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Forum Post: A legal defense for murder of members of the financial elite

Posted 10 years ago on Aug. 12, 2013, 1:34 a.m. EST by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB
This content is user submitted and not an official statement

http://occupywallst.org/forum/it-may-perhaps-be-a-bit-late/#comment-991075

Don't get me wrong. Do not take this out of context. I'm not planning anything illegal.

Some very rational, sane men likely see a need to exterminate some people who can be characterized as puppets, as well as the power/financial elite who pull their strings. This is not about revenge, but self-preservation and protection of a dying world.

Damn, I was going to say more but got called away. This is probably a good time to comment anyway, as I've said enough. Well, almost enough: In past revolutions that led to greater good and prosperity, when murder was the only solution, do they have a defense or justification?

Back..

I'm not trying to instigate anything. What you need to understand is that no one deserves to die. People are sick. It's something that can be corrected, and these horrible monsters can feel sincere regret, like a normal person does.

Another point to make is that I should be worried about my family for speaking so controversially, knowing the power and reach the elite have. But I'm not, because knowing what I know about the mayhem of the elite and the not-so-distant future of our finite planet, they are as good as dead already. I, as a rational human being, should be protecting the future of my kids' kids.

Not only that, we need to protect the people we hate, as the modern rational human beings we are. We should be protecting the elite by anticipating their assassination.

I was inspired to post this after listening to a David Suzuki podcast I downloaded from Alternative Radio (95 minute show was called Nature of Things), while driving home from my grandma's 95th birthday today. I listened to it three times in a row (bringing my total to around 10). Then, while washing dishes I watched Breaking Inequality again.

The elite are going to get it. It's just a matter of time, and we should be organizing to protect them. At the same time, we should plan the trials of their murderers. So far as I can tell, the elite should have known what was coming, including the severity and consequences of their own crimes. Should murderers be punished for defending the indefensible, if the indefensible is nature and the 99%?

Final point: The elite and their puppets need to withdraw from business, reject all future income from anywhere, and repent, to save their own souls from true justice, so rational people do not have to become murderers.

32 Comments

32 Comments


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[-] 3 points by JPB950 (2254) 10 years ago

The solution doesn't involve killing anyone. If there are lives put in jeopardy they have been placed there by a public that doesn't bother to get informed or involved. The system was handed to these elites by an ignorant public.

Which brings up another critical point. If you can't educate the 99% and keep them engaged in the process of governing themselves, you will simply change from one elite group of masters to another.

[-] 2 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 10 years ago

I hope you're right, that the solution doesn't involve killing, but with your two points I couldn't disagree more.

If the 99% had the power, that is not in the definition of elite.

The elite got there by killing and taking power by trickery and force. You think your goldfish is in its bowl because it's ignorant or chose that destiny?

[-] 5 points by JPB950 (2254) 10 years ago

The 99% don't have any power because they have given it away. They traded their votes for a few dollars slipped to their home district for some pork barrel project and closed their eyes to their representative's corruption.

A few frustrated individuals may foolishly resort to violence at some point, but they are not seen by the 99% as working in their interest and will likely not get much support from a population that neither knows nor cares what is going on in their world.

You're seeing all this from the perspective of an informed activist. The focus needs to be on the public, the majority of whom are completely uninformed. If you can't wake them up and get them to engage nothing will ever really change.

[-] 5 points by TropicalDepression (-45) 10 years ago

Numbers matter. Truth.

[-] 3 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 10 years ago

And I say the power has been taken and kept from the 99%. The strategy of the elite has been formulated and improved for many centuries. They know how to keep people down, by dumbing them down and complicating things. They instill a fear (homelessness, poverty, etc), to keep people working their lives away. They transfer wealth to themselves on purpose. This cannot be denied, can it?

I do not want murder, but I do not want to see a hero punished if their actions are right. I'm not the one to decide who should die or what consequences should follow. That's for the justice system to determine.

I'm may also be friends with potential "targets" (I'm not), in which case, I don't want to harm to come to them for being sick/poisoned in the head.

This thread has more to it than meets the eye. I don't think it will increase the chances of murder. But it does help us realize how likely it is and could subconsciously cause a positive ripple action.

My friends will tell you I'm extremely nonviolent.

Funny story, my 2 year old daughter stepped on an ant and said "sorry ant, I didn't mean to kill you." She tries to avoid stepping on them. Makes me very proud.

It's not me society needs to worry about.

[-] 4 points by JPB950 (2254) 10 years ago

I honestly don't believe the vast majority of the country see things the way you do. If they see an elite at all, they see a group they elected and then walked away leaving the country to run on "autopilot". It doesn't matter what the motivation is. The point is those that say they represent the 99% actually are working without the knowledge or consent of that group. That may be noble but unless you can get the people to believe that there even is a problem any action is pointless.

The first action has to be convincing a majority of the general population there is actually a problem. Remember as bad as things are, the majority haven't had their house foreclosed on, a majority work and live day-to-day in relative comfort. They are the ones you need to wake up if you want change. Any violent action, any action at all actually, won't have their support if the majority don't even acknowledge there is a problem in the first place.

[-] 4 points by LeoYo (5909) 10 years ago

The key would be to appeal to a nation of complacent consumers in how the successful support for a national campaign would result in saving them money on their major expenses.

[-] 2 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 10 years ago

Right, the majority need to be convinced somehow. If everyone saw things the way we do, there wouldn't be an issue.

[-] 1 points by JPB950 (2254) 10 years ago

Exactly! The elites would not be in power and can not stay in power without the acquiescence of the majority. An ignorant population are not likely to accept your view employing a defense of "self defense" when they don't even see a threat.

[-] 2 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 10 years ago

Ha! First video of the night and look what it was. Gift from the universe or totally coincidence?

http://filmsforaction.com/watch/conspiracy_to_tell_the_truth_interview_with_lance_dehavensmith/

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[-] 0 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 10 years ago

Danger: by endangering freedom, nature, well-being of anything, and happiness of humans, for personal gain, to such an extent that your identity is revealed as an enemy of the 99%, you may experience symptoms of severe death.

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[-] 0 points by stevebol (1269) from Milwaukee, WI 10 years ago

"Should murderers be punished for defending the indefensible, if the indefensible is nature and the 99%?"

Yes.

[-] -2 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 10 years ago

By defending, I'm talking about saving life.

What if there was no other way to prevent the rape and killing of your indefensible daughter? The murderer is actually a hero in this case, no?

What if you knew that a series of events were to lead to the end of your life? What if it was a fact that the only way to save millions of lives, you had to murder someone? What if this person was otherwise unstoppable, and fully aware of the consequences of their actions?

[-] 2 points by Renneye (3874) 10 years ago

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[-] -2 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 10 years ago

I have that movie on VHS but never watched it. I think. What's the significance?

[-] 3 points by Renneye (3874) 10 years ago

It's tempting to tell, but I'd wreck it for you...and it's a really good film. It's worth the watch. You'll know instantly why it fits your thread.

The Dead Zone ~ Official Trailer.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lmC5oPc7L3M

Director: David Cronenberg

Writers: Stephen King, Jeffrey Boam

Cast: Christopher Walken, Brooke Adams, Tom Skerritt, Herbert Lom, Anthony Zerbe, Colleen Dewhurst, Martin Sheen

"Plot: Teacher Johnny Smith (Christopher Walken) gets in a horrible accident which forces him into a coma for five years. Once Johnny wakes up, he discovers he has the ability to read a person's life just by making physical contact with them. When the local police find out about Johnny's "powers", they bring him in on a murder case. Soon Johnny's abilities gets him into more trouble then he may be able to handle."

Genre: Sci-Fi | Thriller

[-] -2 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 10 years ago

I really should see it. Been putting it off for like 20 years!

[-] 3 points by Renneye (3874) 10 years ago

I know, eh! Since 1983! Lol! I'm being rather presumptuous here, but, you may be the only one in our age group who hasn't seen it!

[-] -2 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 10 years ago

You might be right!

[-] 1 points by stevebol (1269) from Milwaukee, WI 10 years ago

It's a good flick. Might be off topic but who cares.

[-] 0 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 10 years ago

I imagine it may be significant, like if the guy kills someone to save another. I better watch it before guessing though!

[-] 0 points by MattLHolck (16833) from San Diego, CA 10 years ago

if every citizens received a base income

to buy good and services from entrepreneurs

the profit motive would be directly connected to serving the people

that money flow can be taxed out of the pools that collects it

so money keeps its value

[-] -3 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 10 years ago

Not sure what you're getting at. Is it on topic?

[-] -3 points by stevebol (1269) from Milwaukee, WI 10 years ago

I don't know. I think it's unhealthy to speculate about that kind of thing. Ending people's careers or locking them up is pretty effective in getting people to change their ways. I believe in the penal system and luckily I haven't been locked up for more than about 5 days total. That was 3 different occasions.

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[-] -1 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 10 years ago

Pretty tough to lock up the people who own and build prisons for profit. Bankers are a little bit above the law, aren't they? Economic problems aren't accidental. Getting off the gold standard in the 70s was preparation for events of today, and that was planned before the Fed was created. This isn't an experiment. The outcome of their plan is not unknown to them. Certain bankers and their fathers are not innocent of crimes such as murder (there is evidence). Certain untouchable elite pull the strings that lead to murder of presidents. Killing them and their puppets surely isn't a crime, but rather a duty, is what rational patriots might argue.

Wow, this sounds so radical. Yet is it not a reasonable course of action? I still think that if a person was truly rational (based on tests, not "sick"), it's no longer "murder" but an act of duty, as sworn to in an oath.

I ain't going to plan or instigate murder, but what if my friend did? I would feel really shitty to see someone I care about, a most honorable individual, go to prison for protecting my family and world.

[-] -3 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 10 years ago

updated.

[-] -1 points by Kavatz (464) from Edmonton, AB 10 years ago

Ooh, someone was not pleased that I typed "updated". What a hero that silent genius is.

So... too much? Controversial enough?

[-] 1 points by TropicalDepression (-45) 10 years ago

haha

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