, but I feel like the last 10 years have not been bad and I am setting myself up for another good 10 years. (I'm currently in the process of downsizing, getting rid of a lot of my "stuff," and lowering my living expenses)
Now, I realize that the picture is not rosy for everyone, and that is why I support this movement. I believe that corporations and the wealthy hold a disproportionate amount of political control. I haven't given up on capitalism, but I certainly don't think that corporations do a good job of policing themselves. :)
I like the comments in another thread that this should be a movement about anti-corporatism, not anti-capitalism.
I've read a lot of FObama's comments, and really, there is some common ground to be found here. Income-wise he may be in the top 5%. His attitude is clearly not incompatible with what this movement is based on. This movement doesn't say you aren't allowed to spend your hard-earned money in the manner you see fit. It says that this country is controlled by the people, not by money.
We are close. Thanks.
LMS sufferer! (little man syndrome)
How so?
Where's your 2 homes? Mind if I occupy one of them?
I'm underemployed + looking hard. I'll be losing my apt at the end of the month, as I've fallen 2 months behind on my rent. I've taken a lot of risks too. You're luckier than I am, I guess. Maybe I could stay in one of your vehicles?
Where are you looking?
Where are you looking? Maybe I can help?
Is it wrong to say it is immoral to have five cars? Why not four cars?
Economist Ha-Joon Chang has a book out called Bad Samartan's, the Myth of Free Trade. In it he has cute chapter title: Why My 7 Year Old Son should get a job.
Why should Chang take care of his son for free? Shouldn't his son get a job, because the only thing that matters is what someone does to make money in the market economy. Isn't taking care of a child for free socialism? He explains why we had child labor laws and the like.
I'll look him up. Is he a socialist?
One of his flaws is he likes Capitalism. lol
Probably because it is the only system that works? See Russia and China.
Most progressives are capitalists. Social democracy is capitalist. I'm an anarchist, but Chang does make very good points.
Anybody who shows what a butt Thomas Friedman is is a friend of mine.
When you grow up and start a family you will seek stability.
I'm 48. lol
Children?
Married with children?
No children. My Sister has two children. Her husband went to prison. My mother had to give up her retirement, move to Phoenix, so that she can watch my Sister's kids.
Lovely world.
T'is. Do you think Christie would make a good president?
I've given up on that stuff. It's now about grassroots changing of the entire system. The whole magilla is corrupt.
Won't happen. If you want a 20 year old pretend hippie to guide you, your in trouble.
you people blame everything on those more fortunate. Take a look at yourselves before going after someone else. Everyone makes their living somehow and who are you to say their families shouldn't benefit from the work they are doing. You can't blame your hardcomings on the people at the top. A company does not decide to lay off people, they are forced to or else the entire company would go down and all of the workers with it. Protestors fight for unity between corporate giants and small town people when you are really singling out that 1% and their families. The corporate companies do not control the government as far as i'm aware there IS a vote every couple years and its based on majority. Don't bite the hand that feeds you.
There is some great debate in here. You can't convince anyone with a blanket statement. It goes for both sides.
im trying to tell OWS that not everyone from middle class supports there cause and by speaking out they are therefore not saying every opinion I am not part of the 1% but i dont support the 99% either
Hope and change isn't working. I guess we need a new catch phrase?
OWS is trying to market unity. They want everyone to earn the same amount and be in the same class, but what OWS is really doing is singling out the 1% that are more fortunate. Maybe their catchphrase should be "we don't actually have a reason to be angry"
That is very funny. The more demands I hear, I wonder who the greedy ones are?
No kidding. I no more about this than the supporters do and I am 15 years old.
Smart kid.
Define what you mean 'work'? Did you break your ass from 9-5 for six days a week?
Sadly, far more than that. Surprised my wife stuck it out. Raised two kids practically by herself. My mother use to say behind every successful man is a successful woman. Sounds kinda sexist?
Your kidding yourself, you still are climbing the ladder dude, your not in the 1% club.......but we're all real impressed!
Ok, I'll keep climbing. Thanks?
he's home watching jersey shore...irrelevant...idk why I commented..It's about the 99%!!
Care to share your views? Are you an inventor of thought or an echo?
Good for you. Now, have you paid your fair share of taxes?
Way more than my view of fair.
Does being the 1% mean that you're in favor of our 15 trillion dollar national debt? Because the 99% aren't.
Nope. The Tea Party doesn't like it either. Thank Bush and Obama for that.
Then why fight eachother? Why not work together for a common goal?
I'm pretty sure the TP is working hard to change the current system. Did you see what happened last November? Just because you can't smell the dope does not mean they gave up?
I think OWS and TP should work together. You didn't respond to what I said. Are you opposed to working together on common issues?
I think they should but I don't associate myself with either group. I pick and choose from each.
People. There will be a lot of these masturbatory posts in which people talk about their wealth and indulge in today's self-congratulatory fantasy: "The 1%".
You have no idea whether this is some 15yo brat, whether they are employed at all or just some pathetic Rush Limbaugh fan looking for fun at your expense.
I know this: wealthy people don't post a list of their cars, boats, ATVs and houses. This guy is a faker.
You are the 1%. 99% of the populous thinks your full of shit. Butt plugged?
Your hard to argue with. You may have to dig a little deeper here to fully decide who I am. I've divulged a lot about me here. God I wish I was 15 again, without the pimples.
Dont feed trolls. 650 comments to this person going on about stuff they might not even have? C'mon, who cares?
Give me a chance.
We all need to Boycott Imported Goods Buy Made in the USA!!!!
I agree. May not be that easy now a days. Where do they make iPads.
We may not be able to resist buying them but if we just pay more attention, we will save so much money refusing to buy a lot of cheap useless crap
Problem is, people buy cheap. Look at all the foreign cars on the road.
So, do you think it is right that someone works at McDonalds, busts their asses but gets paid 7.50 an hour? Do they earn that as well?
Come on!
Yes. My daughter works in fast food. Great 1st job. It's up to her to decide if she wants to continue or try her hand at something else. It is teaching her to respect what other people do for a living. My Dad made me load trucks on a graveyard shift one summer.
Ah, you didn't answer my question.
I thought I did. It is ok for someone to earn $7.50/hr while busting their ass.
You were saying if someone works hard they deserve to get paid a lot of money. Give the burger flipper more money. Start at 12 dollars an hour.
This is merely an analogy, since I'm for localism, where we would ban McDonalds.
That's fine, however my HS daughter doesn't deserve that much. But it's not her career. Localism is great, but you have to make more than $12 to afford it.
Great, support a living wage amendment and we are cool.
Ok, how? Where? Don't we need elected representation?
We have the priceless wealth of our brothers, sisters, friends, lovers, and the natural world at our back. We have the limitless bounty of righteousness and a just cause. We have the support of the unborn and the momentum of history on our side.
We are beginning to take risks and a month out, they are already paying off.
Chalk one up for solidarity and the spirit of humanity.
Amen and great job!!
Well i believe in equality, and i do believe that is the most popular statement comming out. Edn the poor class, end hunger and poor health benifits. End health as a business which operates to earn profit not help people.
I hope the young generation are ready for a world of freedom and equality. And you can't have that with free market. If you want to help lead mankind to a better future rather than only caring for yourself and people you choose, then free market must die. It allows some to sit on fortunes while others starve, lack medical care and education.
What country best serves your needs?
Thank you for sharing, I bet you along with the nice things you worked your butt off for you probably have a ton of employees. Thank you for creating jobs, you are the fruition of the American dream.
I am an employer. As hard as I work to satisfy my customers, I work just as hard to keep my employees happy. They are the backbone.
What's sad is that "I'm the 1% that earned it" implies that the 99% do not earn what they have. You're just a sad little guy.
I won't respond because you'll spin that too...wait, I just responded. Very tricky!
Define what you did and let us determine if that is work or gambling.
Read my replies. I've answered many times.
Hey loser, did you PAY THEM OFF? Cause if you didn't, then somebody else owns that "success." Congrats on being part of the PONZI, debt machine that makes the banks happy. Do you live in some trashy McMansion somewhere in the dreary suburbs of Armpitia?
It's a nice mansion, but I made add on.
All but one house and 1 car. I do have business debt and the banks better be happy. But I was equally happy when they lent me the money.
Guess what, your still not the 1% Warren Buffet is the 1%
He may be a criminal. He has been rumored to not pay taxes. Stay tuned, more to come in the news soon.
Why not think about starting here. Franklin Roosevelt - Second Bill of Rights People who are hungry, people out of jobs are the stuff of which dictatorships are made. A second bill of rights so that a new basis of security and prosperity can be established for all. 1) The right to a useful and ruminative job. 2) The right to earn enough to provide adequate food and clothing and recreation. 3) The right of farmers to raise and sell their products at a return that will give them and their families a decent living. 4) The right of every businessman large and small to trade in an atmosphere of freedom from unfair competition and domination by monopolies at home or abroad. 5) The right of every family to a decent home. 6) The right to adequate care and the opportunity to achieve and enjoy good health. 7) The right to adequate protection from the economic fears of old age, and sickness, and accident and unemployment. 8) The right to a good education. All of these rights spell security and the well being of the people and the nation and eventually the peace and security of every nation. We have yielded to fascism which president Roosevelt warned us about. It is the responsibility of our elected government to see that these rights are implemented and that we are freed from the greed of the large corporations and our proper life returned to us, the people, one person one vote.
The right to a job? Just because you exist? You have to do better then that. If you take your car to a car wash and they charge $1 per minute and car washer #1 can wash your car in 10 minutes and car washer #2 takes 15 minutes, who do you want to wash your car assuming the end result is the same.
How about one person one share like in many co-ops and credit unions? We should bank with credit unions buy from and work for co-ops when we can, if most people do this the power of the 1% will shrink till it is gone. We should set this as one of our goals.
What if you work 12 hours a day and I work 6? Do I get an equal share?
How can you drive 5 cars at the same time? You should get 5 legs and five mouths so you can eat 5x as much.
I wouldn't mind 5 other things too...............let me re-think that...
congrats
Ha, thanks, I think?
Hit them where it hurts. Close your bank accounts and open new accounts in your local Credit Unions. Start a run on the banks. We can bring them to their knees along with the Executive and Legislative Branch and command their attention more than any vote will.
"What Uncle Sam giveth, We the People can TAKETH AWAY!"
I like it, and approve!
Another anti-Obama and Republican troll, for a troll free space: http://www.themultitude.org/
Troll, no. Republican, sometimes. Anti Obama, YES.
If not a troll then please come to www.themultitude.org and express your dissenting view, we are all ears.
If everyone pimps their site here, then no one would be left here. Oh...I see what your doing.
what are you afraid of? to get booted out as a troll? good try to change the subject. we are pimping the site www.themultitude.org, because of people like you who cannot be taken care of in this disorganize and mismanaged space, and becomes a trollosphere.
And you call me a troll. Obviously your not getting the attention you need. Can I pimp this site on your site. Dicks like you are the reason folks are pissed. Give it a rest.
Idiots like you are the cause for the decline of our country, making a few millions and toys and making everyone think that this is what everyone else needs to do. I will always call a troll a troll. Take your 2 million dollar home and your toys to your grave, when you die in an accident in one of your toys. To others who want to avoid idiots and trolls like these, please visit: http://www.themultitude.org/
I have two million dollar homes, two. If I die on my toys would you grieve for my children? Or my employees? Thanks for not plugging your site again. At least I achieved that with you!
And your the king of what kingdom
My house. Just can't get my wife and kids to agree.
If you earned, congrats to you. If you merely "took risks and they paid off", then you did NOT earn it any more than the gambler earned his.
Bad comparison. Big difference. I'm guessing you know that.
That depends. You're being vague about how you acquired your wealth. If you took a "risk" by starting your own business, and that business required the investment of you're time/money/effort/skill/creativity, than it was earned. If someone told you buy X amount of stock shares in google, and you did, then gambler analogy holds. Investment Bankers and Traders are professional gamblers. I have even seen some retire and make money online playing poker:) Perhaps, you invested in Real Estate? That wouldn't hold the same analogy, but it is still largely based on luck. You cannot consider wealth gained by anything other than the reasons stated above to be "earned".
I did everything in your 3rd sentence and sacrificed even something more valuable than money, Family.
If you did invest your time/money/effort/skill/creativity, then as I mentioned, it was indeed earned. Perhaps you should include that in your post. It would be far more respectable and inspiring to the readers here:) I'm sorry that you had to sacrifice your family in the process. I'm sure that your intention was to bring them a better quality of life (i.e sacrifice for them not sacrifice them for $).
I started this post in hopes people would engage in debate. I didn't start it right and may start a new post. However, there is some great dialog going on.
I don't understand the negativity around taking risk that I've seen on these boards.
If I decide to start a business, I'm taking a risk with my money, my time, my labor. If I've done a good job at research and planning, and then I execute well, my risk will give me rewards. If anything goes wrong, I loose and I suffer the consequences.
This is not akin to buying a lottery ticket and hoping for the best.
@LibertyFirst: Agreed. This is what I was getting at. Risking money along with time and labor is earning. And yes, this is not akin to buying a lottery ticket.
Now give it all away and see if you can do it again... And no one really cares, troll.
I know I could and it would be easier the 2nd time around. Please stick around and enlighten me with your ideals. Who knows, might be good for both of us?
You wouldn't even be able to pay off your college books let alone the loan for college if you did go a 2nd time around. You are clueless about the conditions of America and the world. There is no enlightening for you because you have no EMPATHY or COMPASSION! I'd rather spend my time on someone who sees there is a problem with the world instead of a person in WORLD DENIAL!
Why preach to the choir? I don't think America is as bad off as you think it is. Your brushing me with a broad stroke. I did the same thing when I first joined this forum. I'm changing my ways.
There are many misguided efforts, and it seems that the OWS movement has become a platform for just about any concern. A movement needs to focus and be very clear on what it seeks to accomplish.
I have spent nearly 4 years researching and educating myself on the law and rules that make up the basis on how business is financed and how the rules affect business and the individuals who own them and work for them.
First let me say that this problem is not liberal or conservative, democrat or republican but it is a common problem we all share. One key point must be stressed we are all affected by the issue at hand.
Now, let’s look at the laws. If you look at the fall of the exchange in 1929, its cause and the reaction by the government you will find most of the problem. In 1929 only ~10% of all businesses were public and the remainder was private. ~2% of the population were involved in trading stocks and most of the individuals we very heavily leveraged (They bought on credit).
Next the market dropped, individuals lost their ability to pay off their margin accounts and wiped out the capital overnight in the banking system, Couple that with the hysteria of the people running on the banks to get there gold out and you have a recipe for disaster.
For most they were not initially affected by the falls of the exchange in 1929 but when banks failed they felt it. Businesses lost credit to operate, accounts were wiped out and small private business failed. No fault of their own but the fault of the overzealous banks. Individuals found there savings wiped out alongside the private businesses and the world plunged into the abyss.
The reaction to this was FDR. and the 1933 securities act and the 1934 securities and exchange act. What these two pieces of legislation did was strip the ability of the small private business (who did not cause the market collapse) to raise capital in a traditional form, Bonds. Direct investment was for many years the mainstay of the entrepreneur. It put the restrictions on who could invest (Qualified institutional investor) and how the investments could be sold. It stripped the ability of the individual to invest and make the high returns they became accustomed to and placed all of it into the hands of the very few 1%.
Today if you are a business owner there is a glass ceiling of about $3 million dollars where a business could potentially get debt to expand, retool, or modernize. The Wall Street and Banks prefer an Equity offering. How often do small business owners sell the majority share of the company they own under a public offering or private sale (sale to high net worth’s) to raise the capital they need. The horror stories of this arrangement are very clear. They give up control, get voted out of the company and the new share holders shut them down move the product manufacture to China to maximize the return to the High Net Worth investor (new owner).
The laws perpetuate the problem. Now remove the Glass-Steagall Act and it becomes a high net worth orgy.
Focus, access the laws, and fix the system that perpetuates the behavior.
FIX THE LAWS
I'm feel more blessed than you as I am content with who I am and what I have achieved without the need to measure such value in how much I own or praise myself to posess. I am very, very fortunate, proud of myself, aware of my flaws, aware and confident of my ability to learn and overcome these, I am most of all proud of my family, my parents and children, of my culture, and truely gratefull too, for a strong sense of community and identity, though which I feel nurtured, shielded, cared for and protected, and let free by too, I feel obliged to return the favor, this ultimate gift, and that is why I have invested with all of my heart, all my talent, skills and abilities, straight back into my community, my family, my country, all which gave me the chances to manifest myself, to grow freely and independent, that connected me to the earth, human history, that taught me, through stories, through music, through the arts, through natures miracles, through live's blood, that gave to me, abundant and unrelentlessly, that made me strong and made me stand servile and humbled and keeps humbling me, for being there to bare witness to the sheer beauty of things, that has let me evolve spiritualy, to by times full potential even, that helped me outpeerform my self, overcome myself, and raise above myself, and discover richess beyond my wildest imagination and greatest expectation; this all atribute to the reason why I have volunteered for my neighbourhood and achieved some positive change, when stood up for my friends, neighbours, family, when I helped raised awareness about issues that mattered, stopped injustices, brought inspiration, all this, instead of ever feeling the need for pouring my ego all over others, by gaining property, wealth, though collecting useless posessions, there is nothing I claim to own. I have given way for love, and I fought tougher fights within and without than you will ever be able imagine. My rewards are plenty full. There is nothing of what you have, to give or withhold from me, that I can possibly envy, ever. If I die tomorrow there is nothing for me to take to the next world, but I will have the learned about, maybe mastered some treasures, like of true friendship and love.
Are you still feeling good today?
You and are not to far apart. Read my replies. I was being a jerk in my post to get people in.
FObama really? wow... as said below or above where ever this comes up on your blog, more than once, this is not about ending wealth its about corporate and governmental change that MUST happen to rid the world of such inequities.
Good for you in what you achieved in your life so far, not trying to take the good feeling of how wonderful it feels to put in an honest days work - that is what everyone of us around the globe needs to do... and with that comes a change in how businesses BEHAVE>
We can't allow this divide between the haves and the have-nots any longer.
We need to see Corps become more community minded and treat everyone fairly. The folks hammering out the goods on the production lines WORK for the Sr Execs - these folks are why senior execs are making the big bucks - yet these folks get diddly for their work compared to a top level manager who is paid to make big decisions however, difficult a decision is, there is no way in hell that that sr exec deserves lets say for argument sake, a $400K salary as compared to the line guy who is making $40K... 10 X more???? ... my ratio may be off some but lets do it differently from now on -
CAP salaries - Make everyone's salary PUBLIC - no more games - once bills are paid and payroll is met - any residual income / profit - gets spread out FAIRLY - people making product sweat and bust ass to make product... they are hourly and deserve a HUGE profit share percent as compared to the decision maker - get rid of the typical hierarchy- draw up a corp plan that flat lines the org. Once a percent goes out to employees for profit share - there is a % that will go to charity and community - MAKE CORPS RESPONSIBLE to their COMMUNITY AT LARGE>.. employee is an employee is an employee. CEO's raking in $4,000,000 with bonus annually - needs to end.
why does anyone need more than one home and a camp/summer home - i can see two homes wonderful ... but its about the greed that this nation has bred with its ILL - CONTRIVED notions of how to make money... capitalism is great but not when it bleeds with abuse and corruption
You had me until the capping salaries. You need to revisit your ideals there or America is not the place for you. Your message has substance but a free economy has to remain free. You and I can protest the overpaid execs by not buying their products.
and i think you should take the joker above who asked if you would come on down to the desk appointed for the 1% spokes person - you need to come on down and talk ... you talk sense and remain neutral and are an asset to us all.
I'm none of those. But thanks
I am laughing... it is much more involved than i wrote ... depending on what a corps balance sheet together with forecasts, assets and resources add up to - a national / global economy would thrive with some form of capping - a percentage deemed (by way of some agreed upon/voted on uniform equation) to go to profit sharing (that will become spend money) to go to charity and community (that will create a table with food or community gardens or hospices for the sick) - spreading the wealth but allow for the company owner to indeed take in a little more than those under him. Get rid of the corp hierarchy structure- that is so OLD and HAS BEEN - where prob half of the upper layers are do nothing individuals who just have a title and really don't add value whatsoever- so these guys get laid off when the ax falls anyways - Well its an idea to mull over - to play with and move us all towards a better tomorrow! It will stabilize and change the corp organizational structure so the CEO's of yesterday become ready willing participants in being a fair and square community guest who partakes in helping others. Send a % of their revenues back into the street and into a helping organization that is bettering someone's world. What goes around will come around...
Thanks for your thought provoking ideas. I can't absorb it all in seconds. Very deep and intellectual (neither of which describes me) and will require me to ponder this further tonight.
For Obama eh? good deal.
No on Obama. Problem is, no one running is worth my vote either.
He's right this isn't gambling, but were talking about the banking/ stock market manipulation issues. There will always be the rich but a few of the super rich have legislated rules that only benefit them.
Wrong. Our legislators legislated! They should be the focus.
Are you saying that things things equal success? What about people who have devoted their life to helping others, such as nurses and teachers? Some people take pride in choosing people over profits. I know a lot of jerks with money. I'll chose people over profits any day of the week.
You're assuming that everyone here doesn't work hard or have a job. That's pretty insulting. I wonder what your point is in bragging about your material possessions. Owning a lot of stuff does not make you a good person.
In addition, your post would make more sense if we truly lived in a capitalist society. Bailouts for banks and special interest areas/corporations is not capitalism. If I performed the same way as bankers and politicians at work, I' would be fired.
I agree with everything you say. I was being a dick to invoke debate. America can be fixed and it has to start in Washington.
Read all my posts to fully understand my objective.
Awesome. You have a right to the fruits of your labors. Enjoy it!
However,
You do not get to have more of a say in how our country is run. You do not get to pay less taxes, or rig the system in your favor. Your vote counts the same as everyone else. One person, one vote. Not one dollar, one vote.
You are 100% correct! Term limits too.
why are you targeting wall street? the people who work in finance are just regular people -- i know because i'm married to one. what about automobile makers, pharmaceutical, consumer products? think.
I'm not. The problem is or politicians. We should be on Capitol Hill!
I am one of the 1% also, I'm glad you are proud of all your material items. However, it's not about just capitalism, because I have been very successful also, however, I don't brag about it..
It is about fairness. You and I have been very fortunate to make a lot of money, especially under the bush tax cuts.. However, since federal tax receipts have dropped so quickly due to the great recession, it is time that we all(the top 1%) pay a little more of our excess income in order to reduce the deficit/budget... This way we don't JUST cut social programs that the less fortunate desperately need during this tough times..
You sound a little like the Koch brothers or should I say Yertle the Turtles
I was provocative to lure people in to engage in friendly debate. It worked with some. I'm not greedy and I treat my employees as I treat myself, except I took my first pay raise in 10 years last year but they got at least 6% each year I've been in business. It would not be fair to pay a penny more in taxes!
Wow, first pay raise in 10 years,,, you must not be a very successful 1% er.. Everyone I know making over the $400k per year has figured out how to put their head down and continue to make more money. If paying an extra 3% of your income will hurt you, then maybe you shouldn't be in the business your in. Also, maybe you should sell some of your material items, oops, those are the things that define you.. no ,Maybe it's your Karma.....
I choose to reinvest in my business. Unfortunately, the tax system doesn't care (sub S). All income gets taxed. Not fair. Thanks for trying to tear me down. I won't let you do it. How are your words different than Wall Streets actions?
You took risks with YOUR OWN money I assume. Congrats to you!!! If you took risks with my mortgage or retirement, I hope criminal charges are brought against you.
My money? Are you making a Barney Frank reference with his relationship with Freddie and Frannie? If so, I agree and understand.
If you're referring to him protecting them while they insured loans to people who couldn't afford rent, then yes. You also forgot to mention Obama approving 6 million dollar bonus within the 2 entities. That doesn't change my original statement. If you gambled with your own money, I applaud you. If it was mine, you should go to jail.
Every penny was mine. How could you and I get government money?
Big Banks GM AIG bailouts were Bull
Solandra what was that?
withdraw monies from Big banks
March on DC
NOV 11, 2011 111111
We are 1!!!!!!!!!!
I hope this happens. Let me know what I can do.
Big Banks GM AIG bailouts were Bull
Solandra what was that?
withdraw monies from Big banks
March on DC
NOV 11, 2011 111111
We are 1!!!!!!!!!!
Ok, now your talking!
http://www.getmoneyout.com/
Good for you and I am happy for you. There are countless men serving overseas and over 4000 men that have given their lives to help make what you have possible. Those that benefit the most should contribute the most. It isn't like you have to give your life like some have. So enjoy and help make this a better world for all. (Did i forget to mention all those who are disabled from these last couple of wars?) I read the account of a pow from Korea. His dream was to get back to his house and and feel the wet driveway under his bare feet as he washed his car. Enjoy but don't whine! The highest marginal tax rate in the 1950's was 90% . Today it is around 35% I am sure you earned all that you have and did not do it on the backs of others!
I will never forget our defenders of freedom. Senseless wars are senseless.
I agree with what you just said, The point remains that a few dollars in taxes for the more fortunate it little to pay for the sacrifice some have made over the centuries for this country. and the world, Then there are the cops and first responders etc etc. So you made your way but I am sure you took advantage of a system that rewards hard work. We need to work hard to make the world a better place for all. It will never be perfect but what we have today is getting worse economically not better. Your homes are not worth what they were a few years ago. You ATV's will fall apart. In the end we need each other. Hopefully you will live a good life and never need a helping hand.
A helping hand I will always lend. We can't go it alone. I pay my fair share in taxes. I opt to give more to the less fortunate through charities. When my toys break they will be fixed by hard working Americans!
Good, My favorite charity of the moment is http://www.getmoneyout.com/ It would be nice if you could contribute.
The other point I would make is there are a lot that did not earn it. The Koch brothers come to mind and as a former Wall Streeter I could name a lot more that got what they have by accident of birth.
Those that have earned it? Buffet, Gates, Jobs etc. Those that did not? Koch borthers, Walton family (funny! no?) So anyway.
Enjoy!
I do agree about senseless wars which is why we should have a draft. It is senseless then lets spread the wealth! Like many that lost a few friends and family it reminds me a few extra dollars in taxes is little to pay to make this a better and greater country for all so you can enjoy the fruits of your labors
Bush got us into it and we should have gotten out long ago, I agree. To me it was all Iraq was all about getting back at Saddam Hussein for trying to kill his dad. What a waste. if we still had a draft I doubt he could have pulled off the deception he did to get us into all this. I hope we get out sooner than later but get out all the same.
Anyway! Good luck, Be careful! Wear a helmet!
We need more Americans like you! I salute you.
How did you earn it? What did you do? Please explain.
I did, several times in this post. Sorry
You are obviously embarrassed to post what your company actually manufactures. Why so vague? I want to know what your company is, how you started it, and what you sell.
What do you and I have to gain by it. I have provided almost everything you ask here. Find it. I know you have an agenda and I'm sure it's not favorable to me.
I want to know what your business manufactures, i.e. what "hard work" went into "earning" your wealth. I want to know how you got your business started, any help? Or just YOUR "hard work." I want to know what, if anything, you contribute to society, or are you just a taker? Your obvious reluctance to clearly state how you make your money leads me to believe you know, deep down, how full of shit you are. But prove me wrong.
Short version: worked for a big company and saw a need that I thought would add value to universities. Took my idea to the bank and venture capitalists (several times), found a building, purchased machinery and inventory and hired a few people. To accomplish this I quit my good paying job ($150,000), leveraged the equity in my home along with other assets including my wife's wedding ring. I did not draw a salary for the 1st year and did not increase my pay from year 3 thru year 10. Not every day is Rosey, each day in business creates a new hurdle. Most of my friends would not trade shoes with me. I travel 150 days a year.
You still refuse to reveal what you manufacture. How much do you pay your employees? In the world I envision you would have one house and two cars and pay your employees a fair wage. But you are a glutton.
Only one house? Two cars.........really cool cars (Maserati and a Ferrari). My employees are above fair pay. I could survive. Can I keep my wine cellar? How about the ATV's? Boat? You are to vague. Elaborate.
What do you manufacture, besides greed? What is the average pay of your employees? Do they have benefits, or do you let the taxpayer cover that burden for you while you explore your gluttony? I want to know what you manufacture and who you sell it to. How much pollution are you responsible for? Any government contracts?
Average pay, $68,567.35. Each employee has full health care. I cover 100% of the healthcare costs including co-payments. No pollution. Even have electric fork lifts. 3 of my cars are electric (Fiskar).
Still no answer as to what you manufacture and who you sell it to, and I'm guessing I'm right about government contracts?
That is awesome news for you and I do support your efforts in making good for yourself and your family.My brother is a vice president in BOA and I am the opposite.I am a poor Artist who has a lot of common sense. I have no issues at all with those who make money and even lots of money.My issue is what they do with their money and my main issue really is our Corrupt Government.I would not be shoving all the blame on Obama either.Both of the main parties are to blame as it "takes two to tango". Your kind and mine should band together to only fight the Corruption of Big Money on our Government.We do not need to fight and argue.We need to Unite and stand together.You must get very angry when a liberal richman pays a politician a huge wad of cash to pass a liberal favored Government act. All I want to see is: End Money Lobbying End Large Money Donations to Politicians/Parties/PAC Groups. End Corruption
This Corruption hurts your Conservative Causes and hurts my Liberal Causes. But first and foremost even though you and I are different we are both proud to be an American. America First !!!
I'm slowly being convinced by good people like you. Thanks! But don't ever call me conservative :).
What the heck do you do with 6 ATVs?
Really? I have a big family.
FObama, Sounds like you have very good employees who work hard for you to reach your stated goal to be in the 1%. My guess is that you provide a decent salary, one that is commensurate with the cost of living in your place of business(es), a safe work environment, merit increases and good benefits such as healthcare, vacation plans and probably share your profits with them. If this is true and I wasn’t happily employed I would want to work for a guy like you , tons of Americans would. Now, I assume that your business is planted firmly in the U.S., but would you move it to another country if the labor was so cheap that you could double, even triple your profit margin? Would you object, if your employees wanted to unionize their labor? Would you reject a request from your employees for salary increases commensurate with your increase in wealth? If you answered no to these questions, then I would fight hard for you to receive tax breaks that you would need in order to offset these fair business practice costs. But I would still want you to pay more taxes, simply because you are not as greedy as you want us to believe. Keep up the hard work and be good to your employees, because you are as dependent on them as they are to you!
My employees are the soul of the business. No one carries a title. Together we succeed. I provide all the benefits you mention and a few more. I could pick up and move production to Mexico but won't! I am far from greedy, just wanted to be provocative (a dick) to get folks to respond. Higher taxes would only hurt the business. Thanks for your great response !
You're welcome. I commend your business performance and success, and I respect the dialogue from your post and strongly believe that it should very much be a part of the discussion going forward. You have first hand knowledge of what it takes and seem to apply fairness in your business practice and there are many lessons to be learned from you, so merely focusing on your possessions is a circus act that belongs in the fringe theater of this people's movement. You sound like you’re part of the solution. However, I disagree with your assertion that a higher tax rate of your income would hurt your business. I'm certain payroll taxes are a bigger threat, but if your business is a corporation then it’s a wash. If anything a higher tax rate on your income may shorten a nice family vacation or two or complicate another large purchase on your behalf. 99% of Americans have had to deal with hardships and shortcomings like this, some more severely than others over the last 10 years, but the 1% have not and have benefited from the demise of the 99%. The wealth of the 1% has reached record numbers over the last 10 years and now, more so than ever, continue to use this wealth to influence government to the detriment of the 99% of Americans. If you've been wealthy for the past 10 years, then you have seen your share of the tax burden lowered considerably almost year after year and have prospered which is good. 99% of Americans, including the middle class hasn't been so fortunate and I won't even touch on how bad it's been for the lower class and senior citizens over that same time frame. It’s time for the 1% to share this huge burden and raise their taxes, afterall, we are all in this together and to quote a pretty smart guy “together we succeed.”
I like you. We may never see eye to eye, but we come very close! Have a great day!
Thanks, just convinced a work colleague over break time to join me tomorrow to protest police brutality toward the OccupySF campers, so I'm having a wonderful day. I'm sure we see eye to eye on more than you are willing to accept, like crony capitalism and TARP bailouts. It's simple, the wealthy 1% is spending millions in DC to prevent the Buffet Tax from passing and this movement is pushing back against it, join us.
Love that you are replying to all. Thanks and good luck to you in all your future endeavors.
Good on ya, your a perfect advocate. Later we can discuss why the buffet tax would hurt my biz. Are their private chats here?
No offense but at 2 million you're what the rich would call a "busboy".
None taken. Do something productive today to help yourself. Be creative and create a need. Never give up.
Sir,
I own a very nice condo on w54th, a recording studio downtown and a nice house upstate on a river. And it is on my own intiative as your probably is. I'm just wondering if you're using this forum to publicly masturbate over your own success. I actually make a (very) little more than you but I wouldn't announce it here as you did.
Good for you and I hope you make more than my 7 digits I do. Please don't dodge the taxes you owe and take care of your employees!
Do you help anyone with your "earned wealth" ? Or do you stick your middle finger up at the poor and your relatives?
So far all I see from the wealthy is they are self-centered, ego-maniacs who only care about $$$$$ and themselves and would not help another human being in need.
Do you have compassion for the elderly and the disabled and other humans who aren't able to own 2 million dollar houses,five cars, 6 atv's, a trailer and a boat ?
You don't say how you've earned it.
Are you a drug dealer?
Are you a bank robber?
Or do you steal it from unsuspecting consumers in the form of overpriced and poor quality products?
Did you do hard work or was it inherited?
What is your so called "private business"? You run a meth kitchen?
You leave out the important details while thumbing your nose up at everyone else. I hope you choke on your money.
Good god man, you have a serious problem. I've stated my business in this post, read it, then reply. You are vey ill.
You earned it? You mean you waited tables for 16 hours, or pumped septic tanks all day, or sweated as a car mechanic all summer? I think you just started with money, and made more money off of everyone ELSE's efforts. You worked for it ?....hahahaha...you're just a bad joke.
People have the jobs you stated for a reason.
No I worked for it. Made tough decisions and don't see my family much due to travel.
Why waste your time responding to these people? Go see what they think of you in the NY Times of Saturday Oct 15 (In Private, Wall Street Bankers Dismiss Protesters as Unsophisticated) You should instead concentrate on making sure this movement doesn't fizzle out by the first snow: create an organization with a platform and a candidate for the next election, such as Ralph Nader.
Not a bad choice, but he is unelectable. Need a modern mouth piece.
Did you ever cheat on your taxes? If you did, then you received a mini bailout by the taxpayers. That's what everyone is pissed about.
Get it?
I hate tax cheaters. Pisses me off! I run a legit business. Flat tax is the only fix!
Is what you stated in your first sentence how you define success? If so, then you have much more to lose than most, and lose it you will.
Not sure what sentence your referring to? I'll do my best to not lose anything. Over 100 of my employees are hoping not too. Change your attitude to a better one, be productive and creative. Opportunity awaits you.
We all work hard, but opportunities are not equal. In capitalism, it's impossible for everyone to have wealth.
Not impossible. Propaganda will have you believe that. Why would anyone go to college or trade school if this were true? Not everyone will take the risks, travel away from there family, not take vacations, etc. The road to wealth is not for everyone.
You do not understand Captialism, this much is clear.
Maybe I don't. But you may not know how a private business operates.
Why can't everyone make at least $40,000 a year?
Because a hamburger would cost $75 each. Would you buy a $75 burger?
Why would that increase the cost of a hamburger?
In Japan, the level of wealth is comparatively level. Yet the yen is still worth something.
It would. Overhead is factored into all products because they have to be unless you are subsidized by the government. Do you know what a hamburger costs in Japan?
Sir,
You are quite ignorant. You don't understand basic economics. If your customer base doesn't make enough money to buy your product, then you will go out of business unless you adapt by decreasing the price of your product.
If still you think there is a typo, then ignore my post entirely and simply imagine a grand middle finger shoved quite contently up your nose.
We are just not seeing each others points. I am a business man. I sell a product. I'm sure you and I are not to far apart and after a few beers would either agree or choose to disagree. I appreciate your time and wish you a good day.
Let me explain again:
If you don't increase the wages of the worker, there won't be anyone to buy your product. That's why Circuit City went out of business. Not because Best Buy is better (it's not), or because they paid their employees too much. It's because Americans don't have as much disposable income to keep up with supply.
You didn't make sense, maybe a typo.
Everyone can make $45000 in maybe a big corporation like Apple. How much grass does a Gardner have to cut to make $45000?
It probably costs more in Japan because beef isn't a prime crop of Japan. They import most of their beef products. But, as an example I do know, video games in general cost more in Japan than they do in the United States.
However, the problem isn't that increasing wages would make a product so expensive as to put everyone in the poor house. Let's say increasing wages DID increase the price of hamburger. Now let's say that working class Americans don't have competitive wages to purchase a hamburger.
Better yet, let's just say that the price of hamburger still doesn't go up, and working class Americans STILL aren't making competitive wages. Because that's whats actually happening. If your customer base doesn't make enough money to buy your product, that's when you have to shut down your doors. Not when you increase wages.
I think you are starting to understand me? Business 101.
Did you work harder than millions of people who did not aquire the wealth you boast about?
Probably more than most. It would be hard to measure. I know I have sacrificed a lot. I feel like I missed the beginning years of my kids lives.
wallstreet hates capitalism.
Doubt it. I'm not sure you understand what Wall Street does. Or maybe I don't? I thought they raise capital for business by selling their stock?
This movement is not, and should not, be about ending wealth or stopping your ability to reap the benefits of a capitalist society.
What this movement is about, from what I can tell, is ensuring that the wealthy don't unduly get represented by our government through pay-for-play auctions. What this movement is about is ensuring that the wealthy don't stack the cards in their favor and closing the loopholes that allow them to do so.
I see some demand higher taxes -- and I say that this is a stop-gap measure. Asking people to pay more in taxes, to a broken political system with spending run amok, is NOT a solution. It will continue to perpetuate the problem.
Fix the government first. THEN we can discuss taxation and what this country really needs.
PREACH!!!
You Sir, are right! What are you doing next November? I hope running for office.
Ha! I'd be the worst of the bunch ... I'd be a total sell out. :HAHAHA!
The temptation must be overwhelming, hence all the crooks on the Hill.
Exactly. I mean, we complain about it (and rightfully so), but not many people would give up hundreds of thousands of dollars for the lower levels or millions upon millions on the high end in legal bribe money.
Everyone else is doing it right?
That's why this legislation needs to be rammed through our government's heart. They won't do it willingly.
The Supreme Court has colluded with this corruption ... and they are basically our last hope of defense. They should be tried for treason! Their charge is to uphold the SPIRIT of the constitution ... something they most certainly failed in.
Have a drink on me my friend!
I'm part of the 99% that has worked all my life for middle class wages and benefits. I've worked two jobs all my life. I'm not looking for anything you have. Corporations packaging toxic debt into complex securities, shipping jobs oversees to increase profit margins and collecting tax incentives in the United States, off shore tax shelters and deregulating the investment banking industry to the point that we have "too big to fail" corporations is not capitalism. Failed risks usually means you have to pay for your poor business decisions. That's unless you hedged your bets in both the Democratic and Republican Parties and destroyed any resemblance of democracy.
I agree 100%. welcome to the Tea Party!
I don't support the Tea Party. I'm a fiscally conservative Republican who is a moderate on social issues. I also don't support any wage reduction strategies to compete against foreign labor. I also never supported NAFTA or the globalization of our economy unless there was fair trade agreements which of course our multi national corporations were not fond of supporting. The Tea Party just seems to be an off shoot of the right wing Repubican Party. I'm also not a fan of David Koch.
You and I are two peas in a pod.
It's not about fairness or who earned what. It's about what kind of a country we want. If we want a country where a few control virtually all of the wealth and government ignores the rest of society, maybe we can become another Mexico. How's that working out for them?
It's not about fairness or who earned what. It's about what kind of a country we want. If we want a country where a few control virtually all of the wealth and government ignores the rest of society, maybe we can become another Mexico. How's that working out for them?
You have the beginning of a good argument, just a little off focus. We probably agree on most things. I don't like the message that I should have to pay more than I do today (which is not a fair tax).
Yes congratulations, you deserve your success. But as you say you took risks that paid off. If so, your success is partly due to Providence. There are equally many people who work just as hard as you did, took calculated risks but were just not as fortunate. It's not because they are more stupid, or they are lazy.
Quote: "I returned, and saw under the sun, that the race is not to the swift, nor the battle to the strong, neither yet bread to the wise, nor yet riches to men of understanding, nor yet favour to men of skill; but time and chance happeneth to them all." Eccl 9v11
The big problem is people who take risks out of unbridled greed who for one reason or another, whether through fraud or bad luck do not succeed and destroy not only their own lives, but the lives of hundreds of others.
That's how capitalism works. All successful people aren't greedy, most entrepreneurs start businesses with passion. God helps those who help themselves.
congrats! However do you think capitalism should have this much impact on how things get done in DC? Do you believe the United States Government should be "market driven" ?
Ala, the more money you have the bigger impact you have on what laws gets passed in our nation?
To answer your questions, no, no and he'll no. I like your screen name. Wall Street is not the problem, it's DC. Everyone wants to always blame the drug dealer.
Others are also working, not necessarily less than you. May be they were simply less lucky, may be less smart, may be more honest. Who knows...
You made it, fine. Pay a little more taxes as you can obviously afford it. Why are you on this forum? Are you afraid?
I'm afraid of the freeloaders. You create luck with ideas, my biz didn't fall in my lap. It would not be fair for me to pay a penny more. Sad you can't see this.
Wire me $200,000 and we will talk.
Talk about what?
Gosh I feel sorry for you. You probably pay so much in taxes that it hurts to get out of bed in the morning. Poor you!
It is painful. I hope you get to find out someday.
All of you so called 1% make me laugh so hard, when you are really a 99% ... your chump change is nothing in comparison to the real elites of the world.
Your the 1%. the 99% think your a douche.
I'm a 99% you fool.
Ok, feel better now. My message is anyone can do it. And, I'm working to meet your 1% criteria. Thank you for inspiring me. I won't protest you.
Now this is a perfect example of a troll. When the posts start out this way..."I own (2) million dollar homes..." you know they are ignorant, or are simply trying to gather information. We are a very visible movement now. Just ignore these kinds of posts for the benefit of the movement. Please.
These people have nothing of worth to contribute.
Right, nothing but jobs and tax revenue. Oh, and stimulation and not the kind your thinking of. Troll alert.
I think he's trolling. Just ignore it.
Wrrong
A troll would say that wouldn't they :-)
A troll doesn't dedicate time to a 950 commented on post, right? Are you trolling.
Perhaps a little now. I'm surprised this exchange has gone on as long as it has.
In what way have your "risks" contributed to society?
My risks employee people. I buy a piece of machinery, that employes their employees. I could go on and on but your bright mind may catch on.
Is your machinery part of an automated process? If it is it is actually taking away more jobs than it creates.
Is this machinery part of some sort of weapon? If so, that sort of risk may in fact be detrimental to society.
How does your horse and buggy do on the highways?
uh huh, so do you help automate the production of cars?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=joWD5vQvkfk
This is really a none argument. Innovation helps everyone. Someone has to build the automated machines. Do you cut your grass with scissors or heaven for bid, a lawn mower?
"Innovation helps everyone"
Not quite, because we still rely on a monetary system
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cAjFBsp__aE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yCJqP18gBlc&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tdhklzlF3Dw&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q1a5MlHFJu4&feature=related
(No option available to 'reply' to your comment below this one)
Our productivity has skyrocketed since the industrial revolution because more 'work' is performed with less effort from people. e.g. agriculture
Technological Unemployment: We are reaching a point where machines are so efficient they can replace many occupations and be extremely profitable in comparison. (No healthcare, no retirement fund, no overtime, no sick days, no vacation time, etc.)
This would be great except people require 'jobs' in a monetary system in order to be able to purchase the things necessary to survive. The irony is, while machines are creating abundance, greater numbers of people are suffering because the job market is shrinking.
Combine this with outsourcing to 3rd world countries and we see an ever shrinking job market. This in turn also pushes more people into markets which are either unnecessary or do not contribute to society. (They simply exist to move money around)
The system also demands people to continuously consume in order for it to function. So products are designed with lifecycles and are purposely designed to be replaced. The hardware for Ipods, and cell phones for example could be designed to be upgradeable. It also creates a ton of redundant products which are thrown away almost immediately. e.g. cheap copy-cat goods.
This creates an unsustainable situation. Tons of waste are created and ecosystems are destroyed in the process. e.g. clearcutting forests, stripmining mountains, overfishing, fracking, global warming, etc.
What we need is a steady state economy based on sustainability, otherwise the environment will not be able to sustain our population.
Basically a monetary system requires scarcity and growth to function. We have created abundance through technology and can't grow much larger because of our limit on finite resources.
So either the current monetary system collapses and gets replaced by a more sustainable system or the ecological system collapses and most of our population gets replaced.
I don't have time to watch this. Just give me your thoughts.
Wealth is good. If it is appropriate wealth.
www.republicofolancho.com
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Republic-of-Olancho/149833091753264
Any wealth earned fairly is good. Fairly is a loose term. Just earn it the right way.
Is entry into this Republic Orlancho for the very wealthy?
It is for anybody seeking a healthy, physically active Earth-appropriate environmentally progressive way of living. Olancho already exists and is mainly populated with resilient self-sustaining citizens. Our goal is the makeover of each town, one at a time, into "modern" self reliant communities. The initial funding is sourced from the local gold mining operations whereby gold is sold or traded for building materials, farm equipment, wind turbines, solar panels and clean drinking water technologies. The price of gold is high because of economic uncertainty and we are trading the gold to build a new society that will not be faced with this type of uncertainty.
www.republicofolancho.com
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Republic-of-Olancho/149833091753264
Congrats to you. No one wants to take that from you. They just want a chance to to it themselves and the way things are set up the cards are stacked against most people. So far as the tax issues. We wouldn't need an income tax if we didn't have the mindset of sticking our noses into every other nations business. Bring the troops home, let Isreal work things out for themselves they are grown ups it's time they act like grown ups and take responsibility for themselves instead of relying on us. We would have plenty of money for social programs if we didn't so over regulate businesses that they can't grow and hire people into good jobs instead of asking everyone to work at McDonalds. That's what people want is a better than average chance of if they work hard they will move forward. Right now even most of those that have jobs can't do any better than to tread water. We need to get rid of the Federal Reserve system and all other Central Banks in the world. The only time the US was debt free in its history was under Andrew Jackson and he did it by getting rid of the central bank of the time called The Bank Of the United States, yes another official sounding name to a privately owned bank that was meant to deceive the people in general. He than had Congress print the money debt free. Right now the Federal Reserve prints the money congress requests then loans it to the people with interest but they never print the interest. So the interest we owe doesn't physically exist so it is impossible for us to pay it back. Again congrats to you sir but don't count the fact that you were able to be successful means the rest of the have something wrong with them!
Well said, and understood. Just don't expect something from our government. They are tho obstacle.
This liar claims he worked for it, bullshit. He had money given to him, inherited it or he would be the 99% like us. You CANNOT have wealth like that and remember this is assuming this anonymous coward is telling the truth, without having wealth to begin with. Please tell us where your homes are so we can expose your lying ass. I am so proud of the Americans finally standing up to the disgusting 1% of humans who feel we are their indentured slaves by virtue of their wealth. The Revolution is here, release the trillion dollars of OUR money, the money the US government and the bankers STOLE from the American public in 2008. Release it to the rightful owners, the 99%.
Sorry to burst your anger felt rant, no inheritance yet. When my folks go I'm expecting to cover some debts.
All of which you have gained by keeping what other people made by their labor!
I can't make it all myself? Would you rather I employ less people. Not understanding your vibe?
Ending Corporate Personhood= Ending buying Politicians! Simple ratification of the 14th amendment. The constitution never defined laws pertaining to corporations, only We The People and government: and so it should return to its origins on that one! Remove Reagan's failed trickle down economics tax breaks for the wealthy.Reinstate tariff and quota caps on imported goods. Sometimes the way forward, is also the way back! Great starting point for the country. Be glad of your hard earned success, if that success can continue to flourish on a leveled playing field.Where you benefit the same as the working class. Understand that big banks that paid off their loans were given incredibly low interest rates- ones a private citizen could never hope for. So in essence they robbed the Americans people of the money that those interest points would have provided, i.e they get to pay back 1 cent per dollar, instead of say 8 cents. thats 7 cents we lost. Have they passed those rating savings on to us? Nope. Quite the opposite.
Ok!
FObama- congrats on your success. To all of those envy and jealousy, neither government or the lack thereof to any degree with provide you any degree of success. It all comes from your brain and two hands. Get to thinking and working. And at the end of the day, if you haven't achieved vast wealth, guess what- you can live a good life without riches. So gain a little perspective as well.
Thanks! Keep adding value and being productive.
If FObama is so well off, why is he (she) wasting their time on this forum? Go on and enjoy all your "well earned" wealth. Are you cautious about something?
Explain?
??????
Your point in no way goes against what we are protesting!
Thank you Rant Casey! Duh! We aren't saying you don't deserve wealth! We are saying that others work hard and deserve it too! And we are saying that just because some people are rich doesn't mean that they can STEAL from others! Maybe you got rich honestly! But when someone steals, stealing is stealing and that is it! PLUS just because you are rich doesn't mean that you deserve more access to law making than the rest of us! Some people don't want the money you have but they want to live well and want access to policy change!
Welcome to the way the 1% thinks!
http://www.change.org/petitions/pay-congress-what-middle-class-americans-earn
Good luck with that, start with term limits.
You are not rich. Your mom p[ays for everything. That is why you don't care about welfare.
We all know you live in your mom's basement. You don't have to worry about welfare because your mom pays for everything.
Ha. Is that what you wish on people?
What's your profession?
Manufacturer of products for professional institutions.
You seem not to want to measure apples to apples. You could be manufacturing anything.
It shouldn't matter what we make?
It should matter. I was wondering what it was that you did and you gave me a broad definition. "Products for professional institutions". What does that mean?
. . . You aren't a real estate person, are you?
No. Manufacturing of products.
DOnt feed the TROLLS!!!!!!
good for you now pay your fair share...not everybody is as materialistic as you seem to be..
If you and I pay the same, that's fair, right? Or do you have another definition for fair? The more I buy, the better the economy does.
Does that stuff get buried with you? Let me know when you go down.
Wow
How can I let you know when I die? I'll do my best. I'm tired from working all weekend. Maybe that will lead to something. Hate is not good. Spread the message. I don't hate you. Understand your capabilities, then capitalize on them! Go get em tiger.
Yeah. Sure. A multimillionaire is on this website at midnight, taking time out to post about his homes and cars. That makes sense.
My success story is calling bullshit when I see it.
Love your poetic handle. I'm having fun communicating my thoughts and understanding others. This has been very rewarding for me. I've turned some of my thoughts in favor of the 99%. Hopefully my ideals have transferred to others as well. I feel like I have bonded with some not like minded people.
Why don't you get a Job for $7.25 and try to survive!!
A.....I'm to smart.
except you use the wrong form of the word too.
And to think I make a little more than $7.25. Adults don't work for $7.25 unless they are on drugs.
that is quite possibly the most absurd thing I have ever heard. Of all of the people in America millions and millions working at or around minimum wage your believe that all of these people are drug users?
Or in high school. I've never seen a grown man or woman flipping burgers.
I've never seen Australia. That doesn't mean it doesn't exist.
I'm just glad you've never seen an adult flipping burgers. How much should the French fry guy make?
That is the problem that you can't seem to understand. The manufacturing base is gone. Those were America's good paying jobs. Now we have a service economy. These jobs pay a lot less. The Bureau of Labor Statistics said the jobs that are being added in America today are in the $8-12 range.
If only working hard was really the way to wealth. I'm speaking for all the single ladies who work two or three jobs, seven days a week, and barely eek out enough to be above the poverty line. Hard work and even education doesn't get everyone in the top 1 percent, or even out of poverty. It takes a certain amount of privilege along with the hard work, privilege that includes access to high quality education, financial legs up, and opportunities to advance, among other things. This kind of privilege simply isn't available to countless Americans who are as American, as hard working, and as invested in the workings of capitalism as you. The unequal playing field referred to often in this protest refers to the fact that you and I may have similar education and skills, take similar risk, and it will pay off for you and not for me for reasons that have nothing to do with luck. It's the foundation of American society that allows a certain elite to succeed and the rest to just do all right at best, that has almost nothing to do with hard work and risk taking, after all.
Probably not to far from the truth. Think of money like grades. If you study your ass off, chances are, you'll make good grades.
HAHAHAHAAAAA! You think that qualifies you to be in the top 1%? Thats top 35% at best, pal. The top 1% own more money than you would be able to count in your life-time.
Try several trillion dollars...
Wow. I didn't know that. Trillions, huh. Same amount my country is in debt.....
Great piece of video from Occupy PIttsburgh today.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uYkGjhc6-kc
Were the fecal guys there.
What was great?
Many more people will come to your side when you are proactive (for “new” Business & Government solutions), instead of reactive (against “old” Business & Government solutions), which is why what we most immediately need is a comprehensive “new” strategy that implements all our various socioeconomic demands at the same time, regardless of party, and although I'm all in favor of taking down today's ineffective and inefficient Top 10% Management System of Business & Government, there's only one way to do it – by fighting bankers as bankers ourselves; that is, using a Focused Direct Democracy organized according to our current Occupations & Generations. Consequently, I have posted a 1-page Summary of the Strategically Weighted Policies, Organizational Operating Structures, and Tactical Investment Procedures necessary to do this at:
http://getsatisfaction.com/americanselect/topics/on_strategic_legal_policy_organizational_operational_structures_tactical_investment_procedures
Join
http://finance.groups.yahoo.com/group/StrategicInternationalSystems/
because we need 100,000 “support clicks” at AmericansElect.org to support a Presidential Candidate -- such as any given political opportunist you'd like to draft -- in support of the above bank-focused platform.
Most importantly, remember, as cited in the first link, that as Bank Owner-Voters in your 1 of 48 "new" Business Investment Groups (or "new" Congressional Committees) you become the "new" Congress replacing the "old" Congress according to your current Occupation & Generation, called a Focused Direct Democracy.
Therefore, any Candidate (or Leader) therein, regardless of party, is a straw man, a puppet; it's the STRATEGY – the sequence of steps – that the people organize themselves under, in Military Internet Formation of their Individual Purchasing & Group Investment Power, that's important. In this, sequence is key.
Why? Because there are Natural Social Laws – in mathematical sequence – that are just like Natural Physical Laws, such as the Law of Gravity. You must follow those Natural Social Laws or the result will be Injustice, War, etc.
The FIRST step in Natural Social Law is to CONTROL the Banks as Bank Owner-Voters. If you do not, you will inevitably be UNJUSTLY EXPLOITED by the Top 10% Management Group of Business & Government who have a Legitimate Profit Motive, just like you, to do so.
Consequently, you have no choice but to become Candidates (or Leaders) yourselves as Bank Owner-Voters according to your current Occupation & Generation.
So please JOIN the 2nd link so we can make our support clicks at AmericansElect.org when called for, at exactly the right time, by an e-mail from that group, in support of the above the bank-focused platform. If so, then you will see and feel how your goals can be accomplished within the above strategy as a “new” Candidate (or Leader) of your current Occupation & Generation.
Start a bank, guarantee my money, and I'll make a deposit.
Will do. Posted a revised draft in response to questions from the group at: http://getsatisfaction.com/americanselect/topics/on_strategically_weighted_policies_organizational_operating_structures_tactical_investment_procedures
What's the banks name?
See link getsatisfaction above.
Save me the time.
I love you, but obviously no one has taught you to READ and THINK critically (about the 1st link above) before you respond LOGICALLY. Bye.
How is the bank coming?
More and more people joining everyday; come join us?
Ok, I hpoe your making lots of money!
Sorry. Why are you treatIng your customers so harshly? :)
1% guy, it is not as if there are not legit complaints; the most obvious is education. my dad could work an entry level job, go to school for accounting, and graduate debt free. i can go to the same school for accounting, work the same entry level job, and graduate with a ton of debt. so what happened? why has the cost of school inflated faster than everything else, including health care? is the program sooo much better now, or is there some other kind of problem?
my problem with OWS is that their answer is usually "i don't know" / "greed" and they want "free" european schooling, when the real answer is the way the government has funded and guaranteed loans and allowed a bubble in education to grow, with that being the problem we should fix.
either way, it's moronic to deny there is a problem.
I agree. Your problem is student debt and that is a shame. But I was a bad student. Your degree is not worth the money you pay for it.
I'm happy for you, F, and I like your spunk.
It's amazing how many of these people just don't get it.
Just trading thoughts and ideas.
If the government passes legislation (Bush tax cuts) to meet a particular goal (job creation), and after a decade it clearly did not meet expectations, in fact all it did was add to the national debt then why not get rid of the legislation?
We need to lower taxes.
We don't want to punish wealth. Under the old tax code (Clinton Era) wealthy people weren't an endangered species, we only feel that increasingly those with money have an unfair advantage in the political arena and we seek to bring back balance.
Using their connections and political capital they managed to get tax codes passed that unequivocally benefited themselves while helping to accumulate record national debt levels.
There should be more people with your view. Welcome to my post, please stick around. Good people here. I've learned a lot.
I own (3) million dollar homes, have 6 cars, 7 atv's, two trailers and two boats. Guess what, I didn't have to work or take any risks at all. I simply sold a bunch of junk derivatives to unsuspecting investors who thought they were solid because I paid off Standards & Poor to give them a AAA rating. Then I bought a bunch of credit default swaps against them because I knew they would tank. I also knew that the American taxpayers would have to pay me in the end because if they didn't, then the whole economy would go off the edge of the cliff into a deep depression! I privatized my profit while socializing my risk! I'm so proud of myself! btw, you forgot to mention that you brag about your possessions in order to compensate for your tiny penis - douche bag.
Your right, you are a douche bag and should be in jail. And I think my penis is too small and under used.
Good for you, but it's juvenile to brag about how rich you are. Just thank God for your blessings. It's not about the wealth itself, it's about how some people selfishly use their wealth to influence our government officials at the expense of honest Americans. It's also about the government officials who corruptly allow wealthy individuals and corporations to influence our laws and regulations.
I agree with you 100%. as stated many times here, I was making a jerk statement to get folks in here. Wish I had phrased it better, much better.
I understand. No problem.
Stick around I'm learning more and more about this movement.
Its important to note that not everybody can afford to take risks, and not everybody who takes risks lucks out. Historically, many, many geniuses and talented individuals have died in poverty.
No they can't. Looking back I was dumb to put my business before my family. But, we are better off that I did.
Which politician did you purchase?
I voted for Obama and contributed to his war chest! Never again!
That's awesome good work.
Thanks?
After reading FObama's reply's I find it hard to believe he is who he claims to be. I reluctantly admit that based on what he says I have considerably more wealth than he does and my personal experience was that when I reached a certain point in my wealth I was no longer proud rather very uncomfortable sometimes even ashamed . I worked and came by it honest but I didn't work any harder than someone in a minimum wage job and I am no more honest than the next guy things just fell together for me. And when I listen to other people in my economic group nearly all of us agree we all had one big stroke of luck or someone (one good connection) helped us. When I see someone in a low paying job I think that could have been me if things would have been a little different. I don't think most people even know what a 1%er is. If FObama is who he claims he is crass I have only met a couple of people in my economic class that wanted to rub it in someones face, but you find assholes in every walk of life. I am a 99% and I am proud of it. If I was a 1% I would run and hide my disgusting self. Or probably give it away.
How many times are you going to post here?
Rothchild is a 1% his net worth 300 trillion. The 1%ers wouldn't let you walk there dog. Your ego might be struggling with it, but trust me your a 99%er. Your getting walked on like the rest of us. I am not here to fight capitalism but rather corruption.
Will you vote for Cain?
I bet your retired and using medicare. Medicare is a a social program subsidized by the governmwnt. If you actually had to pay your own health insurance it would be in neigborhood of 2000 to 3000 a month. Thank your lucky stars I help pay for it,
I bet your retired and using medicare. Medicare is a a social program subsidized by the governmwnt. If you actually had to pay your own health insurance it would be in neigborhood of 2000 to 3000 a month. Thank your lucky stars I help pay for it,
I'm 45. Never assume, right.
Dude your not a 1%er do you even know what a 1%er is?
Please do some research on socialism.
Are you for socialism?
i'm for people and for human rights - makes me a socialist, communist? then YES.
Since you don't approve of America, what is your model country?
did i say i dont approve America? please show me where? I dont approve a system that forces people into a choice: either become a filthy rat like u or die from hunger. But there are much more choices than that and i chose alternative!
Cool...u live in all of them? and drive all thos cars at the same time? I wonder how u feel when u hear (do u hear?) that there are people struggling, that people are left without options? U got there, sure u did, losing the last that was left from ur consciuos. A person that values love, care, frienship, life does not own (2) million dollar homes, have five cars, 6 atv's, a trailer and a boat. And sorry for the personal insult but: what are u without ur goods, dear?
I feel for those who struggle. Don't give up.
Work??? What does that mean? I worked 60hrs this week and I am still part of this movement.
If you earned it your not part of the corruption that is being fought here. I think you will proudly join this movement as you get additional info.
Maybe. But I'm not being convinced yet. Just being hated.
I think you are felling a lot of hate because you come off like an asshole. I don't hate you I just think you lack social skill. I pointed out to you and I notice others have pointed out to you that you are not part of the 1%, so why haven't amended your original post?
Can I? I was being a dick on purpose to provoke debate. Some here are more serious than others.
You never debated me when I called you out. I wrote: After reading FObama's reply's I find it hard to believe he is who he claims to be. I reluctantly admit that based on what he says I have considerably more wealth than he does and my personal experience was that when I reached a certain point in my wealth I was no longer proud rather very uncomfortable sometimes even ashamed . I worked and came by it honest but I didn't work any harder than someone in a minimum wage job and I am no more honest than the next guy. Things just fell together for me. And when I listen to other people in my economic group nearly all of us agree we all had one big stroke of luck or someone (one good connection) helped us. When I see someone in a low paying job I think that could have been me if things would have been a little different. I don't think most people even know what a 1%er is, obviously FObama doesn't. If FObama is who he claims he is (a guy, way south of 5 million) he should be able to afford some etiquette lessons. I have only met a couple of people in my economic class that wanted to rub it in someones face, but you find assholes in every walk of life. I am a 99% and I am proud of it. If I was a 1% I would run and hide my disgusting self. Or probably give it away.
You'd give it away? Ha ha ha ha. Please leave.
Yea give it away. I gave away enough to buy one of your houses last year alone.
Sorry for the shameless plug, but I write about this very subject. Check it out when you have a chance!
http://thepoliholic.blogspot.com/
You are hardly the one percent. Just check the stats. You are a slave.
I'm not. Thanks for trying though. I am the president and CEO of the business I started.
haha, I am also the President and CEO of a successful 14 year old software company. I make plenty as well. You are not the 1%.
Your a slave? For who? You do things you don't want to do. Sorry to hear it.
Dont kid yourself you're the 1% who got lucky, if hard work was all it takes your janitor would have you beat.
Did you give up.
My janitor is a great man and well paid. He is free to start a janitorial business of his own. Creativity my brother, creativity!
lol, do all have to businessman now? What about people that have other auims in life, self-realization, development. That sounds so strange u claim that ur head of some business and u don't even consider that there might be other jobs, other directions in life, apart from "opening a business"? Regarding ur "way" of rich life, one question - how honest and how actually "fair" u got to where u r? - i honestly don't need the answer? im just advising u to revise the question a bit, what u did to get there, how u got there and how much of wat u did was actually honest,fair, moral and "human-friendly" - if as u say u "feel for others".
My truthful answer is of no use to you, you are a very bitter person. You wouldn't feel any better if I said my Janitor can start a yoga business. Zanex much?
Did i get this right - we should all become business-people and create business and pull money out of each other, contest and measure who fucked who worse (sorry for my language)? Sounds like a massive dummy factory. Im against dummy factories, theres more than that to each person but that truthful statement is "of no use to you" coz ur bitter? no, coz ur too twisted in the head with a mmodel that has been wonderfully planted in ur head and that gives u no flexibilty and i'm not even mentioning empathy, love and care...a person that is selfish enough to not care about the citizens of his country, the future of his kids, grandkids and so on, is not able to love and care for even the closest people. What r ur kids, grandkids gonna do without ur money? Would u like them to meet up with what modern youth meets up? U ok with that? Misjustice, constant stresss over problems that would've never occured if people's elementary vital rights where respected. U tell me about bitter!
I'm not sure Zanex will help. www.youneedhelp.com
lol...you are a worthless person with a fucked up mind. Really sorry for u.
Me, I'm the 99% norm. Your the out of work 1% protester. That's almost like saying no one agrees with your wacky ways. Is Taty the plural word for tit?
99% norm? wheres is this 99% please show me? coz i see 99% of people struggling, surviving instead of living and pricks like u climbing over peoples head without a slight feeling of guilt, solidarity coz u dont give a damn, ur so about ur own self, about ur own welfare, all u have in life is lame shitty little thing like u covered up in 2 empty houses and cars. you poor thing its all u have. No its a p-lural word for human in fact iut's a name i don't have to hide :)
@FObama
What makes you such a dick? You'd think all that money would make you a better person. What makes you assume all the #occupywallst people are lazy? or losers? or hippies (whatever that may mean to you)? or dirty? or stupid? Or even anti-capitalist for that matter. You make too many assumptions, dude, and you think in stereotypes. Get a grip.
Though you may like to tell yourself you deserve what you have because you worked for it, your "work" isn't what has given you your million-dollar homes. Your living standard comes from a happy combination of a whole slew of factors, most of which have nothing to do with you or your work. It's certainly not something you can claim as a personal accomplishment. So you took risks and they paid off, so what. You think that's an achievement or something? Millions of people take all kinds of risks every day. And most people work at least as hard as you, many lots harder, though they don't have what you do as a result. You think that says something good, or special, about you?
Get this: You have not "earned" what you have, so you should stop congratulating yourself and recognize that what you are is just lucky. Not deserving. Not special. Not better. Not smarter. Not tougher. Not any of that, not any more than millions and millions of other people just like you. What you are is fortunate. So good for you. Not so good for the millions of other less fortunate, very hard working, risk-taking, tough, resilient, independent-minded, smart people all over the place, including Liberty Square.
So drop your high-minded filth-talk and get your head out of your ass. If you can't see that the system is rigged for the few against the many, then you're blind. Or maybe just stupid. Whatever it is, STFU and stay out of the way.
By the way, you're not in the 1%. They own you and your million-dollar homes, just like they own the rest of us.
This guy is obviously an icon for those that benefit from the system (materialistically) but give little back. His right hand is longer than his left due to patting himself on the back. Society needs to be more about the whole than the me. Judging from all the responses he has posted he loves the attention. He must have too much time on his hands!
I'm very proud of what I have accomplished on my own. Thanks for try to shoot me down. I'm sorry your life sucks and you can't see the opportunities in front of you. You my fine sister are the blind one. Focus your rage on being a better person. Not trying to destroy someone's hopes..
You can be as proud as you want. My point is that it doesn't come from just your own work, and it doesn't make you better than other people who don't have what you have. So what makes you think you can put people down who see that there's something wrong with the system? Where do you get off calling people nasty names and making facile, cliche-ridden remarks about opportunity and hard work, when you don't know anything about their opportunities or their hard work?
You also don't know me, so what makes you think my life sucks? or that I can't see opportunities? I have a great life. I live comfortably and happily after many years of working and taking advantage of whatever opportunities came my way, for which I'm grateful. That doesn't mean I can't see that millions of other people haven't be able to do the same. I've been fortunate in many ways. You tell me to be a better person? What do you know about what kind of person I am? And I have no rage. My angry words come from your arrogant assumptions about people whose lives you know nothing about. You need to get out more and see what's all around you.
Do you not see the double standard. It's ok for you to insult me? You called me a dick in your first reply. Albeit you were right, but practice what you preach please!
Who really cares? As he/she admits: they represent 1% of the total population. How can any society survive catering to 1% of the population when 99% are struggling? It did not work during the "Dark Ages" and won't work now. These people are tea-baggers trying to corrupt the movement!
Is your movement over.
Who really cares? As he/she admits: they represent 1% of the total population. How can any society survive catering to 1% of the population when 99% are struggling? It did not work during the "Dark Ages" and won't work now. These people are tea-baggers trying to corrupt the movement!
Would you rather be a tea bagger or a tea baggee? You have more in common with the TP. Just read this site.
As a member of the society that provided for you the opportunity to accumulate such wealth, you're welcome.
America is a wonder place to be. We are all lucky to be here! Too bad many don't want to be here.
well, could you of done it as quickly once we do this?
How we can easily Reform Wall Street: Take away their powers once again.
"We are here Congress because we want to bring BACK the Glass-Steagall Act of 1933 http://www.investopedia.com/articles/03/071603.asp#axzz1aPEc3wX which help saved our country from the Great Depression by preventing investment companies, banks and insurance companies from merging and becoming large brokerage firms; instead of just being Banks and Insurance companies--can't we learn a history lesson here Congress? Btw, why did most of you vote for its repeal in 1999? http://www.counterpunch.org/2008/09/19/shattering-the-glass-steagall-act
Think about where we are now, it all started in 1999 with the subprime loans Senator Phil Gramm was peaching on Senate floor. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gKQOxr2wBZQ&feature=related
Furthermore, we also want you to CHANGE the Commodities Future Modernization Act of 2000 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commodity_Futures_Modernization_Act_of_2000 BACK to where it was before 2000, which since has deregulated energy markets and has allowed for such scams as The Enron Loophole; whereas in the early 2000's Enron Corp. was charging 400 bucks plus for a kilowatt hour...They all when to jail for this. But, the Enron loophole is still not closed, for example, allowing speculators to resell barrels of oil over and over again before it reaches the gas station owner. It's basically, legal gambling at our expense. What were those lawmakers thinking then? What are you thinking now? Either do the right think, or you're part of the 1%."
Why are oil prices high? The Enron Loophole
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zbdtTGYQBMU&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PNp0y0SjOkY&feature=related
Rolling Stones Reporter: Truth about Goldman Sachs--how they have cornered the markets--basically, The Enron Loophole and the Repeal of Glass-Steagall Act in 1999. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=waL5UxScgUw
Hijacker!
just trying to find some focus here for the haves and have nots
Find it, or post it.
How did you earn it?
I've already posted it, read the replies.
Congratulations. I live a comfortable lifestyle too.
However, that does nothing to compensate me for my lack of fair and equal representation in our government.
I agree. I will never help fund a campaign again. I got screwed by Obama.
Neither should any of us fund a campaign. Campaigns should be publicly funded - we should all fund it equally through taxes. So that we all get fair and equal representation! 1% buys their representation, 99% are left with the scraps. Even those of us fortunate enough to have comfortable lifestyles. 99% of us cannot compete against the BIG monied influence in government. Money speaks too loudly in our government. The problem is the political system that allows this. We need to fix the politcal system to get the money out with serious Election Reform.
I'm with you 100%. thanks for adding value to this thread.
i doubt you own jack sh!t. deep down you hate rich folks too. thats why possessions are your sticking point. the truth is, most wealthy people are very nice and quite concerned with whats going on. they just never had the motivation to change it. you, you are probably middle management striving to be part of the 1%. you are in the category of the highest foreclosures. the guy that shorts peoples hours for your tiny little bonus, and really thinks they have something because they are in charge. but what your boss didn't tell you is that it's an illusion. work to compensation, managers make less than their employees. you just feel special.
Sorry to disappoint you, but your wrong. Enjoyed your pathetic rant. I don't fault you for asking me "would you like fries with that". We need people like you.
actually i cook in the back, never see customers. also build website management software. want a website? http://richardkentgates.com
proof of who i am, your turn? but i'm sure you'll just reply with distractions and mouthiness. thats a liars defense.
Way to use this site to advertise! What a cock sucker!
oh, what you're uber-capitalist till you see capitalism in action? poser.
Your the poser. I could plug my website, but wouldn't. This is not the place. Please be more sensitive.
your name is f**k obama and you want me to be sensitive, lmao... whatever homie.
I no longer support him. I'm pissed and he wasted the money I gave him.
You are not the 1%, my grandmother in law has a household name. 4th generation not employed in the family business. She has five houses. Many millions and she isn't 1%. I admire your hard work. This is a great country, but you are mistaken, Unless your holdings top about 37.7 million.
Thanks
Money is like manure. It starts to stink unless it is spread around.
That's why I buy lots of toys and don't clean my pool or cut my grass. I'm spreading my money around.
You're not a one percent idiot. You're just a wealthy American I'm happy for you. You're one of us fool. If you are counting your possessions you're not even close. When you own congress and have multinational corporations that pay slave wages in the third world you might be one of them. Till then I suggest you get an education because you're defending people who don't give a shit about you. They're draining your wealth as well your just too stupid to realize it. Don't forget to eat your GMO veggies and high fructose corn syrup drink.
God I would love to see a picture of your tattoo'd ugly mug.
Loser
That's what I'm guessing you'd look like. Thanks for the description and saving us the distraction of your hippie attire and bong stained face.
I love internet muscles. Everyone is a badass over the internet. Not only are you an idiot for thinking you are an elite you are also a coward. I can't imagine a man bragging that he has two "million dollar" homes 5 cars and 6 fucking ATVs and believes that he is one of the Elite being protested! LOL! You actually included your ATVs!! You have got to be kidding me! What a loser. LOL! Did you run out of shit to list? You're a breath away from broke you stupid fuck.
Are you eating melons?
Thanks Steve. I was being a dick on purpose to provoke debate. With over 500 replys it worked. Some pretty mature debates going on in here. Stick around and make it 1000!
You are a TRULY DEDICATED consumer. We need more like you.
Many freaks on here.
http://www.google.com/imgres?q=can%27t+tell+if+trolling+or+just+stupid&um=1&hl=en&sa=N&biw=1338&bih=929&tbm=isch&tbnid=vs26dcKcJWniTM:&imgrefurl=http://memegenerator.net/instance/9135926&docid=dkHiVWlM3TwhZM&imgurl=http://images.memegenerator.net/instances/260x260/9140055.jpg&w=260&h=260&ei=kKSZTtPkEMTKsQKW0qSzBA&zoom=1
Hairy armpits?
Hello
How do the rich think they can sustain "their" wealth when we get to the point when nobody can afford to buy their goods ? There's supposed to be a "balance" so that Capitalism can work.
A dip in the economy is just that. Tighten the belt, reduce overhead and work smarter.
reduce overhead....fire employees you mean....
Have you been butt raped yet?
I didn't have to do that, but those are tuff decisions owners have to make. Life is not a fairy tale.
I lost 1.82 million in risky investments. I only paid myself $311,000 for the year of work I performed making those failing investments with my investors money. Now I want everyone else to pay me back the money I lost so I can make more risky investments with the money they will give me!!!
I lost 1.82 million in risky investments. I only paid myself $311,000 for the year of work I performed making those failing investments with my investors money. Now I want everyone else to pay me back the money I lost so I can make more risky investments with the money they will give me!!!
Choose your investors wisely, too many dick heads like this guy!
You don't seem to care about anybody but yourself. Regarding "risks" that you are so proud of taking, consider this. When the super rich take "risks" and go bankrupt (GM, Trump, owners of "zombie" banks with toxic assets,...), they continue to live in mansions and in luxury, while others are foreclosed, homeless, unemployed or underemployed and often forced to choose between food for their children and badly needed medicine.
Please read "Thinking about Revolution" at www.NewDemocracyWorld.org. Thank you.
Not true "Anal Beads". That is your other screen name. I'm on to you jelly boy, or girl. Never screwed anyone over, wrong thread for your agenda anal beads, sorry.
You long for!
Long what?
a whanabe 1% - The 1% has an income of ten times the national GDP. If you do make this kind of salary you must either be a banker, day-trader manager or a bogus fund manager. I’ll bet that you'll choose; none the above.
You are correct. Go buy a lottery ticket. I'm none of the above and that's not my line of work. Well played.....Fail.
Ok, but don’t give-up dreaming. Hope is the last refuge. :-)
It all starts with a dream. The American dream!
My wife and I have done well, too. Not as well as you, but my concerns are about wanting my vote to count. I do not beleive that those the most weath should have a louder voice than anyone else. That is not in the best long term interest of our survival as a nation.
I made the mistake of supporting Obama last year with campaign funds. I realize iI made a mistake and I will never support another candidate with money again. Obama is more corrupt than Bush could ever dream to be. Vote smarter than I did please.
I think it's luck when you're born with intelligence, education, wealth, or the social network to succeed. But there are people out there that just fell through the cracks. Or they just weren't born with what our society deems profitable. It's too bad. But does that mean they should not have basic healthcare and opportunities to for an education?
Have you changed your thoughts?
Luck still plays a part in everyone's life. Some people are lucky with opportunities. Some people get hit by drunk drivers. Do we say hey, you shouldn't have been driving in the first place? No we want to be progressive and help people. Compassion is rooted in giving to those who need help. If you don't have those principles than that's something you have to live with.
You strayed. We do have free education, k-12. Free healthcare too. What else are you looking for?
Free healthcare? I don't think so. You're screwed without health insurance and you go bankrupt.
Dad was a bartender, mom was a seamstress.
I am happy for you! I admire anyone who had the dream and the tenacity to see it through & you are entitled to your homes and your toys. But America has always been built on the backs of the middle class and what the big banks, CEO's, hedgefund managers and most of the Republican Party don't understand is that they have been squeezing the middle class for almost 40 years and there is nothing less. The middle class is now disappearing very rapidly. It comes down to greed. Wall Street was having sooo much fun trading stocks and making money was only so much to go around so they looked around and found out that alot of business' had large retirement moneys just sitting safe in a bank. Those account used to be sacred. Business could not even put them in their assets because they belonged to the workers and the retirees. Now they are in the hands of hedge fund managers & now you have people retireing on a lot less than they had planned for.
Shake the money loose for jobs in this country. Close those loop-holes and, raise taxes on anyone making 250,000. a year. Have 4 cars & 4 atv's, Put the banking regulations of Roosevelts New Deal back into practice. Learn from history because we have no cake to eat and some times no bread. Keep your middle class happy so they can afford 1 house, a couple cars & have enough left over to put in their kids college fund and you will have a healthy economy so you can make more money.
Bad, bad idea. Shame on you. That's stealing and I would protest against you then.
This movement is not to end free markets. It is to restore the ability for upward economic mobility in America.
the problem with the free market is that is not free...it comes at a cost...human cost...this is what we are seeing now...the free market (neoliberalism) is an experiment...and one that has sensationally failed...it needs to be brought to a close...
Quit taking from those who earn
If you took a risk, and the risk did not pay off, would you ask me to pay for it? Because that is exactly what the banks did. Then, after they crashed the economy, they foreclosed on the people who could not make payments because of the economy they crashed. I am not against capitalism. But if I took a risk and it flopped I would not expect you to pay for it. I would take responsibility for it and learn my lesson. Now the banks preach that message to those they foreclosed on, though they took a forced hand out from every American citizen. That s why I am outraged, as you should be too.
That rant made no sense?
Mmm... The way banks make money is by lending money. That is their risk. As the banks lent out more money, they took more risks to make even more money. But when they lent out all that money, it date unintended consequence of inflating the economy by adding dollars based off of credit into the market. As the dollar decreased in value, wages stayed stagnate. This meant that yourverningswere actually falling, as the dollar lost is value. This caused the and loans to become toxic because their borrowers could no longer beat out inflation, this not be able o make the payments. The banks took a risk, and the risk failed.
This is no difference than if you or i take a risk. Let us say we take out a loan to startba business. We also invest our own money. Now let's say the business venture fails. Then we loose our investment. Now, let us say the government forces the bank to bail us out. That would be some commie bullshit, right? So, why isn't it some commie bullshit when we, the taxpayers have to bail them out?
Is this better?
Your right! Protest the assholes who made this mess, the white house and the Capitol. Obama screwed us over.
Willfully ignorant, truly a bottom of the barrel loser. LOL! Anyone who doesn't research his opposition has already lost. No more replies to you. You're probably a 17 year old.
Steve, you seem like a genuine honest guy with brilliant ideas. Were you the protester who crapped in his hand and threw it at the cops?
Are you a fucking idiot. The house of cards came down before that puppet won the election. Do you still believe presidents really run the country? How do you run a business with a 3rd grade education
I'm not the brightest one here, by far. But I have a good idea that the problem is Washington.
I'll make it easy for you Check this out:
http://youtu.be/AzULm4d8h8w
Were you the guy crapped in your hands at the park?
I'll skip it, but thanks. Can you summarize it for me. Cliff notes?
I want to protest all aspects of it. The federal government; the banking system, and, yes, wall street. And not all of wall street. Just the 1% that created this mess.
Keep it alive!
Thats Awesome dude, I just hope you paid the people that worked for you in a way so that you weren't he only one who got rich. As I build my company, I plan and believe I will only feel successful if I end up with my whole team doing well and making more money than they ever have before and more than they would have if they had not joined our team. I have made a good amount of money but I plan to take my team up with me as I know they are taking me up with them. I will not pay myself more than 40times what our average workers make which still allows me to make as much money as I want but it insures that everyone in the company benefits from it's success and if they aren't worth paying more, then they shouldn't be in the company!
How much does your sweep up guy make in your pretend company?
Notice how FObama asks me about my "pretend company" because in his world he can't believe that someone like me actually owns a company since I do not agree with him and think that I should pay my employees as little as I can get away with and take all the profits for myself because I am entitled to. Oh by the way FObama, you asked how much our sweep up person makes...Why? Would you like to Apply for the position?
You are simply the next target for what has been referred to as the "tapeworm" or the "upward vortex" that is the U.S economy. You are among those of us that are most deceived.
Really, how so?
You settled. I am sorry to tell you that you are not part of the problem, nor are you part of the 1%.
this is purposely offensive fiction
I actually have more, just didn't want to post it.
I don't care if people get rich, I just get pissed when they buy my Senator or Representative with their money. If elections were not purchased, I don't think you would see OWS. By the way, if we had no government, laws, and regulations, some bad ass would have already come and taken what you have. You have benefited by the country around you. You should pay the same rate on your capital gains as I pay on my labor.
No I shouldn't. Capital risks fuel the economy. I will quit investing in other businesses if that tax law ever changes.
Wow! All this investing in businesses and taking capital risks has really fueled a great economy! Ideology aside, the trend in wealth flow to the top is unsustainable. You "investors" will get crushed by the greed in the long run. I'm tired of subsidizing unearned income (capital gains). If you think your subsidized lower tax rate on capital gains is good for everybody, we're done talking. If we manage to get the money out of politics, the people will put an end to that ridiculous policy. Change your ID to "greedy".
Didn't go to business school did you?
So that's your answer to the problems... everybody go to business school and invest instead of work? Good one.
Your gonna have to do what you have to do. I can't make your learn this in a few posts.
Look, I'm 60 years old. I've worked for 39 years and never took a handout. I have planned for my retirement and don't need any help. Unlike you I do have a heart and realize most people out there do want to work and contribute but can't because there are fewer jobs than there are people that want them. I have several friends who are busting their asses trying to find one. I haven't been to business school but I've read both Keynes and Friedman. I don't need a college professor from one side of that argument to tell me what I can figure out myself. U.S. economic historical data does not support supply side economics. It has never worked and never will. It will always cause a diverging wealth gap that is unsustainable and will lead to instability and revolt if taken far enough. If you want to instruct me, explain why the biggest economic boom and the first projected budget surplus were both during times when we had higher tax rates on the wealthy and a smaller wealth income gap?
Fluke. Times were good under Bush for awhile until 9/11 and Barney Frank got in bed with Freddie and Fannie.
This is a really hard concept for peeps to understand.
People don't understand where money comes from. They think we should just keep printing it.
Guess what...I know MANY people who are working for it and not getting it.
Getting wealth? If so, do something different. Use the time wasted here to be more productive.
And luck. Capital much?
Que?
you said "chalk it up to capitalism" to which I added "and luck" Capital much? is a bit of a satirical play on words suggesting that you had capital to begin with.
I hope that you are doing some good with your cash. Does it somehow help you compensate for other shortcomings? If not, then why the idol displays of superiority?
Do you like this haiku? no one replied when I posted it:( Elusive is joy. Focus. Magnify. Repeat. Can you see it yet?
Sweat equity the 1st year. With my cash I'm investing in me. Can you say the same about you?
1 year of 'sweat equity and now you're deservedly "rollin in it"? Investing in me? What does that mean. I have chosen to serve others through my "job", which I would willingly do for free but for the realities of the monetary system, volunteering and living simply. I retract my comment about you being lucky. If you're for real, I in fact feel very sorry for you, for in spite of your "comfortable" position you have chosen to turn a blind eye to reality in order to satisfy your need to fill a very empty place in your life. Americans sacrifice and innocents are slaughtered to provide you with the fuel to run your toys and heat your mansions and yet you seem not to have a drop of humility or thankfulness about you. It is for you that the world suffers. For that, I hope that some day you will see the consequences of your ways. And let me make clear that I don't hate "rich" people. I hate narcissistic, closed minded, waste, of which you seem to fit, as evidenced by your inability to so much as comment on the poem that wasn't about you. Most narcissists are in strict, lasting denial. have you considered that you may be one?
Don't be hating. Green does not look good on you.
I can't give you a day by day play of my life ass wipe.
So what else is new.
Happy to hear that you earned your lifestyle thru hardwork and not by cheating. Glad to have you in the Movement.
More like a bowel movement. Lots of shit everywhere!
Would never cheat. You remember that you can't legislate prosperity.
It seems to have worked for some corporations. ;)
Possibly. If so, they better pay for their crimes. We need whistle blowers to step forward. Where are they?
Legislation to protect whistleblowers keeps getting shot down due to politicians being in the pocket of lobbyists.
So we should be protesting in Washinton then, right?
Not all of us can travel to washington. Some of us are located in places like Portland, New York, etc. By protesting where we live, we can drum up more attention to problems like these.
Your right. Keep it simple. Thanks!
Sorry fob-ama. The bank doesn't even consider you a high net worth individual if you have less than $25m in invest able assets. That means not including your home.
I'm working on it.
Hey, me too. But there does have to be a ladder to climb and decent jobs and low unemployment provide aggregate demand.
No their doesn't. Believe that and you'll never succeed.
Sorry dude. Already believe it, already succeeding.
Don't apologize. Embrace your success.
By the way. I am not in the 1% club, but I certainly don't begrudge the people who are. They earned it. I am a regular guy who earns a regular paycheck just trying to make my way in the world. However, I am grateful for the 1% who take risks and win big in business. Their success provides a paycheck for the millions of people who work for them. Their success pays for my mortgage, my car and a decent life for my family. Heaven forbid any of you have to work for one of them. Don't give me the "I got fired and can't find a job" crap. Hell, there are people coming across the borders who can't speak a lick of English and have nothing when they get here. Yet somehow they find jobs. I find it ironic that countries moving towards capitalism hold economies that are on the rise and countries moving towards socialism are in decline...hmm. I wonder why that is. Think about it.
You got it. Not everyone owns a business. I have the greatest employees. They are my extended family. I would do anything for them, and they know it.
You are a fraud. Your not even close to the !%. Delusional is what you are you would need 100 times your current net worth or more to get close. I think you "took" to much adderall.Troll! You made the list.
Teabag, your the biggest troll on here. Why do you waste everyone's time?
Shut up
I work for a member of your illustrious CLUB! I made him at least one of the millions he controls!
My thanks...trickle dick economics is every benefit I had 12 + years ago has been taken away. SPIT ON YOU AND YOURS! SINCERELY Alleric X M A Experience POOR before you go!
Very bitter. Try again but this time, smarter and harder.
What did you do to "earn it" you like to brag???
Worked for a big corporation. Saw a better way to better serve a customers needs and started a company. Took out multiple loans (still owe a few millions), and with hard work and a good crew I've succeeded.
Sounds like you are owned by banks??? I got more money then you. You own a lot of debt. The guy begging for change on the street corner has more money then you?? You own nothing... The bank holding your note does lol.
I'm paying them down. Three more years to go. No risk, no reward. Do you think there are business fairies?
If you don't mind me asking what does your business net.
I mind
Lol good luck on your business and take care of your employees. If more big business and people did what was right we wouldn't need taxes or legislation. But sadly that don't happen. Hope the best for u if treat ppl right hope you go bankrupt if u don't. Don't be greedy. And just because you clear a couple million doesn't make you the one percent. A couple million a year is chump change honestly( more then I make) but honestly not so much money you can buy off government. But anyway good luck and if you are successful don't forget the workers who helped get you there.
The people who work with me are more valuable then the money we make together. No them, no me. None of them are protesting.
Success: I heard a point of view counter to my own today, and had a moment of epiphany, of true empathy, where I understood what the other person's perspective was. I suddenly understood their reasons for being the way they were, though it was not like my own perspective. I came away with a greater perspective of the whole, for free.
Dumb fuck says what......
Aww shucks, you didn't have to, but since you insist. kisses FObama on the forehead, pats on back You should try dancing more often.
Would you like to dance, ma'am?
curls the eyelashes, pulls up the pantyhose, straps on the... the extra character Why thank you, darlin'! I'd be happy to.
If Capitalism was so great, How come only one percent are making it???? BTW, I'm also in the 1%. I would like to say I earned all my money, but that's would be too easy and too simplistic. I know there are a lot of hidden forces besides my personal capabilities. I'm not trying to discredit my own contribution. I know that some people are just good at business and making money naturally, but remember, there are many poor people that are naturally capable of making money too.
Prove what you believe by giving more money to the government, since you obviously don't deserve any of it.
I don’t think this is really capitalism. True capitalism is the only option for America.
you have had true capitalism since Reagan....and you think this is working for you now!!!!!
And no one is stopping them. Congrats on your success. Don't sell yourself short.
Ask yourself why you failed. It's not to late though. That's the beauty of our system.
If you built those homes or otherwise worked with your own hands, then you worked for it. If you made your money with your mouth, we worked for it and you conned us out of it. Only a fool believes one can get rich by its own hard work. You can only get rich if we work for you. That's not your work. It's ours! . . . You freaking rich parasite.
http://www.agkaiser.org/posts-2011/Where-Is-the-Money.pdf
http://www.agkaiser.org/endgame/HowDoesThatWork.pdf
Let me make sure I understand your Fairy Tale: I borrow money to open a candy store, leverage my home, car, bank account and my wife's wedding ring. I hire you to help with the cash register while I contact suppliers and advertisers. Business starts to pick up and after the 2nd year I earn $90000. I increase your pay from $15/hr to $16/hr. That's the norm. Sounds like your fairy tale would have you making $45000?
You're projecting your fairy tale onto your victims. The candy store does no work itself. You hire others to perform the non work service. You make money from money and raise prices. All such usury is detrimental to the community that produces and consumes the products. Banking, trade and merchantilism are secondary and usurious. If they're needed at all they must be done on a non profit basis to minimize their cost to us. Your profit is our loss. You do no work. Others work for you.
OMG, what! Do you hear yourself. You Mam are in the wrong country. Cuba is calling your name. OMG has to be said again.
Your incredulity is no answer. But, in my 65 years, I've never known cons to engage the truth. It's not conducive to your treacherous scams. You're consistent dishonesty is the steadiest thing about you.
Dishonest, where. I may be ugly, bald and a tad over weight, but not dishonest. Your Fairy Tale would never work. What country with your economic view would you like for us to adopt?
The original point that you're so desperately running away from is that the 1% do no work. The rest of us work for you. If you had courage and brains enough to face that truth, you wouldn't have to be so evasive and this thread wouldn't be so frayed.
I've answered just about every question thrown at me. I asked what country best supports your views. I work very hard. Because I don't break a sweat while doing somehow I'm bad. Does it make you feel better that I don't sleep sometimes because I worry about my employees futures during the down months.
Grats bro, enjoy your tax hikes.
There won't be any, so no worries. I'm waiting on the breaks to hire a few more people.
why should you, the great capitalist, rely on federal (public) tax exemptions to hire more people...you continually say you have millions....use it!!!!!
The money I pay the government is mine? Please don't lose that concept.
kind of funny, unemployed hippies protest to get the government to take more of your money, so that they can get welfare instead of you hiring them
Don't worry, I'm not hiring them. Wonder why there aren't any 1st generation Americans protesting. Only lazy 2nd plusers.
oh, poor guys...such victims to live in the greatest country in the world. How about you all stop being the "my neighbor has a BMW; I want one too...and I want the taxpayers to pay for it" guy. You want a BMW. Get off your lazy @$$, take a shower, shave and stop squatting on public property. Try breaking a sweat for something other than throwing a tantrum like a kid and start looking for a job. Oh, and by the way...your approval rating amongst the nation...37% and dropping by the day. Looks like your hippie movement is fading, not gaining in strength.
You got it. You seem like a proud American. Good on ya!
I get tired of people playing the "I am a victim" card.
Good for you man! These lazy, untalented people are just trying to bring hard working, successful people down. Jealousy is a curse and envy is a sin.
You're hilarious and extremely ignorant of the situation.
What hard work do you do??
I work in a warehouse at the moment.
You make millions in a warehouse??? I'm pretty sure this is a movement against banks who took bailout money( which raised your taxes) and pocketed it. Instead of using it to fix the economy. Not against warehouse workers who pay there share of taxes.
Hey smart guy. The money that Bush gave to those big banks has been paid back in full...including all the interest. I don't like money funneled to these banks either, but at least I know enough to get my facts straight. You should try it sometime, then you won't sound so ignorant.
No it hasn't been paid back
Well I'm the manager but it's still not big dollars. I'm happy to pay taxes, I worked hard my whole life and am willing to step up and serve my country if they need me. I'm sick of the laziness and dependence of Americans these days, blaming everybody else except themselves.
How is wanting descent and fair employment lazy?
Because it's out there, but you have to be willing to lower your standards. I lost my managerial job 5 years ago and then worked as a cleaner/laborer for 2 years before I eventually got a similar position again. If you make bad decisions your whole life don't expect sympathy when shit hits the fan.
I do work! But should I be a slave??? At what point should I start whining. When the government sells my daughter to china to bail out bank of America again. Honestly I make more money on my current job but I hate it. But my other job was cut due to tax cuts and I don't want to move from my family. And if its so easy why don't you give up your job? I'm sure there are hundreds more qualified and will do it cheaper. You go find one of these plentiful jobs??
True American! No whining from this man. God bless you bro.
Thanks. Figured this crybaby site could use some good news.
No one can have more than 154,245.75. Anything over it should be taken and unevenly distributed to other people.
did you pull that number out of a hat? and how can we be sure that the taker isn't corrupt?
Lazy dirty fuck. Get your filthy ass out of this country.
You're a greedy guy aren't you? You want more pie than everyone else don't you? You'd rather see others go without as long as you have much. You're an American, that's for sure. Capitalism doesn't work because of people like you. Greed exists and people think they are infallible, therefore the system does not work.
Keep getting all that you can! There are still billions that aren't starving.
Do me and you a favor, read this thread or at least 15 of my replies. If you think the same of me after that, I won't begrudge you. But please respond one way or another.
I've read enough of your foolishness. Have a good life.
Typical, take your ball and o home baby.
Hahaha... no, really, he said sarcasm, and the guy choked on his own, well, you know what. <somber look>
Don't worry, we'll take it all from you soon
Thats a joke... right?
How prick? Want a job....no. You can't have one you filthy hippie.
lulz he's a troll, trollin' in your trollin'
This "hippie" remarkd shows that your more than likely a nazi sympathizer. Plus for a "wealthy" individual, your spelling and replys are atrocious. I actually feel sorry for you because your health is probably going to the trash and you need to feel superior with you low life replies in here.
A wealthy person who worked hard to get that wealth should be in the occupy wall street protestors. I think your're most likely a criminal of some sort and that is how you gained your so called "wealth". Besides dude, you cant take it with ou when you drop dead of a stroke or a coronary, which probably won't be to far in the future. Dance hearty on your money, it will break your fall when you pass on.
Wow, just wow. Love for your neighbor is not your strong point. I'm not going to re-post my business just for a drive by thread hijacker. Take your unfocused rant somewhere else, bye bye.
HaHaHa http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=R0KluIXx6fI#t=207s troll. 50 years later, muthafckr. 50. u r pwnd.
Too much Starbucks.
If you haven't noticed our movement is getting larger everyday and it's not stopping. Don't get so cocky. So enjoy all your fancy stuff while it lasts because we are coming to take it from you soon
OWS is not for that. You discredit the movement!
Fuck communism.
No your not. Get back to your filthy worthless circle jerk, loser.
♪Don't feed the troll after mid-night♫
Then get the fuck out. Remember to clean yourself up before bed. And brush those smelly teeth.
♪Don't feed the troll after mid-night♫
And you rapping out ! Bad method...
You didn't clean yourself did you? Still stinking this place up. Add value or STFU.