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Forum Post: debate

Posted 2 years ago on Oct. 16, 2012, 10:58 p.m. EST by bensdad (8977)
This content is user submitted and not an official statement

chris watthews "score" on ten issues
6 Obama
1 romney
3 ties


ed schultz
Obama scored big on everything with truth and facts
Obama used 47% perfectly


Schmidt: ( McCains campaign manager)
If Obama had done this in debate 1, romney would not have a chance
romney lied about Obama's first statement on Libya & Obama & Candy caught him on the lie


Chris Hayes romney broke the rules


Lawrence ODonnell
47% at the end was perfect

93 Comments

93 Comments


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[-] 3 points by WSmith (1866) from Cornelius, OR 2 years ago

GO HERE to find all the details of the Romney plan to save America: http://www.romneytaxplan.com/

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 2 years ago
[-] -1 points by yobstreet (-575) 2 years ago

Cool.

[-] 2 points by hchc (3297) from Tampa, FL 2 years ago

Two banker lap dogs talking a bunch of bullshit, and meanwhile the real leaders and activists are getting arrested outside.

The choice is clear.

[-] 2 points by WSmith (1866) from Cornelius, OR 2 years ago

Clear is not a word I would use regarding your deficient political comprehension. Fractured, confused and skewed are more like it.

[-] -1 points by hchc (3297) from Tampa, FL 2 years ago

Of course not, because you prefer the corporate parties to continue to pillage us through this system.

At least you've made THAT clear.

[-] -1 points by yobstreet (-575) 2 years ago

What's the connection between Bank of America and Obama? Inquiring minds want to know.

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 2 years ago

competition is good

not governing the people

China stole american tech because they couldn't be tech without american companies?

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 2 years ago

the 2 party candidates say they are lying

so we must assume are representatives are liars

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 2 years ago

both

cut taxes for middle class (No relief for the poor)

taxes are not destroying the middle class

businesses create jobs when demand increases not when they have more money

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 2 years ago

Romney Top income pay 60% of federal income tax. Money should not equal power

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 2 years ago

Rmney I believe in competition. They're not enough jobs for the people in the world. Compete to have the jobs in US and take jobs from other nations. China is cheating

American Life Guy journalism requires work and being on site

Romney says that he knows what it takes but does say what it takes.

Obama invest in green energy instead of war. Want's manufacturing jobs to export product to the world Speaks of competing with other nations like competition instead of cooperation is desirable

Obama: natural gas is up with fracking to encourage the gas Romney: We burned coal in the past ?therefor it is not dirty

Obama: China is going to leave us behind in alternative energy. and the US should compete for those jobs. because there are not enough jobs in the world

Romney: Wind jobs are not blow jobs

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 2 years ago

Obama's foreign policy is hunting down and killing those responsible for american deaths

we're not making any friends

evokes Al Kidda

Obama knew families of diplomat killed in Libya. Perhaps he also went to Harvard like Romney and Obama

Romney endorses Obama position "kill, kill, kill, terror , terror , terrorist"\

Obama suggests anti-violance needs to be faith based?

Obama: We got soldiers fighting right now. We bombed Pakistan with drones during the vice president debate

[-] 0 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

Go 3rd party.!!

Have you decided who you prefer Matt.?

I like Jill Stein.

[-] 1 points by factsrfun (6457) from Phoenix, AZ 2 years ago

Rocky kicked her butt in the debate. She looks very weak to me. Either will do if you want Romney to be picking the Court.

http://www.democracynow.org/blog/2012/10/17/watch_three_hour_democracy_now_debate_special_from_hofstra_university

[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

I know a 3rd party can never win while the election laws remain as they do. I don't like discussing my vote but NY state will go Dem. My posts here are all about challenging anti Obama partisan lies & criticizing repubs whose policies are at the center of all our problems.

[-] 1 points by factsrfun (6457) from Phoenix, AZ 2 years ago

It's not just the laws it's the Constitution, if fixing the laws would fix it then Washington would have, he got most things he wanted. The trick is not to complain about what is but to make it work anyway, that's why I say kill the GOP because we need a real people's party and there can only be two.

[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

I agree we need a real peoples party. I believe republican/conservative policy is at the center of all our problems.

I know the republican party is self destructing.

I'd love it if the dems could become a real peoples party but I recognize the unlikeliness of that.

I am open to suggestions but will continue working against repub/conserv and attempting to push dems to help the 99%.

[-] 1 points by factsrfun (6457) from Phoenix, AZ 2 years ago

If the GOP can be made small enough the Ds will split like an excited U235 atom.

[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

I don't think the dems are at risk of splitting the repubs are, but the dems may absorb some of the moderate repubs.

[-] 1 points by factsrfun (6457) from Phoenix, AZ 2 years ago

Kill the GOP and the Ds will split, right now the GOP are not in danger of dying, see what happens when there are less than 30 in the Senate and 80 or so in the House.

[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

That congressional loss would be death alright. Don't that will happen this cycle, although I would love to see it.

Dems splitting? I suppose anything is possible, I don't really think it will all go down like that but who knows.?

[-] 1 points by factsrfun (6457) from Phoenix, AZ 2 years ago

It will take many cycles the more it takes the worst position the country will be in when it happens, but the GOP are on a course they cannot veer from and it is right off a cliff, the only question is how bad will it be for the rest of us.

[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

I agree that the GOP's intolerance is sending them inextricably towards the cliff. That will be the split. A tea party intolerant party & a moderate repub party.

I can't wait.

[-] 1 points by factsrfun (6457) from Phoenix, AZ 2 years ago

The thing I see is this "we will take any tax cut and fight to the death any increase" the country is a system all things are systems, a system made so unbalanced is bound to come apart, the GOP cannot turn from this as it is who they are and it is insane, as more people realize this the GOP will die.

(The social issues are working against them too, but they can make adjustments there.)

[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

I think also the gop seems to fight against tax cuts for middle class also.

Only the 1% do they seem to fight for.

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 2 years ago

I like Rocky Anderson

i'm for nuclear power and genetic design

[-] 1 points by factsrfun (6457) from Phoenix, AZ 2 years ago

I'm not even sure if I'm still for nuclear power, and I know a bit about it.

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 2 years ago

I'm hoping the boron fusion reactor is possible

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aneutronic_fusion

[-] 1 points by factsrfun (6457) from Phoenix, AZ 2 years ago

Not to start a fight or anything, and considering I only read through the wiki I didn't go looking for peer reviewed material, my read is this is a long way away, I think DT reactions are going to continue to be a challenge.

But the main thing that has shifted my beliefs from nuclear to solar/wind is the centralization of the production I think the large industrial power production should be minimized and diverse production should be promoted, it is more resilient and efficient in the long run and moves the economic benefits of production out to more people as opposed to more concentration of wealth and control.

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 2 years ago

the human body subsists on it's stomach and small intestine

[-] 1 points by factsrfun (6457) from Phoenix, AZ 2 years ago

only because each cell does its job

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 2 years ago

oy perhaps parallel processing

[-] 1 points by factsrfun (6457) from Phoenix, AZ 2 years ago

I have read theories that consciousness arises from synchronize oscillations of the nerve cells. I find the action of hormones to be of great interest as well. Systems depend on feedback loops for homeostasis, something our government has failed to provide to our economic system.

some fun stuff

http://www.consciousness.arizona.edu/

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 2 years ago

bank interest takes money out of the system

[-] 1 points by factsrfun (6457) from Phoenix, AZ 2 years ago

I might offer that bank profit takes money out of the system, the interest collected that offsets the loans to those who fail to repay allows for the feasibility that is always needed.

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 2 years ago

if everybody had a guaranteed basic income. The economy will move without the need of banks

[-] 1 points by factsrfun (6457) from Phoenix, AZ 2 years ago

I have only a little knowledge about this, but I think the Islamic religion forbids interest payments/charges they still figured out a way to create banks. When I was growing up the banker was our friend sort of,but he was always careful about lending money and you could trust him to tell you if you were going to be able to pay it back. I lean more toward fixing things rather than throw them out, but like the country at large I've collected more junk than I've fixed, some things might need to be done away with, private equity firms might be something to look at.

[-] 1 points by VQkag2 (16478) 2 years ago

Nuclear power is too dangerous for my taste. Same Genetically Modified stuff.

But go Rocky!

[-] 0 points by stevebol (1269) from Milwaukee, WI 2 years ago

He's seems to be using Ike's model of using covert operations to avoid large scale wars. I wish he would lay off the drones. The use of drones doesn't add up in any way and we sure aren't making any friends by using them.

[-] 0 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 2 years ago

we are in competition with other nations for jobs (why?)

we can't be friends

[-] 1 points by Mooks (1985) 2 years ago

Someone is clearly aroused from the debate....

[-] 1 points by bensdad (8977) 2 years ago

romney also looked a bit scared

[-] 0 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 2 years ago

Romney: thinks people getting food stamps is bad for the economy

women should compete because only a few can win

[-] -1 points by WeThePeop (-259) 2 years ago

People should be working and not on food stamps. Why are people not working??? It is caused by the lame Obama admin, vote him out in Nov and you will see a change for the better

[-] 2 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 2 years ago

damn slaves should get back to work

don't they know the bibble says plantation owners should rule them

[-] -2 points by WeThePeop (-259) 2 years ago

The ones that are able to work should seek it then. Why should we have to work every day to support some lazy ass, that cannot get off the couch

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 2 years ago

we should we have to work everyday to pay rent and bank interest?

[-] -1 points by WeThePeop (-259) 2 years ago

Are you saying that rent should be free?

[-] 0 points by WSmith (1866) from Cornelius, OR 2 years ago

Rest assured that if Romney wins he'll lower or remove the universally-crippling Estate and Capital Gains Taxes. Thank God! Halleluiah!

[-] 0 points by stevebol (1269) from Milwaukee, WI 2 years ago

Bengazi keeps coming up. After finally taking the time to look at this I'm convinced both sides are out of their minds. What difference does it make if the attack was motivated by an anti-Islam movie or something else. I'm glad the election is getting ugly over this issue. It exposes Obama and Romney for what they really are.

[-] 0 points by WSmith (1866) from Cornelius, OR 2 years ago

Obama: guidance counselor

Romney: carnival barker

Most surveys say Obama won.

Poignant that the "Undecided" lady asked the question: "What are differences between you and Bush?"

The only question Romney didn't need/TAKE more time for!!

No difference was the correct answer for him.

It was interesting how fast and furious "Fast and Furious" became the subject of the domestic assault weapon murder attacks.

Hard to imagine anyone not seeing how specious and autocratic Romney is.

[-] 0 points by ronniepaul2012 (214) 2 years ago

Fast and Furious is a question of Executive Branch lawbreaking, plain and simple (remember that atf, dea come under doj which is part of executive branch). After stonewalling the investigation for over a year and a half, O claims EP (ttho they provided a trickle of heavily redacted documents for 18 mo) and then try to say it's election year politics! They investigation started in spring 11. If Holder had come clean, it would have been finished before 2012 started.

I also think F&F was an act of war vs Mexico. Imagine how the US would take Mexico sending arms to the Taliban and (after getting caught) claiming they were just trying to find the Taliban leaders!

If I had a son, he'd look like Brian Terry

[-] 3 points by bensdad (8977) 2 years ago

And specifically, what has any F&F investigation reported ?

SPECIFICALLY

[-] 1 points by ronniepaul2012 (214) 2 years ago

Nothing. F&F was just a govt scheme to arm the Sinaloa cartel. Why? I have my speculative reasons, wonder what you think. If it was meant to find and arrest gun runners, Obama would have coordinated with Mexico. If you mean the IG or Issa's house committee. Answer is the same. NOTHING. Obama and Holder are stonewalling, sent the link to WH to Iraq before he could be subpoenad, and then pulled the Executive Prrivelege Card. Csn you telll me why O did that?

[-] 1 points by bensdad (8977) 2 years ago

The Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF) ran a series of "gunwalking" sting operations started under George Bush between 2006 and 2011. These operations were done under the umbrella of Project Gunrunner, a project intended to stem the flow of firearms into Mexico by interdicting straw purchasers and gun traffickers within the United States. "Gun walking" or "letting guns walk" was a tactic whereby the ATF "purposely allowed licensed firearms dealers to sell weapons to illegal straw buyers, hoping to track the guns to Mexican drug cartel leaders."

In 2006, the stated goal of allowing these purchases was to continue to track the firearms as they were transferred to higher-level traffickers and key figures in Mexican cartels, with the expectation that this would lead to their arrests and the dismantling of the cartels. The tactic was questioned during the operations by a number of people, including federal ATF field agents and cooperating licensed gun dealers. Operation Fast and Furious, by far the largest "gunwalking" probe, monitored the sale of over 2,000 firearms, of which nearly 700 were recovered as of October 20, 2011 (2011 -10-20) A number of straw purchasers have been arrested and indicted; however, as of October 2011, none of the targeted high-level cartel figures have been arrested.

Guns tracked by the ATF have been found at crime scenes on both sides of the Mexico–United States border, and the scene of the death of at least one U.S. federal agent, Border Patrol Agent Brian Terry. The "gunwalking" operations became public in the aftermath of Terry's murder. Dissenting ATF agents came forward to Congress in response. As investigations have continued, the operations have become increasingly controversial in both countries, and diplomatic relations have been damaged as a result.

In June 2012, a six-month long investigation by Fortune magazine concluded that the ATF never intentionally allowed guns to fall into the hands of Mexican drug cartels.
Agents interviewed during the investigation repeatedly asserted that only one isolated incident of "gunwalking" ever occurred, and was performed independently by ATF Agent John Dodson (who later appeared on CBS News as a whistleblower to denounce the gunwalking scandal) as part of an unauthorized solo action outside of the larger Fast and Furious operation.

[-] 3 points by WSmith (1866) from Cornelius, OR 2 years ago

Why would Obama want to resolve F&F, it's the perfect stage to spot light all you cackling hypocrites over a dumb-ass program Bush started. Pure red herring over nothing. Let's talk about the deregulation, fraud and theft of WS; the millions killed and wounded from lying us into two bogus wars, ignoring warnings allowing 9-11 to happen, RW Hate speech that incites domestic terrorism, etc., etc., ad nauseam.

[-] 0 points by hchc (3297) from Tampa, FL 2 years ago

Obama lied about Rose Garden, never referred to attacks as terrorist attacks. Simply called them attacks.

Referred to terrorism when mentioning 9/11. Referred to Libya as only "attacks" about 30 times.

I dont see what the big deal is, but it was a lie nevertheless.

[-] 2 points by WSmith (1866) from Cornelius, OR 2 years ago

So fucking what? Even if it was true!

Prior to the overthrow of Gaddafi, we didn't have a consulate in Libya.

But it didn't stop Dick Cheney from doing business with the Dictator.

News Flash: Middle East is unpredictable, dangerous, unstable, volatile, and has been for a long time:

"The revolutions sweeping across the Middle East are not merely one-off attempts to overthrow unresponsive autocrats or crazed tyrants, CNN journalist, Fareed Zakaria, asserts, these revolutions are a reaction to 1,000 years of subjugation by foreign powers and their hand-picked, domestic lieutenants.

“[F]or the first time in 1,000 years, Arabs are taking control of their own affairs,” Zakaria explains. “Since the 11th century, Arab lands have been conquered and controlled by foreigners… In fact, most of the Arab world was ruled by the Ottoman Empire for centuries. Then came the Europeans, who carved up the region after World War I – creating most of the states we know today… [These states were] all creations of the colonial powers.”

“Throughout this 1,000 years of foreign domination,” Zakaria continues, “the Arabs always had local rulers. But these sheiks and kings and generals were appointed or supported by the outside imperial powers. Most of the Middle East monarchies, for example, were created out of ‘whole cloth’ by the British.

“These local rulers were more skilled at negotiating up to the imperial rulers, than they were at negotiating down to their own people. They ruled their own people, not by negotiation, but by force and bribery… That game is in trouble…”

Finally, says Zakaria, the winds of change are blowing across North Africa and regions to the East. As these winds gather intensity, socio-economic conditions in the region will shift as unpredictably as sand dunes in the Sahara.

Volatility is probably the only near-certainty.

“The Middle East is witnessing a revolt against the Old Order everywhere,” Zakaria concludes. “Where it will lead, where it will fail, where it will succeed, all of this is totally unclear. But this is a big, system-wide and historic shift. So buckle your seatbelts. You’re watching history in the making.”

If volatility is the likeliest course of the Mid-East revolutions, what would be the likeliest course of the oil price?

Volatility, with a bias to the upside, would be our guess.

And if the oil price is likely to spike higher, what would be the likeliest course of the global financial markets?

Volatility, with a downward bias, would be our guess.

As we remarked in Friday’s edition of The Daily Reckoning, “We are not so certain that the contagious revolutionary virus spreading throughout the region is bullish for anything other than the oil price…and Anderson Cooper.”

Eric Fry for The Daily Reckoning

Read more: Why Volatility in the Middle East is the Only Near-Certainty http://dailyreckoning.com/why-volatility-in-the-middle-east-is-the-only-near-certainty/#ixzz29YATNCre

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[-] 0 points by hchc (3297) from Tampa, FL 2 years ago

Do you consider it a terrorist attack? Im not sure it is, because it was a targeted attack against an occupying country. I think terrorist attacks usually kill innocent people to instill terror.

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[-] -1 points by hchc (3297) from Tampa, FL 2 years ago

Sorry dude, I know you are all "kill the terrorists" and whatnot, but not everything is terror related.

Attack a nation, they attack you back. Pretty simple. If they blew up a shopping mall, that would be terror.

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[-] 0 points by hchc (3297) from Tampa, FL 2 years ago

That was in response to the 9/11 piece. Here's the video, see what you think.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z0wllKURCq8

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[-] -2 points by hchc (3297) from Tampa, FL 2 years ago

I think it just shows that when you attack countries, they attack you back. Too bad he's such a war monger, or this would have never happened.

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[-] 0 points by hchc (3297) from Tampa, FL 2 years ago

Ya, I know, calling for an end to the imperialist policies of our gov is a horrble thing.

Im suprised you back so many killings and bombs and whatnot, but detaining three kids here gets you to stop actively campaigning. Thats a first right there. I guess everyone works in their own ways.

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[-] -1 points by hchc (3297) from Tampa, FL 2 years ago

You didnt notice how I didnt see what the big deal was? Label and marginalize, get it over with. Maybe fake a few phone calls too.

[-] 1 points by stevebol (1269) from Milwaukee, WI 2 years ago

I didn't follow the story closely but it was a dumb move to associate the attack with some vid or movie. If Obama did lie about what you're referring to I'm not surprized. The WH screwed up on this one.

[-] 2 points by bensdad (8977) 2 years ago

read the TRANSCTIPT ZD posted above where is the lie?

[-] 2 points by WSmith (1866) from Cornelius, OR 2 years ago

Hey, in case you haven't noticed, Bush-Cheney left a plethora of unresolved and festering messes, debts, deaths and carnage!

9-11, a stupid inciting video, cunning insurgents: a trifecta of shit.

Why did Murdoch's WSJ sit on the Hillary admission story??

[-] 0 points by WeThePeop (-259) 2 years ago

In other related news!!!!!!! New York's Trinity Church forced to cancel Halloween fest over Occupy Wall Street camp

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/us/2012/10/16/occupy-wall-street-camp-leads-to-cancellation-halloween-festivities-at-new-york/?test=latestnews#ixzz29WiQ2DiV

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[-] -1 points by hchc (3297) from Tampa, FL 2 years ago

The same reason Murdoch has donated a lot more money to Obama than to Romney this time around, its about managing public thinking.

[-] 3 points by WSmith (1866) from Cornelius, OR 2 years ago

Let's see the proof of that, GOP plant

[-] -2 points by hchc (3297) from Tampa, FL 2 years ago

Well, when FOX is donating more money to Obama, for the second consecutive election, looks like Obama is the plant.

You just cant wrap your head around the fact that things are not as they seem, can you?

http://www.mediaite.com/online/all-major-media-companies-donated-more-money-to-obama-says-nyt/

[-] -1 points by yobstreet (-575) 2 years ago

The media across virtually all fronts (including even David Letterman) have already ousted Obama.

[-] -1 points by hchc (3297) from Tampa, FL 2 years ago

Well, they are funding his campaign. Even the owner of Fox News contributes more to him than Romney

http://www.mediaite.com/online/all-major-media-companies-donated-more-money-to-obama-says-nyt/

[-] -1 points by yobstreet (-575) 2 years ago

It's about the economy stupid. This country can't afford to grow its debt by trillions every four years while simultaneously hitting the working and middle classes on all fronts. If by some miracle Obama does win the media will eventually eat him alive.

[-] -1 points by hchc (3297) from Tampa, FL 2 years ago

Ryan's plan doesnt slow the deficit in a meaningful way either. The steps needed to balance it would shrink the economy at such a rate that no politician will do it.

[-] -2 points by yobstreet (-575) 2 years ago

I don't care about Ryan or his plan; I don't care about Romney or his plans... what I care about is the mindset.

Referring to the debt, Obama used these words last night: "if this truly is a problem".

I would submit that it truly is a problem in that no one, ever, anywhere in the world, within our lifetime, or those of our children or grandchildren, will voluntarily relieve us of this debt as the lawful extraction of our labor and resources.

Very few individual or corporate entities in the world are even capable of this; those that are capable of relieving us of our debt occupy this position of wealth as wholly contrary to a desire of charity.

My personal belief is that Obama's motivation is entirely political - stay in power to grow the wealth of friends.

But I would like to see this conversation go forward - Obama here suggests that the debt is NOT a problem - and I would like insight because obviously I am possessed of some misconception regarding this conversation that we have not had.

At what point does our Executive branch stop ignoring our concerns and permit this conversation to go forward in some logical manner so that we ourselves might embrace the benefit of their rationale?

[-] -1 points by yobstreet (-575) 2 years ago

I'm voting strictly character and performance - issues since they are not even discussed, mean nothing at all.

[-] -1 points by Justoneof99 (80) 2 years ago

Obama's talk is drown out by his record of failure. He could get away with it 4 years ago; not now.

[-] 2 points by bensdad (8977) 2 years ago

tell that to a GM employee or Lilly Leadbetter or binladen

[-] -1 points by hchc (3297) from Tampa, FL 2 years ago

The people still fall for this garbage. The establishment won. The american people lost.

Once the election are over, and all the same clowns are in charge, and the economy plunges back into recession, maybe then all the Democrat and Republican hacks will wake up.

Or maybe they will just keep blaming and denying.

[-] 1 points by WSmith (1866) from Cornelius, OR 2 years ago

Yes, the worlds does go on while you scream at the wind.

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[+] -4 points by WeThePeop (-259) 2 years ago

I would not take any stock in what Chris Matthews says about anything. He probably has a couple of obama blowup dolls that he sleeps with every night

[-] 4 points by WSmith (1866) from Cornelius, OR 2 years ago

And Rush has fresh bags of live children he sleeps on every night.

[-] 1 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 2 years ago

a living debate about who's meaner

the walls came down - the call

[-] 1 points by WSmith (1866) from Cornelius, OR 2 years ago

fresh snacks and sex too

fresh flesh - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x4yPyGmLuZ4