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Forum Post: Gaza’s Torment, Israel’s Crimes, Our Responsibilities by noam chomsky

Posted 1 week ago on July 12, 2014, 7:09 a.m. EST by flip (5400)
This content is user submitted and not an official statement

At 3am Gaza time, July 9, in the midst of Israel’s latest exercise in savagery, I received a phone call from a young Palestinian journalist in Gaza. In the background, I could hear his infant child wailing, amidst the sounds of explosions and jet planes, targeting any civilian who moves, and homes as well. He just saw a friend of his in a car clearly marked “press” blown away. And he heard shrieks next door after an explosion but can’t go outside or he’ll be a likely target. This is a quiet neighborhood, no military targets – except Palestinians who are fair game for Israel’s high tech US-supplied military machine. He said that 70% of the ambulances have been destroyed, and that by then over 70 had been killed, and of the 300 or so wounded, about 2/3 women and children. Few Hamas activists have been hit – or rocket launching sites. Just the usual victims.

It is important to understand what life is like in Gaza when Israel’s behavior is “restrained,” in between the regular manufactured crises like this one. A good sense is given in a report to UNRWA by Mads Gilbert, the courageous and expert Norwegian physician who has worked extensively in Gaza, also throughout the vicious and murderous Cast Lead operation. In every respect, the situation is disastrous. Just keeping to children, Gilbert reports: “Palestinian children in Gaza are suffering immensely. A large proportion are affected by the man-made malnourishment regime caused by the Israeli imposed blockage. Prevalence of anaemia in children <2yrs in Gaza is at 72.8%, while prevalence of wasting, stunting, underweight have been documented at 34.3%, 31.4%, 31.45% respectively.” And it gets worse as the report proceeds.

When Israel is on “good behavior,” more than two Palestinian children are killed every week, a pattern that goes back over 14 years. The underlying cause is the criminal occupation and the programs to reduce Palestinian life to bare survival in Gaza, while Palestinians are restricted to unviable cantons in the West Bank and Israel takes over what it wants, all in gross violation of international law and explicit Security Council resolutions, not to speak of minimal decency. And it will continue as long as it is supported by Washington and tolerated by Europe – to our everlasting shame.

86 Comments

86 Comments


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[-] 3 points by turbocharger (497) 5 days ago

Ghandi had the right idea:

"“Palestine belongs to the Arabs in the same sense that England belongs to the English or France to the French. It is wrong and inhuman to impose the Jews on the Arabs... Surely it would be a crime against humanity to reduce the proud Arabs so that Palestine can be restored to the Jews partly or wholly as their national home”

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[-] 2 points by beautifulworld (21368) 1 week ago

"Israel's Gaza campaign may violate international law, says UN official"

"High commissioner for human rights says reports of civilians killed in strikes on homes raise doubt over legality of action"

"We have received deeply disturbing reports that many of the civilian casualties, including of children, occurred as a result of strikes on homes," Pillay said. "Such reports raise serious doubt about whether the Israeli strikes have been in accordance with international humanitarian law and international human rights law."

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jul/11/israeli-air-strikes-gaza-continue-us-barack-obama-offers-broker-ceasefire

And, repeating from your above Chomsky quote:

“Palestinian children in Gaza are suffering immensely. A large proportion are affected by the man-made malnourishment regime caused by the Israeli imposed blockage. Prevalence of anaemia in children <2yrs in Gaza is at 72.8%, while prevalence of wasting, stunting, underweight have been documented at 34.3%, 31.4%, 31.45% respectively.” And it gets worse as the report proceeds."

Anyone who questions why the Palestinians are resisting their plight are idiots. Resistance is all they have as the world's governments have chosen to turn their heads.

[-] 2 points by flip (5400) 1 week ago

we agree- as usual!

[-] 3 points by beautifulworld (21368) 1 week ago

I'll twinkle you, even though you are stuck at 5207. Bullies everywhere, flip! Even here! Resistance is fertile!

[-] 1 points by flip (5400) 1 week ago

thanks - can i turn in my points for an airline ticket or an ows poster or anything??

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[-] 2 points by beautifulworld (21368) 1 week ago

Map of Palestine, 1922:

https://www.dartmouth.edu/~gov46/pal-transjrdn-1922.gif

Palestinian Refugee Map, 1948:

https://www.dartmouth.edu/~gov46/pal-ref-camps-1948.gif

Palestinian Refugee Map, 1967:

https://www.dartmouth.edu/~gov46/pal-ref-camps-1967.gif

Maps tell a big story. These are from Dartmouth University.

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[-] 1 points by turbocharger (497) 4 days ago

"“If you're not careful, the newspapers will have you hating the people who are being oppressed, and loving the people who are doing the oppressing.”" - Malcolm X

I suppose in the 21st Century, that would probably apply more so to the TV, then 2nd to the internet. Still very true though.

[-] 0 points by flip (5400) 3 days ago

nice quote - I haven't seen that one! Malcolm is amazing

[-] 1 points by turbocharger (497) 3 days ago

Ya, he was pretty intense, I haven't studied him too much but he wasn't afraid to act or speak, thats for sure.

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[-] 1 points by turbocharger (497) 5 days ago

So as soon as the Israeli forces are done beating this American teen repeatedly, and he gets to go home, they trash the fuckin house and arrest his family.

Fuckin fascsist scum.

http://mondoweiss.net/2014/07/relatives-apparent-revenge.html

[-] 2 points by Narley (-629) 3 days ago

At some point some Arab nation will develop a Nuke or some other weapon of mass destruction, and will use it on Israel. Then Israel will counter with its nukes. Bingo WWIII, Brought on by the arrogance of Israel. All the crimes against humanity by Israel, one day, will be punished. (No I’m not a Muslim)

[-] 1 points by flip (5400) 5 days ago

that is kind of how I see it

[-] 4 points by turbocharger (497) 5 days ago

Its tough to see it any other way when government abroad are beating and killing their people, and ours here is straight up killing them on a regular basis.

How many people would you guess have been killed by the police this year?

[-] 1 points by flip (5400) 4 days ago

no idea but too many for sure. we kill them at home and around the world. then we support others killing - Israel, Ukraine, Honduras and too many more - mlk is still correct today - "the greatest purveyor of violence in the world!"

[-] -3 points by ZenDog (13427) from South Burlington, VT 5 days ago

And it will continue as long as it is supported by Washington and tolerated by Europe – to our everlasting shame.

Actually I find that the Middle East as a whole has tremendous resources of both land and wealth - which could easily be mobilized in an effort to restore some measure of sanity and civilization, yet the suffering of these children neither moves the Palestinians nor the Arab world as a whole toward meaningful steps toward peace.

If Arabs do not care about the health and welfare of Arab children, why should I?

[-] 0 points by flip (5400) 5 days ago

and by arabs you mean arab governments I assume. if so my answer would be that you should care because you are human and so are they.

[+] -4 points by ZenDog (13427) from South Burlington, VT 5 days ago

you misunderstand me completely. I simply accept that I am in fact powerless over whether the entire Arab world plans to hold Palestinian children hostage before the barrel of an Israeli gun, or not.

Since there is little I can do about it, I don't plan to get worked up over it. Hence, I don't care. I have no emotional investment.

If I were really interested in impacting U.S. foreign policy regarding Israel, which I am not, I would most assuredly approach the matter from a tangent. I would seek to curb the influence of conservative libertarians and conservative repelicans on U.S. policy as a whole. There are, after all, among these individuals those who do support the insane Israeli policy of settlement expansion.

By focusing on other issues, on national issues, one can eliminate the possibility or at the very least greatly reduce it, that one will attract Paulites and their rabid, racist brethren, neo-nazis. The presence of such individuals among our . . . . among OWS ranks . . . is as has been noted by the forum, counter productive to the aims of OWS.

[-] 2 points by flip (5400) 4 days ago

i don't see it quite the same way. seems to me that the u.s. dictates Israeli policy and at the very least supports it financially and at the u.n. we need to get our government to join the international consensus on the issue and then we will have peace in that region

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13427) from South Burlington, VT 4 days ago

How does the U.S. dictate Israeli settlement policy? Both fundamentalist Christians and Orthodox Jews tend to agree that all of Palestine belongs to the Israeli nation and is therefore suitable for settlement by them.

To suggest the U.S. dictates anything with regard to Israeli policy is a vast overstatement of U.S. influence over Israeli political apparatus. Israel is a sovereign nation, and while we may be their closest ally the Israeli leadership is not in the least bit subservient to U.S. policy makers. Israel perceives itself as surrounded by enemies and is therefore in some respects on a war time footing 24-7-365 and probably has been so ever since at least 1967.

You are a bright boy - such an oversimplification on your part is disingenuous. It must come with a purpose. In my view, as long as OWS aligns itself with the Palestinian cause, they will ensure they do not attract broad appeal here in the U.S. no matter what their position may be on national issues.

Easy enough to do too, I'm sure. Play to the vanity and incite the emotions of those zealous anarchists among the movement as a whole and everyone else just follows along, completely ignorant of the fact that such a position is in the end a decisively divisive issue, one that will ensure OWS remains contained in terms of its ability to harness public opinion and so public support among the voting demographic.

Divide and conquer.

  • meanwhile you bright mutherfukers have no answer to the dominance over U.S. energy or finance policy by those robbing from the American public - FROM THE WHOLE WORLD - and at the direct expense of the next generation and the one to follow. You bright bastards should be swiftly identified and isolated by any means possible, and that is MY OPINION.
[-] 2 points by flip (5400) 4 days ago

he who pays the piper calls the tune. Israel cannot function at the level they do without our HUGE financial support - take a look at official and unofficial moneys flowing to Israel from u.s. government. direct payments, loan forgiveness and gifts of military equipment. then take into account the diplomatic support - security council vetoes etc - israel has followed washingtons orders for decades now and cannot continue without our approval. if you need more info on the subject I can provide it but it should not be necessary.

[-] -3 points by ZenDog (13427) from South Burlington, VT 4 days ago

horseshit - the same influences that dictate U.S. largess toward Israel at the same time dictate complete acceptance of Israeli autonomy. That the Israeli government understands that acceptance is clearly illustrated by Pollard whom the Israeli's never would have recruited given the strain that incident placed on U.S. / Israeli relations, if what you suggest is true.

IT is therefore completely false, as I'm certain you well know. I have no doubt that you come armed with any number of talking points to the contrary, and yoiu do so simply because this false perception of U.S. pulling Israel's strings is integral to the maintenance of the rest of your position - that the Palestinian cause is appropriate, even productive, for OWS to follow - right along side that other pernicious lie:

  • both parties are to blame

IT is not.

not that it really matters at this point.

stupid fukers

[-] 1 points by flip (5400) 3 days ago

we disagree. can you tell me how much money the u.s. has given to Israel in the last decade? can you tell me how many vetoes? what I said is correct - Israel cannot make it without u.s. support - financial and diplomatic. he who pays the piper calls the tune.

[-] 1 points by turbocharger (497) 3 days ago

I will say you should check and see what these following positions- the top four financial positions in our country- have in common, and 90% of the time in the past all have in common:

Federal Reserve Chair Federal Reserve Vice Chair Treasury Secretary Goldman CEO

Its the entire financial/economic centerpiece positions, from the issuance of the money, the interest rates, the Fed bond purchases via Goldman, and the government middle man in it all.

They all have something in common. The last one not to was little Timmy, but he married in right after the promotion anyways, so there goes that.

I'm stating its a case of causation, but its a correlation that goes against natural representations of demographics so strongly that its clear its important to someone.

Who is that someone? Chances are, thats the one calling the shots.

[+] -5 points by ZenDog (13427) from South Burlington, VT 3 days ago

oh bullshit

But here we see the source of your great indignation - and it all comes down to the money doesn't it. you fukin paulite scumbag.

[-] 4 points by flip (5400) 3 days ago

not anti semitic at all just anti the policies of the Israeli government. also against many of the policies of the u.s. government - does not make me anti American. that is simply a way to close off dissent and ows is about dissent - anti establishment possibly but not anti American. your numbers most likely are on the low side. there are many ways the u.s. government funnels money to it's client state - loan forgiveness is just one way. also not a fan of ron or rand paul on domestic issues - foreign policy is another story.

[+] -7 points by ZenDog (13427) from South Burlington, VT 3 days ago

you fukin skid mark - brown and stinky

you shit stain on the cyber verse

you lyin fuker

shape shifting scum

you should just choke

choke on your own tongue

[-] 3 points by flip (5400) 3 days ago

excellent thoughtful response - fact based and coherent. I wish you had come to zuccotti once - you would have been hounded out of the park. couldn't pull that childish shit there

[-] -3 points by ZenDog (13427) from South Burlington, VT 3 days ago

to judge from news reports I could easily have pulled much much worse.

the facts are quite evident to anyone with their eyes open. The palestinian people are being held hostage to the geo-political aims of the Arab world as a whole - and those aims include a world without Israel - a world without Jews.

fuk you ya neo nazi scumbag

[-] 3 points by flip (5400) 2 days ago

" the general context is perfectly obvious for anyone who wants to see it" and -This is what Israel always does. Anybody who knows the history, it’s what the Israeli political scientist, the mainstream political scientist—name was Avner Yaniv—he said it’s these Palestinian "peace offensives." Whenever the Palestinians seem like they are trying to reach a settlement of the conflict, which the unity government was, at that point Israel does everything it can to provoke a violent reaction—in this case, from Hamas—break up the unity government, and Israel has its pretext. "NORMAN FINKELSTEIN: Well, before I do, I’m going to just briefly comment on the ceasefire. The ceasefire, first of all, says nothing about the rampages by Israel against Hamas in the West Bank. And it was those rampages which caused the current conflict to escalate. It gives Israel a green light to continue arresting Hamas members, blowing up homes in the West Bank, ransacking homes and killing Palestinians, which was the prelude to the current fighting.

Secondly, if you look at the ceasefire, it’s exactly what was agreed on in June—excuse me, June 2008 and the same ceasefire that was agreed to in November 2012. Namely, in both cases, it was said that there would be a relaxing of the illegal blockade of Gaza. In both cases, after the ceasefire was signed, the blockade was maintained, and in fact the blockade was escalated. So now, in the current version of the ceasefire, it said the blockade will be lifted after there has been calm restored and the security situation has been established. But if Israel says Hamas is a terrorist organization, then the security situation can never be calm in the Gaza, and therefore there will be never a lifting of the blockade of Gaza. So we’re right back to where we were in June 2008, November 2012. Of course Hamas is going to reject that kind of agreement. It means it legalizes, it legitimizes the brutal, merciless, heartless, illegal blockade of Gaza.

As to how we got to where we are, the general context is perfectly obvious for anyone who wants to see it. A unity government was formed between the PA and Hamas. Netanyahu was enraged at this unity government. It called on the U.S., it called on the EU, to break relations with the Palestinian Authority. Surprisingly, the United States said, "No, we’re going to give this unity government time. We’ll see whether it works or not." Then the EU came in and said it will also give the unity government time. "Let’s see. Let’s see what happens."

At this point, Netanyahu virtually went berserk, and he was determined to break up the unity government. When there was the abduction of the three Israeli teenagers, he found his pretext. There isn’t a scratch of evidence, not a jot of evidence, that Hamas had anything to do with the kidnappings and the killings. Nobody even knows what the motive was, to this point. Even if you look at the July 3rd report of Human Rights Watch, they said nobody knows who was behind the abductions. Even the U.S. State Department, on July 7th, there was a news conference, and the U.S. State Department said, "We don’t have hard evidence about who was responsible." But that had nothing to do with it. It was just a pretext. The pretext was to go into the West Bank, attack Hamas, arrest 700 members of Hamas, blow up two homes, carry on these rampages, these ransackings, and to try to evoke a reaction from Hamas.

This is what Israel always does. Anybody who knows the history, it’s what the Israeli political scientist, the mainstream political scientist—name was Avner Yaniv—he said it’s these Palestinian "peace offensives." Whenever the Palestinians seem like they are trying to reach a settlement of the conflict, which the unity government was, at that point Israel does everything it can to provoke a violent reaction—in this case, from Hamas—break up the unity government, and Israel has its pretext. "We can’t negotiate with the Palestinian Authority because they only represent some of the Palestinian people; they don’t represent all of the Palestinian people." And so Netanyahu does what he always does—excuse me, what Israeli governments always do: You keep pounding the Palestinians, in this case pounding Hamas, pounding Hamas, trying to evoke a reaction, and when the reaction comes—well, when the reaction comes, he said, "We can’t deal with these people. They’re terrorists

[-] -3 points by ZenDog (13427) from South Burlington, VT 2 days ago

what? what is that? Is that liike a . . . a . . . texty rant?

are you texty ranting?

Apparently when I say:

  • some folks just need killing

you find that o so gauche, yet when Hamas fires rockets at Israel, you find that perfectly acceptable.

Is that hypocritical? That is hypocritical. Don't you think so?

[-] -3 points by ZenDog (13427) from South Burlington, VT 4 days ago

go ahead mutherfukers - keep subtracting points all day long. you silly fukers. vanity is only skin deep, while the rest of this shit goes right to the bone - even to the marrow.

the clever fukers successfully keeping this movement contained have no plan to address the dominance over U.S. energy or finance policy by those robbing from the American public - FROM THE WHOLE WORLD - and at the direct expense of the next generation and the one to follow. and you silly fukers should be shot.

shot I said.

you silly fukers

[-] 3 points by flip (5400) 2 days ago

I believe in self defense and you believe in killing?

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[-] -3 points by ZenDog (13427) from South Burlington, VT 2 days ago

a brown stinky skid mark

a shit stain on the cyber verse of earth I said.

.

Soon there will be a whole lotta killing, killing on a goddamned global scale, over dwindling reserves of fossil fuels and the presence of Jews in a land where they have lived for almost 4000 years and stupid fools like you will have helped make it happen.

Yes I did

I said

Some people just need killing.

[-] 1 points by shadz66 (18086) 4 days ago

Wassup with you dude ?! Frothing that OWS won't jump to The Right ?!! STOP advocating plastic violence ; put your back into the long haul & - take heart from others !!! Still your mind & consider :

Re. 'US dictating Israeli policy', you're right. That's not happening. It's the other way around bt nt 4evr.

dum spiro, spero ...

[-] 4 points by turbocharger (497) 4 days ago

"and you silly fukers should be shot. shot I said."

Because nothing stimulates interesting conversation and brings people into the fold like statements like that!!

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[-] -3 points by shooz (17823) 4 days ago

It's likely a response to folks like you, who ignore their community to foster partisanship wherever and however you can.

Including harassing PMs.

[+] -4 points by shooz (17823) 4 days ago

Trashy, trasy, trashy.

https://occupywallst.org/forum/gazas-torment-israels-crimes-our-responsibilities-/#comment-1038662

Nothing like changing the subject, mid stream to hide your BS partisanship.

Just like your troll buddies do.

--caveat emptor--

On your every breath

[+] -4 points by shooz (17823) 4 days ago

Sure trashy, thanks for proving you knew who freakzilla was all along and proving just how big a liar you really are.

--caveat emptor--

on your every comment.

Only the true trolls will applaud you.

[-] 4 points by shadz66 (18086) 4 days ago

Sadly the only ''proving'' is - of you ; to you ; by yourself !!! Get well soon, snooz !! Mwah !

pax vobis. ...

[+] -5 points by shooz (17823) 3 days ago

Enjoy the comfort of your trolls and bots, and get drunk with your cabal.

Everyone knows revolutions are won by those with more insults.

On that criterion. You win.

[-] 5 points by shadz66 (18086) 3 days ago

Is anyone who isn't a Likud or Democratic Party supporter a 'troll, bot, or cabalist' ?! Fact is ''everyone knows' who and what you are here now !! You have clearly lost the plot imo .. maybe because you are possibly an incorrigible ''PEP'' !!! See the following link for an explanation and critique :

temet nosce ...

[+] -5 points by shooz (17823) 2 days ago

Trashy!!!

Proud to bring you your daily dose of bots puppets and cabals.

Not mention, at least one conspiracy theory a day.

All while lying through his teeth.

---Caveat Emptor!---

He knows no truth.

[-] 5 points by shadz66 (18086) 2 days ago

If you have a single shred of evidence for your atrocious canard .. then as a 'mod' here, it is now actually incumbent on you to take this matter to jart and have me banned !!! Is It Not, snoozie ?!! Otherwise, you are now clearly self-exposed as being a ... vile, dishonest, propagandising, lying, gate-keeping - prick !!!

dorkus maximus, temet nosce - Quod Erat Demonstrandum !!!

[-] -3 points by shooz (17823) 2 days ago

My, my trashy. Your mouth is more foul then those your cabal has been attacking.

Unfortunately, it speaks no truth, these days.

Thinking you can make demands on others, when you make no demands on yourself.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w-0TEJMJOhk

You really need to make a tin foil hat.

---caveat emptor---

On your every word and action of your pitiful cabal.

[+] -5 points by ZenDog (13427) from South Burlington, VT 3 days ago

you cannot help but to lie and tell even greater lies

you lie and you lie and you LIE

[-] 4 points by shadz66 (18086) 3 days ago

Post Coup d'Etat Egypt under the long term CIA asset, General Sisi is NOT any kind of honest broker ! Just about everyone who knows about the situation knows that !! You are an ignorant and mendacious toilet-mouthed regurgitator of 'received MSM wisdom' !!!

fallaces sunt rerum species ...

[+] -4 points by ZenDog (13427) from South Burlington, VT 3 days ago

you cannot help but to lie and tell even greater lies

you lie and you lie and you LIE

[+] -5 points by shooz (17823) 4 days ago

Aw trashy, that's so cute.

How about a comment on those Israeli blue swastikas that are being painted on certain doors in the UK?

They get your endorsement.

[-] 3 points by shadz66 (18086) 4 days ago

You really have no idea at all about what's going on in Gaza have you ?! Worse than that you don't want to know !! Worse still .. is you don't want others to know either !!! Ergo - per the OP :

I really have no idea of what you are talking about re. paint on doors, so put up a link and I will look and comment. However, as for your final four words ... IF you lived within 500 miles of me - I would offer you out, man to man and break your jaw or likely die trying, as you would no doubt bring a gun to a fist fight.

You are a Corrosive, Ugly, Rancid, s-o-b. Your real colours are now shown and you are self exposed as a Dem shill, DNC charlatan and Likudnik hate-monger who has infiltrated this forum. I'm not totally sure about who and what you serve here suzie but The 99% & OWS isn't even on, never mind 'top of' the list.

cave - bellum se ipsum alet ...

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[+] -4 points by shooz (17823) 3 days ago

Oh trashy, you do know where you can shove your insults now, don't you?

The real difference is that YOU PRETEND to know a lot of things you are completely ignorant of, because you learn about them on a conspiracy theory web site.

Oh and you've always needed the various crutches of bots, puppets and cabals, to make you lying point.

[-] 5 points by shadz66 (18086) 3 days ago

Re. The Likud Party in Israel and The Democratic Party in the U$A .. is anyone and everyone here, who doesn't tow their line, a 'bot, puppet, cabalist, stalker etc.' now ?! Actually suzie ''YOU PRETEND'' to be a professional and impartial 'mod' here on this forum !! But everyone now knows that you are NOT tho' !!!

multum in parvo ...

[-] -3 points by shooz (17823) 2 days ago

The only one dancing.

Is YOU trashy.

Dancing around the truth, just like your fellow cabal members do on every single subject, while they are busy running those various up and down vote bots.

Here's anther one for you to dance around, since your like to pretend to concerned about the numbers.

http://www.aawsat.net/2014/07/article55334493

Now, about those Israeli Blue swastikas, painted on certain doors in the UK?

[-] -3 points by ZenDog (13427) from South Burlington, VT 3 days ago

you cannot help but to lie and tell even greater lies

you lie and you lie and you LIE

.

you lying mutherfuker

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[+] -7 points by ZenDog (13427) from South Burlington, VT 4 days ago

~ fuk you ~ ya british stoog. ya mi6 ci. Aint there a law? Aint there some law about international spies and provocateurs operating to bend the minds of American children?

If I am frothing at the mouth at all it is over the blatant hypocrisy of trumpeting either justice, human rights, or anti-fascism here at home while holding aloft the Palestinian cause - Palestinians who are as much oppressed by those Fascist regimes who are their own brothers - well, ok, Iranians are Persians but the Syrians and the Hezbollah from Lebanon are not and they are all of them Muslim - governments and terrorist organizations every single bit as fascist and as bloodthirsty as any extant today.

fuk you.

You cannot sell the Palestinian cause to the average American. It cannot be done. For if they are not simply too indifferent, too disinterested, then they will quickly identify the vast humanitarian differences that exist between the Muslim / U.S. cultures and compare with the similarities between Israeli / U.S. cultures and reject the one most different.

You cannot sell the cause and so, as long as the movement upholds that cause, the movement remains stifled in terms of its political influence with the public.

you fukin scumbags should be shot.

shot I said.

That is my opinion.

Fuk you I said.

[-] 1 points by shadz66 (18086) 4 days ago

Your opinion was not always so prejudiced and irrational :

The Palestinian's cause 'sells' itself. Ignorance Is NOT An Option. Love & Truth Prevail - eventually ~*~

amor vincit omnia - spero ...

[-] 2 points by turbocharger (497) 4 days ago

"You cannot sell the Palestinian cause to the average American. It cannot be done."

Another wow moment from someone who is posting on this OWS site constantly.

[-] 1 points by trashyharry (1160) from Waterville, NY 4 days ago

Americans dislike Jews and detest Israelis.Some Americans are aware that Israel is a Rich Foreign Country which the US gives Billions to on account of Israel having bought several Senators.I guarantee that most of my neighbors are aware that Chuck Shumer is one of the US Senators who is owned by Israel.There is no way most New Yorkers who are not Delta Heads could fail to notice that we have only one weak and junior Senator working for us.Chuck Shumer devotes all of his time to protecting and promoting the interests of his Homeland,Israel.It would be a great idea to get rid of him.Hopefully if he was not reelected he would leave New York State and spend the rest of his days emitting huge,smelly farts in The Holy Land.

[-] 1 points by ZenDog (13427) from South Burlington, VT 4 days ago

Americans dislike Jews and detest Israelis.

neo-nazi scum you mean

[-] 2 points by trashyharry (1160) from Waterville, NY 4 days ago

Around here,they really don't know what Jews or Israelis are.They just know they are different from themselves and the people they know.They dislike Foreigners.They don't like the idea of giving away money to other countries,even poor countries where people will starve without it.Any of them who have been able to understand what Israel is are also aware that Israel would basically run out of ammo and not food.I guess most of these people are Protofacists or John Birch type people-very close to actual Nazis,IMHO.I think it has been proven that very few Americans can even find Canada on a map let alone Israel.

[-] -2 points by ZenDog (13427) from South Burlington, VT 4 days ago

Around here

Waterville New York?

The people in New York don't know what Jews are?

you really do travel among a very select group of ignorant mutherfukers, dontcha there, . . . Harry

  • an elite as it were
[-] -1 points by trashyharry (1160) from Waterville, NY 4 days ago

Just way out in the Stix in Upstate NY.As far as living arrangements up here.I'm better off living on a decent sized piece of land than owning a crappy apartment building in a decaying urban area.Either way,still a Provincial Backwater in a state of Accelerated Decrepitude.As for the Residents,in the Country you don't see 'em that often.People in Town are preoccupied by Waiting For the Parents (or sometimes Grandparents) to Die,fooling around with Automobiles and Electronic Gizmos,and engaging in Sordid Love Affairs & Quarrels.They are what you would call Humanists,I guess.They don't understand that things are going to be changing radically very soon.They don't really believe something like Climate Change exists on a scale that is beyond the control of Humans.Even though it's already happening.They are very bewildered by the devastating storms that have lately been cramping the Upstate Style.They are Lamenting for the way our storms Used Ta Be,and wondering What Happened ? It is very sad,but on the other hand,they don't know what's going on around them because-they ALL watch Fox News.They have not been forced to watch Fox News.

[-] -3 points by ZenDog (13427) from South Burlington, VT 4 days ago

it all sounds so very, very cliche . . .

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13427) from South Burlington, VT 4 days ago

and then there is that little issue that is - or at least should be - close to all of our hearts and minds on this forum . . . that of net neutrality . . .

.

Several liberal lawmakers want to apply utility-style regulations to Internet service providers.

Sen. Edward Markey, a Massachusetts Democrat, collected signatures for a letter urging the Federal Communications Commission to regulate the Internet like the telephone system.

Democratic Sens. Chuck Schumer of New York and Al Franken of Minnesota, as well as independent Sen. Bernie Sanders of Vermont, have signed on, aides confirmed. The lawmakers have planned a Tuesday morning press conference with Internet advocacy groups.

In the letter, the senators argue that stronger authority is necessary to enact net-neutrality rules that prevent broadband providers such as Comcast from manipulating traffic to favor giant corporations.

.

you stupid partisan mutherfuker

[-] 2 points by trashyharry (1160) from Waterville, NY 4 days ago

LOL-I am not stupid.

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13427) from South Burlington, VT 4 days ago

are you absolutely certain of that?

[-] 2 points by trashyharry (1160) from Waterville, NY 4 days ago

LOL-on second thought it just dawned on me-Duh-EVERYONE-must be stoopid EXCEPT you!

[-] 2 points by trashyharry (1160) from Waterville, NY 4 days ago

Wow.You are in a bad mood.But-(whining) It's not my Fault!

[-] -2 points by ZenDog (13427) from South Burlington, VT 4 days ago

o noo you misunderstand me completely. Think of it this way -

  • if you really are dense as a post,
    • how would you ever know you weren't even HALF as useful?
[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13427) from South Burlington, VT 4 days ago

and as far as NY constituents not being served by Schumer, much less being dumped by him - obviously you don't know shit.

why is that not surprising?

[-] 1 points by turbocharger (497) 4 days ago

Ya everyone outta be thrilled when his plans for fracking get pushed through and in 20 years theres no clean water.

Schumer is just another opportunist who likes his cozy position.

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13427) from South Burlington, VT 4 days ago

Does he favor fracking? If he does it is clearly an error on his part, as it clearly is with the Governor of Vermont.

But there is an interesting fact about the fossil fuel industry - any time they want something and someone stands in their way, prices go up across the board.

Both Congressman Welch and Senator Sanders have, at different times, called for investigations into gasoline pricing. When this has happened in the past a refinery has blown up thus constricting available supplies of gasoline and driving up the price.

Similar thing happened with natural gas this winter - in terms of price spike if not the underlying cause - VtGas wanted a pipeline to Middlebury, winter was cold, demand high, prices rose, and now they are laying pipe as a part of phase one.

.

My point here is that I am not happy about any of it - but I'm not prepared to say that the position of either Shumer or of Shumlin is a matter of expedience, opportunism - or a pragmatic attempt to insulate the public from a political skirmish that would have an uncertain outcome even as the adverse consequences are very real and demonstrable.

.

You on the other had, being a partisan low life fuk - never would give thought to such considerations - and you never would because they run entirely counter to your entire point.

you like fracked gas

[-] 2 points by turbocharger (497) 3 days ago

??? If I was a fracking supporter, I certainly wouldnt be involved in something like this: http://ideaconferenceusf.org Everything is reserved for this year's, I'm just hoping that the two core organizers have enough time to help me out again. The goal is to get Bosch's geothermal division to headline the event, which according to Jay Egg (whom I personally know and we share the same values with energy http://energyblog.nationalgeographic.com/2014/03/12/why-home-geothermal-systems-might-soon-be-more-affordable-for-u-s-homeowners/ ) is a good possibility.

Regardless how many times some of you here want to recite something, doesnt make it true. And assuming because your obnoxious friend (Ill take crazy and crass over obnoxious and pretentious anyday) posts on it constantly with no reply from people, doesnt make those then supporters. Ridiculous logic like that gets labeled as disruption for a reason.

Whats funny is most of the mainstream conservative people I know call me a bleeding hear liberal, a socialist, etc... Certain trigger words get people on a path that they cant get off. I guess some of us dont really fit into the usual compartments too well, but Im fine with it.

As far as Schumer, most everyone realizes he's useless in NY, hes been there for a while. A few Dems think hes a hero, a few Reps think hes satan, and the other vast majority wishes he would just get out and give someone else a shot. The same trend throughout the nation.

[-] -2 points by ZenDog (13427) from South Burlington, VT 3 days ago

common

be honest, just for once.

nothing you've said on this forum to date has any relationship to reality

and deep down inside you feel some measure of conflict over that.

go ahead. You can talk about it. After all . . .

there's really no one else here . . .

.

hahaha

[-] -1 points by shooz (17823) 4 days ago

How are doing on your plan to take over the Detroit water system??

At least he doesn't hide behind, or false nonpartisanship.

BTW, how's the bar fights going?

[-] -2 points by ZenDog (13427) from South Burlington, VT 4 days ago

anti-fascism sells itself and Netan-Yahoo is a fukin fascist

just like your beloved PUKECANNON

stupid mutherfuker

[-] -2 points by shooz (17823) 4 days ago

Shhhh, the alleged British partisan doesn't want to talk about Israeli blue swastikas being painted on doors in the UK, any more than he talks about his beloved libe(R)tarians....Or the actual realities of sharia law all around the World.

He likes to focus on those things that fit his own stanch partisanship.

[-] 1 points by shadz66 (18086) 4 days ago

If you had an ounce of honour as a man .. then you'd have something to say here :

BUT as you are only a sneaky li'l mouse, you just squeak b-s from The Shadows !

temet nosce ..

[-] -1 points by shooz (17823) 4 days ago

Sure trashy, whatever you say.

The bots and puppets will hang on your every lie.

They love your every insult.

They always did.

They love how much reality you ignore to promote your partisanship.

They especially love your conspiracy theories.

[-] 0 points by shadz66 (18086) 4 days ago

Re. your DNC & Likud ''partisanship'', do you regard anyone who opposes that to be 'a bot, a troll or a partisan' ?!!! I AM Partisan !! For The 99% - Everywhere !

ad iudicium ...

[-] -1 points by shooz (17823) 4 days ago

Find the quote trashy, you partisan jerk, or at long last STFU.

Or just move to Florida with hchc, if you weren't there all along.

You can take the stalking fuck Odin with you.

Aw fuck it.

Why wait.

Go now.

--Caveat emptor--

on your every word.

[-] 1 points by shadz66 (18086) 4 days ago

MEDIC !!! Extreme Plot Loss !! Apply a 4x2 to the back of the head & then TLC & a =====##~~' !

spero meliora ...

[-] -2 points by ZenDog (13427) from South Burlington, VT 4 days ago

well goddamn and pass me a stone.

[-] -2 points by shooz (17823) 4 days ago

Kidney, or gall?

LOL

[-] -1 points by ZenDog (13427) from South Burlington, VT 4 days ago

ohh, say . . . lets get 'em drunk an' feed 'em on tea and ice cream . . .

[+] -4 points by ZenDog (13427) from South Burlington, VT 4 days ago

we need to get our government to join the international consensus on the issue and then we will have peace in that region

what a rosy oversimplification, what a simply childish condensation of the practical reality. And all of the kids marching behind that anarchist banner nod their heads uh-huh with no clear idea of the neat little box you keep them in.

And I am sure all of these nations are among your fine consensus.

Here are a few of the Intents that underlie that consensus:

  • “Kill the Jews wherever you find them. This pleases God, history and religion.”
  • Haj Amin al-Husseini, Mufti of Jerusalem (Radio Berlin, March 1, 1944; quoted in Robert Wistrich, Muslim Anti-Semitism: A Clear and Present Danger [American Jewish Committee, 2002], p. 47)

  • “I personally wish that the Jews do not drive us to this war, as this will be a war of extermination and momentous massacre which will be spoken of like the Tartar massacre or the Crusader wars.”

  • Azzam Pasha, Secretary-General of the Arab League (Akhbar al-Yom, Egypt, October 11, 1947; quoted in David Barnett and Efraim Karsh, “Azzam’s Genocidal Threat,” Middle East Quarterly, Fall 2011)

  • “If the Jewish state becomes a fact, and this is realized by the Arab peoples, they will drive the Jews who live in their midst into the sea… Even if we are beaten now in Palestine, we will never submit. We will never accept the Jewish state... But for politics, the Egyptian army alone, or volunteers of the Muslim Brotherhood, could have destroyed the Jews.”

  • Hassan al-Banna, Muslim Brotherhood founder (New York Times, August 2, 1948)

  • “In demanding the return of the Palestinian refugees the Arabs mean their return as masters, not slaves, or to put it more clearly – the intention is the extermination of Israel.”

  • Salah al-Din, Egyptian Foreign Minister (Al-Misri, Egypt, October 11, 1949; quoted in Harris O. Schoenberg, A Mandate for Terror: The United Nations and the PLO [Shapolsky Books, 1989], p. 239)

  • “Israel, to the Arab world, is like a cancer to the human body, and the only way of remedy is to uproot it just like a cancer… Had we united then [in 1948] Israel would not have come into existence. Israel is a serious wound in the Arab world body, and we cannot endure the pain of this wound forever. We don’t have the patience to see Israel remain occupying part of Palestine for long… We Arabs total about 50,000,000. Why don’t we sacrifice 10,000,000 of our number to live in pride and self-respect?”

  • King Saud of Saudi Arabia (New York Times, January 10, 1954)

  • “Is not Israel’s isolation a natural result of her racial artificiality, a patchwork society of German, Polish, East European recruits, of her cultural and political singularity, and to the fact that she does not belong, and should not belong to that part of the Arab world upon which she was imposed by outside force? … No international intrigue, no force whatsoever can oblige the Arabs to accept the intruders whose hands are still stained with the blood of other Arabs…”

  • M. Samir Ahmed, Egyptian Embassy Press Secretary (Letter, Washington Post, September 20, 1955)

  • “We are awaiting aggression by Israel and any supporters of Israel. We will make it a decisive battle and get rid of Israel once and for all… This is the dream of every Arab.”

  • Gamal Abdel Nasser, President of Egypt (Washington Post, July 27, 1959)

There are more . .. .

.

You know very well there will not be peace in that region unless or until the Arab people demand it - of themselves - these fukers cannot even get along with Buddhists for fucks sake.

not even with Buddhists . . . !

Go tell your lies to someone else. I have things to do.